NBA 2016-17 Season Thread - Knicks in 6

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Pigbenis

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Lolol Lebron back in the finals, suck it you cuck betas. Maybe he'll take his talents to your team next year so you too can enjoy playoff basketball.
 
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Gaige

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So what is worse? Losing in the Finals like LeBron or losing in the first round like MJ?

Jordan didn't advance to the Finals his first 6 years. Losing in the 1st round three times (including a sweep) and in the 2nd once and ECF twice. It took them drafting Grant and Pippen for them to get out of the first round.

LeBron has lost 4x pre Finals (three second round and once in ECF) 4x in the Finals.

5 reasons Michael Jordan's perfect 6-for-6 Finals record is overrated | FOX Sports
 
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Merrith

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So what is worse? Losing in the Finals like LeBron or losing in the first round like MJ?

Jordan didn't advance to the Finals his first 6 years. Losing in the 1st round three times (including a sweep) and in the 2nd once and ECF twice. It took them drafting Grant and Pippen for them to get out of the first round.

LeBron has lost 4x pre Finals (three second round and once in ECF) 4x in the Finals.

5 reasons Michael Jordan's perfect 6-for-6 Finals record is overrated | FOX Sports

Wonder who the Bulls played in those playoff years. His rookie season he gets the Bulls back to the playoffs after having missed it 3 years in a row and lose to the Bucks 3-1 in Round 1. Not great, but hey, playoffs!

Next 5 years they lose to: Celtics, Celtics, Pistons, Pistons, Pistons...that list looks similar to something. What could it be? Oh right, it's the list of Eastern Conference Champions from '86 playoffs through the '90 playoffs. The Celtics twice at the end of their 4 years straight going to the Finals, and the Pistons all 3 years of them going 3 years straight to the Finals. Celtics won 2 of those Finals, and lost the other two to the Lakers...Pistons also won 2, and the Finals they lost was against...who would have guessed it, the Lakers.

So basically he gets them back to the playoffs his rookie year, then proceeds to be up against 2 different dynasties for 5 straight years. The year after that, they stomp the Pistons' dynasty into history with a 4-0 sweep.

Yes, drafting other guys helped, but lets not overlook their competition. East has been fairly weak for most of Lebron's career.
 

Gaige

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Good thing LeBron hasn't lost to the East very much.

He lost in 7 to the Big 3 who won the title in 2008, he lost to the Magic who went to the Finals. He lost to the Celtics Big 3 again who went to the finals in 2010. So three straight years he lost to the East team that went to the Finals, once he lost to the eventual champs.

Speaking of playing dynasties LeBron faced the Spurs dynasty in 07 as a 22 year old, then faced them two more times on the Heat. He also has played this GSW team three straight years. Once with 2 of the big 3 injured. The GSW team that won 73 games and has probably the most talent ever put on a basketball floor.

That Lakers team was the end of showtime and 5 months from Magic retiring with HIV.

Also Jordan never played Akeem's Rockets either.

Oh and Jordan lost to the Magic in 95 in 6 games.

Jordan "dismantled" dynasties after their run. LeBron beat the Warriors and the Spurs in their middle of theirs. Yet another difference.
 

Merrith

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The two times he faced the Spurs with the Heat they were at the end of their run, kinda sad they lost one of those Finals to them. Lol at bringing up Dwight Howard's Magic team. Lebron's 3 straight years playing East champs doesn't even compare to Jordan facing East Champs 5 straight years (with 3 of those years being the eventual NBA champs as well, and all 5 years against legit dynasty's).

I'll agree facing Golden State 3 straight times (although just 2 for now, no idea who wins this coming series) is rough, Jordan's Bulls pretty much killed every West team so bad they didn't come back save the Jazz in their glory days. Rockets should have been good enough to get to Finals when Jordan was around.

'95 a little disingenuous to bring up, Jordan played all of 17 games in that regular season just coming back from his baseball stint. Jordan had it tougher overall in the East in his day, and decimated any team that tried to step up from the West.

Grant/Pippen never did anything without Michael. Lebron had to join a proven winner in Wade to finally get over the hump, and Bosh was more talented than anyone else on the Bulls save Pippen.

For the record Gaige, I think Lebron is a great player in the all time field, and has been the best or co best in the league for almost the entirety of his career. But his legacy just doesn't compare.
 
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Ameraves

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Speaking of playing dynasties LeBron...
Could have put together one of the greatest dynasties ever had he stayed in Cleveland.

Just imagine the praise that we would all be heaping on Lebron had he never bolted to Miami.
 
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Gaige

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See that's the sort of BS I hate. So you're telling me if he stays in Cleveland they still somehow end up with 3 #1 picks or whatever?

Before he left they weren't spending money. They didn't bring in talent and oh ya no one wanted to play in Cleveland.

The only reason they have KI, Thompson and Wiggins (who ended up getting them Love) is because LeBron left and they instantly turned into a 20 win team.

Nothing about how the Cavs were built during that first 7 years makes me believe it would've went different had he stayed.

They would've rode LeBron to 50 or 60 wins seasons, and got tossed in the playoffs.
 

zzeris

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I don't understand why LBJ can't be #2 on the list. I fully admit he's one of the greatest players in history. He fully admits he's no Jordan. There are so many reasons he's not comparable, hasn't had to do as much. Let's run the gigantic list down.

1. Defense- MJ played when defense was real. He played against the toughest, dirtiest team in history. Nobody in the NBA is anything like the old Pistons. Hell, you can't even hand check or touch a player near the 3 point line. Harden constantly shows how ludicrous the idea of NBA defense is today. .

2. Size- MJ at 6'6" 218. LBJ at 6'8" between 250s and 270s. LBJ is the most gifted athlete that has ever played the game. Fast, strong, gigantic, smart. All that during a time when defense is historically bad. MJ isn't the same level of physical specimen. LBJ should be destroying teams like he is. MJ had to work at it. It was far harder(and far sweeter, 6-0!!!).

3. Different styles- LBJ is the more complete teammate. He does it all and is better than MJ at this. MJ was the scorer, the force that moved through people when it wasn't common to do so. LBJ is the complete package. He is an amazing player!

4. Teams- The teams were more balanced then too. No, 2-3 super teams with 3+ superstars on them. LBJ has played on a super team since the Heat and he's on one now. Love is a star and so is Kyrie. MJ had to work within the system and LBJ owns his system. He has far more power than Jordan ever did and has used it to fill his team as much as possible. They have spent more than any other team since LBJ got back. That's no coincidence.

5. Different era- MJ played during the time when players didn't take time off to rest when they felt like it. Games were more violent. Sports science and medicine wasn't as advanced. The game is more about superstars than super teams today. That has an affect.

These are the primary ones I focus on. Just like you can't compare Manning to Marino because defense was hobbled during Manning's career, you really can't compare the eras very well. MJ found ways to win on the biggest stage. You won't find him shitting out 11 point games. LBJ is the total package and the next best thing to MJ. He' s just not the best. Get over it.Kobe went straight from high school to be the closest clone to MJ possible. He still couldn't do it. LBJ is different and shouldn't be compared because he is different. He may get all the stats in the end, but he's no Jordan.

Caveat- If LBJ can beat this Warriors team? Then he might get there above Jordan. You have to win... not play second fiddle.
 
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Gaige

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No he didn't.

Well he should have, he got fucked by the refs. Anyways he won 55 games without Jordan.

This defense shit makes me laugh. He also didn't have to play against zone defense. This is why comparing eras is stupid.

Rest? You're fucking kidding right? Jordan took a year and a half off between title runs ffs.

Also, while Jordan didn't have an 11 point game he did have bad games where he shot below 30% from the field, the difference was instead of deferring to teammates he'd keep shooting in an attempt to get to the foul line increasing his point totals - bevause he was a volume shooter.

Besides, what matters is series losses when they have off games and they both only lost one, albeit LeBron was in the Finals and Jordan's was in the first round.
 
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Merrith

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Besides, what matters is series losses when they have off games and they both only lost one, albeit LeBron was in the Finals and Jordan's was in the first round.

Well, I tend to think what matters is what you did in the Finals more than the rest...but which round one did the Bulls lose because Jordan had an off game? Only times Bulls and Jordan lost in the 1st round was the first 3 years of his career, his first season he was a rookie against the Bucks, and the next two were against the Celtics dynasty. Bulls finished 7th, 8th, and 8th in the East during those seasons. After that they never lost in the 1st round during the Jordan era.
 

Gaige

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See that is what I don't get. Why is losing in the Finals worse than not getting there?
 

Ambiturner

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See that is what I don't get. Why is losing in the Finals worse than not getting there?

It shows Lebron just plays in a shitty conference and has a cake walk to the finals every year. He's too much of a cowardly bitch to ever leave the East
 
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Pigbenis

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If you look at them both at age 32 Lebron and Jordan both have 3 rings, but Lebron has 4 more Finals appearances. Lebron has 4 MVPs Mike had 3. Not to mention the whole 7 straight Finals thing lol
 
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