Bitcoins/Litecoins/Virtual Currencies

Caliane · Feb 5, 2021

Rajaah said:
Just want to quote the first post on this thread, from the beginning of 2013.

$17.40 for a Bitcoin.

...........sigh.

Anyway, is Ethereum still a good bet? Seems like it has a much higher ceiling for growth than BTC due to the lower value at this time. Wanted to buy some last week during the Great Meme Stonk War but I didn't get around to it. Since then it's gone from like $1100 to $1600 or something like that. Are we on a crescendo/spike or is it still a good time to buy in?

I've got quite a bit of BTC at this point and it's been serving me well, but I'd like to diversify.

Also wondering if there's a better option to get into than ETH that I don't know about. Mana looks really interesting and I could see it taking off.

I think ETh is still a very good bet.

I'd expect $2k to be the next resistance point. mostly just based on round numbers though.

Deeper however, I think even $2k is just a stepping stone. And Eth will continue to rise of the next couple years, dramatically.

BTC and Eth are tied, and rise/fall together. This has been the case in the past. But frankly, I don't see a reason to think this will continue into the future indefinitely.
They are linked because they are #1 and #2. The first thing I did when I bought crypto was.. Buy BTC and Eth without really understanding either. They were simply #1 and #2, and I didn't want to put all my eggs in one basket. I'm fairly certain, THAT is basically the entire reason they are linked. new investors trying to keep some diversity. BTC is #1 as far as I can tell, for that same reason. its more famous.
Notoriety is a powerful force. and its entirely possible it could maintain the lead for that reason..

however, look at this shit. top 63 DeFi apps. (decentralized finance)

DeFi Pulse

Your source for following the DeFi stories of the moment. DeFi Pulse is real-time, blunt, and everything you need to stay in the know.

defipulse.com

#31 Lightning network running on BTC blockchain. nice.
... Every single other one is running on Ethereum.

CryptoFees.info

There's tons of crypto projects. Which ones are people actually paying to use?

cryptofees.info

as it says, crypto projects people are actually paying to use.
All the pink apps? run on Ethereum.

I look at that, and can only come to the conclusion. BTC is overvalued, and Eth is massively undervalued.
BTC currently has 3.6x the marketcap of Eth. If it was based on actual use, Eth should have a marketcap of like 95x of BTC.

Note Aave and compound in those lists. possibly maker as well.
(then go look at them in alltime timelines in the exchange you use. those 3 are seeing insane gains.)

I think there will be a point where Eth will decouple. its very obviously crushing BTC in actual use. then there's staking advantage, ecological advantage, etc..
Although it does need to be noted, Eth is not quite as constrained in volume. Eth will never hit the same $ per coin. (without BTC crashing entirely)
Sure years ago, going into them even made sense. but over the years, Eth has grown and put into use. BTC has not. Its only a matter of time people notice this.

Potential crashes. the higher the marketcap the less likely of giant dips.

if you want "parabolic" look into Aave, maker and compound as I noted. Those however. gains are so insane, I couldn't even guess if/when they are going to crash.
aave is new. and showing up big time in the apps lists above. so, might be just showing massive adoption, and its 100% here to stay.

Tmac · Feb 5, 2021

Caliane said:
I think ETh is still a very good bet.

I'd expect $2k to be the next resistance point. mostly just based on round numbers though.

Deeper however, I think even $2k is just a stepping stone. And Eth will continue to rise of the next couple years, dramatically.

BTC and Eth are tied, and rise/fall together. This has been the case in the past. But frankly, I don't see a reason to think this will continue into the future indefinitely.
They are linked because they are #1 and #2. The first thing I did when I bought crypto was.. Buy BTC and Eth without really understanding either. They were simply #1 and #2, and I didn't want to put all my eggs in one basket. I'm fairly certain, THAT is basically the entire reason they are linked. new investors trying to keep some diversity. BTC is #1 as far as I can tell, for that same reason. its more famous.
Notoriety is a powerful force. and its entirely possible it could maintain the lead for that reason..

however, look at this shit. top 63 DeFi apps. (decentralized finance)

DeFi Pulse

Your source for following the DeFi stories of the moment. DeFi Pulse is real-time, blunt, and everything you need to stay in the know.

defipulse.com

#31 Lightning network running on BTC blockchain. nice.
... Every single other one is running on Ethereum.

CryptoFees.info

There's tons of crypto projects. Which ones are people actually paying to use?

cryptofees.info

as it says, crypto projects people are actually paying to use.
All the pink apps? run on Ethereum.

I look at that, and can only come to the conclusion. BTC is overvalued, and Eth is massively undervalued.
BTC currently has 3.6x the marketcap of Eth. If it was based on actual use, Eth should have a marketcap of like 95x of BTC.

Note Aave and compound in those lists. possibly maker as well.
(then go look at them in alltime timelines in the exchange you use. those 3 are seeing insane gains.)

I think there will be a point where Eth will decouple. its very obviously crushing BTC in actual use. then there's staking advantage, ecological advantage, etc..
Although it does need to be noted, Eth is not quite as constrained in volume. Eth will never hit the same $ per coin. (without BTC crashing entirely)
Sure years ago, going into them even made sense. but over the years, Eth has grown and put into use. BTC has not. Its only a matter of time people notice this.

Potential crashes. the higher the marketcap the less likely of giant dips.

I disagree w your analysis. You’re assuming the utility of BTC and ETH are equal and say BTC is overvalued bc it is being used less as an infrastructure.

BTC isn’t meant to be used as infrastructure, while ETH is meant to be used as infrastructure.

BTC is designed to grow at a guaranteed rate until growth equals zero. It’s meant to store value, like gold.

I don’t actually understand ETH as completely, but afaik it is designed to be a framework for communication, not as a store of value like BTC.

I think they’re linked bc they’re both first to market solutions for their specific purposes.

pharmakos · Feb 5, 2021

2/4 was a bust but I'm pretty sure Elon is going to keep pumping up Doge every time it dips.

So yeah buy the next dip and wait for him to tweet then sell lol.

Should last awhile til he gets bored

Flobee · Feb 5, 2021

As an analogy, Bitcoin is the layer 1 solution. It optimizes for security and store of value. It is the perfect reserve currency (I buy this meme, it has yet to be proven though).

Everything else is currently competing to innovate on layer 2+. If you understand the OSI model this will make sense to you.

Nothing competes with Bitcoin. It is either digital gold, or worthless. Let me be clear, it is either the MOST valuable thing in the world, or its worthless.

All other solutions are a gamble. I like a lot of them, I own them, they don't compete with Bitcoin. They won't have the same value, not even close. If you think Bitcoin is over-valued you either don't believe that it can achieve its goal, or you don't understand what it is. The only provably scarce asset in existence.

While its certainly possible that a network like Ethereum becomes the defacto layer 2 in crypto it isn't a guarantee. Bitcoin's network is capable of doing almost everything that Ethereum currently does, but it will develop much much slower due to the constraints imposed by what it optimizes for. You can look into the origins of ETH and see that this is exactly why Vitalik created Ethereum. Bitcoiners weren't willing to let him clog up the blockspace with smart contract traffic. ETH was born as a playground for innovation.

Mario Speedwagon · Feb 5, 2021

Tmac said:
I don’t actually understand ETH as completely, but afaik it is designed to be a framework for communication, not as a store of value like BTC.

ETH is designed to rape you with $100 "gas fees" per transaction. Can't wait until this shitcoin is replaced with something less overtly Jewish.

Torrid · Feb 5, 2021

The entire point of blockchain is to decentralize control. BTC is far and away the most decentralized network. Without decentralization, blockchains are just super inefficient databases. Also I would say that the number one thing to look for is the competence and involvement of the developer community and by that metric BTC also wins.

First mover advantage is also significant. A college kid can make a Twitter clone with more features; that doesn't mean Twitter is going away any time soon. When your network has 600 billion staked into it, the last thing you want to do is add bloat that increases your attack surface area regardless. People have been making bitcoin killers for 10 years and the king is still king. It's a hell of a lot easier to add shit to it when you're in control and nobody uses it, don't need to find consensus with miners all over the world, and don't have to worry about losing peoples' money because lol you can just fork the network and take it back. BTC has successfully warded off attacks from hostile miners and shown that it can upgrade without major disruptions to the network storing hundreds of billions. BTC shields other cryptos because BTC grants confidence to the entire ecosystem. If BTC collapsed, they all would overnight.

BTC also has the most hash power behind it. Other coins have been 51% attacked; the threat is real.

Regarding ETH specifically, If you hold ETH long-term, you're gambling the following: A) that they successfully switch over to proof of stake without major issues B) that they successfully switch over to sharding without major issues C) that the network continues if Vitalik gets hit by a bus D) that another smart contract network doesn't displace ETH before they solve their massive scaling problem E) people don't switch to another smart contract platform because Solidity makes it easy for smart contract authors to shoot themselves in the feet.

ETH's major use case is to make it easy for other coins to exist on top of ETH. Some of these are starting to move to other networks because of the gas cost.

Bitcoin's impending Taproot upgrade will enable more sophisticated smart contracts and improve Lightning. BTC isn't standing still either.

Rangoth · Feb 5, 2021

I am so ignorant to this altcoin shit. I basically invested about 250$ into a bunch of random ones with the long game of maybe one of them will "make it". Overall I am up huge so no complaints, but it is so fucking confusing.

I struggle to understand the real-world "value" these fucking things offer other than(and I am grateful) my bank account increasing. For instance, I read about how these alt-coins exist on the ETH system, but right now it is so fucking expensive to trade/use ETH and BTC(2 of the big 3 players) that I simply do not understand how they could ever be used for daily interaction. Of course even that is assuming the government doesn't come in and crush them.

I feel like until there is a coin that allows me to go to the local bar and order a single beer for 2.50$ and pay for it in coins without a fucking fee larger than the item cost it is all just a gimmick.

Ride the train, don't get me wrong, there is a ton of real-world cash to be made here, but what's the long game with this shit?

Mario Speedwagon · Feb 5, 2021

Rangoth said:
I am so ignorant to this altcoin shit. I basically invested about 250$ into a bunch of random ones with the long game of maybe one of them will "make it". Overall I am up huge so no complaints, but it is so fucking confusing.

I struggle to understand the real-world "value" these fucking things offer other than(and I am grateful) my bank account increasing. For instance, I read about how these alt-coins exist on the ETH system, but right now it is so fucking expensive to trade/use ETH and BTC(2 of the big 3 players) that I simply do not understand how they could ever be used for daily interaction. Of course even that is assuming the government doesn't come in and crush them.

I feel like until there is a coin that allows me to go to the local bar and order a single beer for 2.50$ and pay for it in coins without a fucking fee larger than the item cost it is all just a gimmick.

Ride the train, don't get me wrong, there is a ton of real-world cash to be made here, but what's the long game with this shit?

Don't listen to anyone trying to tell you these coins are currency. None of them function as a currency. You are just playing pretend stocks with real money.

Lumi · Feb 5, 2021

Rangoth said:
Ride the train, don't get me wrong, there is a ton of real-world cash to be made here, but what's the long game with this shit?

Pretty sure it's just paving the way for the one world digital currency that is soon to come when the New World Order is fully established. Which by the looks of things shouldn't be long now.

Rangoth · Feb 5, 2021

Mario Speedwagon I hear you, I really do....but the "overall" market(at least according to coinbase) is literally up about 24%+ daily....like what the fuck?

I would say in general all of the coins are rising, but obviously there are bigger/better players amongst themselves. But this is fucking insane. I am not rich enough to invest thousands or anything, but I think I've turned about 2k into 5k in under a week just by migrating coins around to whatever was the lowest the night before...which for some fucking magical reason blossoms the next day. Rinse and repeat. I leave about 200$ish in each coin in case it is the magical one that blows up. When I say this I am ignoring BTC/ETH/MKR.

I feel like this has to bust soon and I'll be the loser holding 50000 "awesomecoins" that are worth fractions of a penny, but until then I hope to keep making daily what I used to make in about 3 months with stocks.

Flobee · Feb 5, 2021

Rangoth said:
I feel like this has to bust soon and I'll be the loser holding 50000 "awesomecoins" that are worth fractions of a penny, but until then I hope to keep making daily what I used to make in about 3 months with stocks.

BTC probably gunna run now. Alts will bleed, they always do

Rangoth · Feb 5, 2021

Flobee said:
BTC probably gunna run now. Alts will bleed, they always do

I know the day is coming for sure. That's why I have a max of about 2k in them any given day. As I said above I basically swap the money from coin A to coin B every day-3 depending on swing. I keep the profit and reinvest the original money. Thus far it's been awesome! If I can keep this up for another 2-3 weeks I'll have hit the point where if whatever coin I swap to going to zero would still have been a profit overall.

I also have 2.67something BTC, but that's shit I've had forever. Not an investor at that level. I'm basically squatting until they hit 100k+ and I figured I'd just pay off my house.

Basically alt-coins are nuts though. I'd bet with 500$ you could turn that into 5k in less than a month without even trying to hard. Some of them move fucking 50% a day! I don't even understand that. When they drop it's only like 10%, so if you hold for another day it's back up 30%. Maybe this is the year of the crypto or some shit. Again I am no expert but the numbers are nuts.

Seriously, this is the last month....over 23 coins are up over 100% in one month. It's almost retard proof for fucks sake. FYI that is not my investments, just the market snapshot. Seems screenshot fucked up, but just goto coinbase and look

View attachment 333346

Brad · Feb 6, 2021

And back to above 40K

Hope it heads to the next above support level wherever that is lol

Caliane · Feb 6, 2021

Lumi said:
Pretty sure it's just paving the way for the one world digital currency that is soon to come when the New World Order is fully established. Which by the looks of things shouldn't be long now.

Thats kindof the joke on this...
Half the libertarians, and conspiracy theorists are insisting the New World Order are going to try forcing us over to a digital currency, and away from cash... but, digital currency is also like 90% Libertarians, focusing on decentralization, anonymity, etc. Look at India.

There is something inherently contradictory there..

The banks, and countries will for sure try to make their own, and control them, granted. But the cat is probably out of the bag for most of the DeFi. good luck stopping the peer to peer transactions.

Lambourne · Feb 6, 2021

It's easy to find reasons for crpyto booming.

-Zero/negative interest rates on savings accounts
-Potential for high fiat currency inflation
-NWO type shenanigans
-Manipulation. Even Wall Street is still manipulated and there is way more oversight, regulation and paper trails there
-Various criminal activities like black market trade and money laundering
-If you look at mining pool stats you'll see that a huge share of the actual mining happens in China. You could call it financial warfare but there's also a legit business model there, making shit and selling it to the rest of the world is what they do. it's no less legit than paying people to farm WoW gold or making useless plastic shit for neckbeards to collect.
-Sheer hype and FOMO.

All of the above can be true at the same time. In the end everything is worth what someone will pay for it.

Fogel · Feb 6, 2021

Oh they will certainly try to take over this thing, in fact they already are

Kharzette · Feb 6, 2021

Doge is already back up above the "event" price.

Khane · Feb 6, 2021

So Wall Street owns about 6% of BTC. How much do we think China owns? 20%?

Arden · Feb 6, 2021

Kharzette said:
Doge is already back up above the "event" price.

Yeah... Elon and even Gene Simmons have been pushing doge and it's keeping it steady and even bumping it a little. I'm guessing when they stop pushing it will dip.

I keep making money hand over fist every time I buy doge so I'm thinking about investing again at the next dip. Still doesn't make sense though. I guess it doesn't have to lol. I'm now thinking I should stop unloading 100% of my doge every time it peaks. Maybe I should hold on to a portion of it in case it does really catch on.

Arden · Feb 6, 2021

Khane said:
So Wall Street owns about 6% of BTC. How much do we think China owns? 20%?

Ok, here's a question for the crypto guys- if we assume China goes all in on crypto and it blows up, which crypto should we be investing in? BTC?

Bitcoins/Litecoins/Virtual Currencies

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