Bitcoins/Litecoins/Virtual Currencies

Rajaah · Aug 26, 2021

Lightning Lord Rule said:
It is, but not any riskier than holding IMO. I think the trap is to think of it in terms of $ earned. Think more in terms of ETH earned, since ETH is basically the base you're going off of. In other words, the value of ETH in $ terms might go up and down -same with TRU- but as long as the value of TRU to ETH stays in a decent range, you're making money as long as there is trading volume which is generating fees. It's basically like turbo-charged interest rates IMO, or at least that's the mindset I take to make it make sense to me.

Plug some numbers into this Flipside: Uniswap V3 Fee Calculator and see what kind of money you can make given a $ amount pooled (risked). If you're ahead of the transfer fees, you're making money since the up and down in relation to the dollar is going to happen regardless.

I think I plugged in my ETH/TRU numbers right and got a 24hr income of about $270 with "1% fee" and $85 with "0.3% fee"

...does that mean I'd make one of those in ETH on the average day if I got into this LP game? Because damn, I'd go for that. Even the measily $85 a day of additional ETH would be awesome.

Rajaah · Aug 26, 2021

Flobee said:
I use Blockfi's BTC back card now. Was pretty early on the waiting list so among the first to grab it. So far so good. Its nice getting "cash back" in a form of points that will appreciate in value rather than depreciate in the way that airline miles will for example. Also provides additional APR on stablecoin holdings with the platform.

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Fold is also quite popular but I was looking for a line of credit with BTC back and fold is a Debit card.

I've got a BlockFi account and I was planning to load it up with Bitcoin. However I waited too long to get around to it and now the value of BTC is up 50% from where it was when I initially had the idea, so I'm holding off for now. Seems like BlockFi has a lot of advantageous components to it, especially the high interest accrual rates.

Flobee · Aug 26, 2021

Rajaah said:
I've got a BlockFi account and I was planning to load it up with Bitcoin. However I waited too long to get around to it and now the value of BTC is up 50% from where it was when I initially had the idea, so I'm holding off for now. Seems like BlockFi has a lot of advantageous components to it, especially the high interest accrual rates.

Yea, their rates for BTC have gone down quite a bit as well. Personally, I'm not comfortable holding my BTC with a custodian. Not your keys, not your coins. I am however comfortable with stablecoins holdings as I feel that the laws surrounding cash deposits are much more clear and a 6102 style event would not be relevant. My plan is basically to withdrawal my earned BTC quarterly and the APR on it is just gravy.

7.5% APR on cash + whatever the bonus is for the card (1.5%? I can't find it right now) is nothing to sneeze at compared to traditional market. You can earn more on Defi sure, but you're taking protocol + platform risks

Intrinsic · Aug 26, 2021

Rajaah said:
I think I plugged in my ETH/TRU numbers right and got a 24hr income of about $270 with "1% fee" and $85 with "0.3% fee"

...does that mean I'd make one of those in ETH on the average day if I got into this LP game? Because damn, I'd go for that. Even the measily $85 a day of additional ETH would be awesome.

Not necessarily. It is only a simulation or estimate. It is highly dependent on the trading and windows you set up and the ratios of things moving within them. Having said that it maybe isn't 100% accurate but it also isn't 100% crap. I mean "it depends" is a legit answer.

You also have to factor in gas fees for adding / removing liquidity as well as gas fees for removing your collected fee. So not all of those gains are realized.

Your liquidity will shift depending on the current situation. So you may go in with a 50/50 split of ETH:TRU in your LP. While you're collecting your $100 a day in some ration of ETH:TRU your LP could slowly be shifting to 100% TRU. When you remove your liquidity you're now removing 100% TRU and 0% ETH.

It is an interesting game and so far has been consistent for me. Currently my total LP value is down $500 again, but I'm still collecting fees b/c my target is in range. I will say those fees have decreased quite a bit the last few days. I'll let it sit here for a few more days and maybe get back up to even on my LP (in total $$ not even back to a 50/50 ETH:TRU split), then may consider pulling my liquidity and adding another range.

If you look at the "prices last 5 days" you can see the window it has been trading within. I really need to change my bounds to a higher range but don't want to eat away at my gains by paying gas fees to move stuff around.

TJT · Aug 27, 2021

I'm all for throwing down a retarded $100 yolo "investment" on NFTs but it looks like I am buying stupid-ass Deviant Art from 2003 on OpeanSea.

lol

Flobee · Aug 27, 2021

Agree or disagree below was a useful conversation around the ramifications of EIP-1559. Worth a listen if you're holding ETH.

TL: DW - Fee burning increases gas floor and has winners and losers. All technical changes on a blockchain are inherently political and the "tyranny of structurelessness" obfuscates who holds power over the system. 1559 probably good for you if you hold ETH now, maybe bad for the system over time.

James · Aug 27, 2021

It wasn't useful whatsoever, there's no way you can determine that EIP-1559 has lead to a structural increase in gas price as opposed to gas prices being higher because of the absolutely massive NFT bullrun going on right now. BASEFEE is a much more efficient gas price regime than bidding, you'd have to be an idiot to think otherwise.

Flobee · Aug 27, 2021

James said:
you'd have to be an idiot to think otherwise.

The only argument

James ever makes.

Basefee literally creates a minimum fee. Its in the name man. Your arguments about efficiency could be true, I've heard the same. It doesn't change anything about what is being stated. The discussion is around how fees are structured, not current fees. 1559 creating a deflationary environment for ETH price also effects the usability of the chain in the sense that increasing ETH price will drive up USD cost of transactions, effecting the actually affordability of using L1. Combine that with an increased fee floor and you're disincentivising actual use of the chain. PoS will likely significantly decrease fees, but PoS got delayed again so its worth talking about the current environment.

Tmac · Aug 27, 2021

Flobee said:
The only argument James ever makes.

Yeah, the bad part about James posting is that you never get any explanation to go along w the ad hominems lol.

James · Aug 27, 2021

Flobee said:
Basefee literally creates a minimum fee. Its in the name man.

Of course I'm going to call you an idiot when you bring bullshit ass arguments like this to the thread, after having already discussed ad nauseum what EIP-1559 actually does and having had several discussions about blockspace supply and demand. This quote is so fucking stupid, what else am I supposed to say to it? Do some fucking research.

By the way, the Ethereum UX has increased like 100x at least since EIP-1559. I haven't run into out of gas issues once, and my transactions are all confirmed very quickly. Exactly what I've been saying was going to happen for months now.

Arden · Aug 27, 2021

TJT said:
I'm all for throwing down a retarded $100 yolo "investment" on NFTs but it looks like I am buying stupid-ass Deviant Art from 2003 on OpeanSea.

lol

I'd say "well, that's all you get for $100," but apparently that's all you get for $100,000 too...

James · Aug 27, 2021

IMO Ciphersquares is the coolest NFT out there right now. Curio Cards is probably the best investment you can make, Christie's auction for a full set on October 1st. But after that, Ciphersquares is super slept on right now, and they're pretty baller looking + give you free mints on all future projects by the team, one of which is releasing this weekend/next week.

Haus · Aug 27, 2021

James said:
It wasn't useful whatsoever, there's no way you can determine that EIP-1559 has lead to a structural increase in gas price as opposed to gas prices being higher because of the absolutely massive NFT bullrun going on right now. BASEFEE is a much more efficient gas price regime than bidding, you'd have to be an idiot to think otherwise.

You can go on TXstreet and it graphically represents where the bulk of ETH transactions are coming from and yesterday I watched as in the evening it was something like 80% from Opensea... So I can confirm this assertion.

Sucks because I have a tiny position I want to bridge over to Polygon but right now the transaction fee makes me consider it unviable to move.

Caliane · Aug 27, 2021

TJT said:
I'm all for throwing down a retarded $100 yolo "investment" on NFTs but it looks like I am buying stupid-ass Deviant Art from 2003 on OpeanSea.

lol

yeah. I get NFT's as an idea and tech make alot of sense. But.. I fail to see how nfts of these shitty .jpgs have any value. why are you paying 100k for a steam trading card?

Haus · Aug 27, 2021

Caliane said:
yeah. I get NFT's as an idea and tech make alot of sense. But.. I fail to see how nfts of these shitty .jpgs have any value. why are you paying 100k for a steam trading card?

Yeah, I covered a little of it in a post a ways back. Right now you're seeing a fad/fomo market run play out. In the long run as NFTs get associated with real world items, or digital subscriptions, or digital access to things.. Then you'll see the "real" use for NFTs. If you saw Ready Player One think about the in-game mall they shopped in, all those items (like the Zmeckis cube) were essentially NFTs.

Flobee · Aug 27, 2021

James said:
By the way, the Ethereum UX has increased like 100x at least since EIP-1559. I haven't run into out of gas issues once, and my transactions are all confirmed very quickly. Exactly what I've been saying was going to happen for months now.

The issues discussed are long term not short term. Your experience in the past week is not reflective of how a shift in monetary policy will affect the protocol over time. Rising ETH price combined with rising price floor on transactions is not a recipe for increased usability. This is the effect EIP-1559 will have, with the tradeoff being dampened gas volatility thus better predictability for wallets. You're obviously not going to see the effect from a rising floor during a high demand period. If you weren't so quick to call everyone retarded maybe you'd take the time to listen to what we're actually saying.

Dampening volatility will decrease gas fee in high traffic times, and increase fees in low traffic times. The concern is around the floor raised during low traffic times. Anecdotes during the first weeks of the change during a bull market are irrelevant.

James · Aug 27, 2021

Flobee said:
Rising ETH price combined with rising price floor on transactions is not a recipe for increased usability.

What the FUCK is the difference between that and BTC going up in price?

Flobee said:
Dampening volatility will decrease gas fee in high traffic times, and increase fees in low traffic times.

EIP-1559 does NOT increase the minimum fee necessary to be included in a block, period. There is literally zero explanation anywhere for why it would, this is some shit you stupid fucking Bitcoiners have pulled out of your ass as if it makes sense.

Flobee · Aug 27, 2021

James said:
What the FUCK is the difference between that and BTC going up in price?

EIP-1559 does NOT increase the minimum fee necessary to be included in a block, period. There is literally zero explanation anywhere for why it would, this is some shit you stupid fucking Bitcoiners have pulled out of your ass as if it makes sense.

Bitcoin transactions are significantly smaller and simpler than ETH transactions. L2 for Bitcoin is fully functional and most small transaction are already off-chain.

It really isn't very complicated. Volatility in price will tighten and as such the floor and ceiling get closer together. This lowers the highest fees and raises the lowest fees. That raises the gas floor. Not sure what is blowing your mind about this concept, its quite clear in how the EIP was designed that this would happen. The whole point is that raising the price floor + increasing the price of the asset needed to commit transactions... on a blockchain that is designed 100% around its complex transactions is a losing strategy long term. You're eventually pricing users out of your network. Scaling can fix this of course, but they keep delaying their scaling solutions.

This whole explanation could have been avoided if you actually listened to the video instead of spewing about what you think it said.

James · Aug 27, 2021

Flobee said:
It really isn't very complicated. Volatility in price will tighten and as such the floor and ceiling get closer together. This lowers the highest fees and raises the lowest fees.

This is the dumbest shit you've written yet. There is no reason why eliminating individual gas bids would increase the price floor. Your entire thesis is invalid, it makes zero sense. Go back to the drawing board.

Flobee · Aug 27, 2021

James said:
This is the dumbest shit you've written yet. There is no reason why eliminating individual gas bids would increase the price floor. Your entire thesis is invalid, it makes zero sense. Go back to the drawing board.

Replacing the auction system with a sliding base fee that moves according to used blockspace effectively dampens fee volatility. Thats the entire point of the move, to create a more predictable gas market. Dampening volatility by definition tightens the space between minimum and maximum. I'm accurately describing what the change actually does. "You're dumb and wrong" is not a valid counter argument.

As usual you have nothing to actually say because you don't understand what you're talking about. You're all hot air

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