Bitcoins/Litecoins/Virtual Currencies

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Mist

Mist

REEEEeyore
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Do you guys not have your money in banks? Unless you have 0 fiat currency and 0 assets whose value is based in fiat currency, you definitely do not want the collapse of the dollar.

For all the trash talking of central banking and the Fed, the Fed has kept the value of the dollar relatively stable despite near 40+ years of terrible leadership and reckless spending + money printing.
Mist said:
Kinda wanna buy back into ETHE at this price.

View attachment 376904
Click to expand...

Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
 
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Tmac

Tmac

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Mist said:
Do you guys not have your money in banks? Unless you have 0 fiat currency and 0 assets whose value is based in fiat currency, you definitely do not want the collapse of the dollar.

For all the trash talking of central banking and the Fed, the Fed has kept the value of the dollar relatively stable despite near 40+ years of terrible leadership and reckless spending + money printing.


Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
Click to expand...

You’ve lost $13k of buying power this year alone due to inflation. Someone check my maths.

So, it’s definitely not helping you and arguably hurting you by having that much cash not growing over and above the rate of inflation.
 
Mist

Mist

REEEEeyore
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Tmac said:
this year alone due to inflation.
Click to expand...
And that's the problem, you're looking at this year alone in a vacuum, as opposed to the previous 12 where inflation was extremely low for a sustained period by any historical standards.

A global pandemic is going to cause some blips in the graph. Averaged out over the past 13 years it's no big deal.
 
Tmac

Tmac

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Mist said:
And that's the problem, you're looking at this year alone in a vacuum, as opposed to the previous 12 where inflation was extremely low for a sustained period by any historical standards.

A global pandemic is going to cause some blips in the graph. Averaged out over the past 13 years it's no big deal.
Click to expand...

My point is that you've actually LOST money at this point by keeping it in a savings account.

That's a big deal.
 
Flobee

Flobee

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Mist said:
Do you guys not have your money in banks? Unless you have 0 fiat currency and 0 assets whose value is based in fiat currency, you definitely do not want the collapse of the dollar.
Click to expand...
I'm not cheering for the collapse of the traditional system per se. I just believe:

1. Traditional system is unbelievably corrupt. Cantillon effect is being used to buy control of our society (see Blackrock RE purchases, PPP loan distribution, Billionaire farmland purchases, forcing of ESG score on publicly traded companies, etc)
2. Traditional system is on a trajectory to fail no matter what. That decision was made when they bailed out banks in 2008 rather than letting the system crash and correct. (or is 1971 when Gold standard was broken)
3. Bitcoin has the attributes to create a significantly more fair world monetary system than what we have currently.

I don't WANT the system to fail.... I just think it already is failing. The Globo types want to replace the current system with something much worse. CBDC panopticon society where you can only spend your money in approved ways and must answer for every transaction (see IRS $600 proposal). IF the system is already failing AND the heir-apparent is a dystopian nightmare... doesn't it make sense to support the -only- alternative that currently exists?

Don't be confused... there is only 1 crypto-currency positioned to replace L1 monetary network. This is why I'm so laser focused on BTC over smart contract L1s... They're playing -very- different games
 
Tmac

Tmac

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Flobee said:
I'm not cheering for the collapse of the traditional system per se. I just believe:

1. Traditional system is unbelievably corrupt. Cantillon effect is being used to buy control of our society (see Blackrock RE purchases, PPP loan distribution, Billionaire farmland purchases, forcing of ESG score on publicly traded companies, etc)
2. Traditional system is on a trajectory to fail no matter what. That decision was made when they bailed out banks in 2008 rather than letting the system crash and correct. (or is 1971 when Gold standard was broken)
3. Bitcoin has the attributes to create a significantly more fair world monetary system than what we have currently.

I don't WANT the system to fail.... I just think it already is failing. The Globo types want to replace the current system with something much worse. CBDC panopticon society where you can only spend your money in approved ways and must answer for every transaction (see IRS $600 proposal). IF the system is already failing AND the heir-apparent is a dystopian nightmare... doesn't it make sense to support the -only- alternative that currently exists?

Don't be confused... there is only 1 crypto-currency positioned to replace L1 monetary network. This is why I'm so laser focused on BTC over smart contract L1s... They're playing -very- different games
Click to expand...

One thing we haven't discussed much about BTC is acquisition strategy. So, what's yours if you're not diversified and BTC is at ATH's?

My limit buy continues to hover around $33k.
 
Mist

Mist

REEEEeyore
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Flobee said:
3. Bitcoin has the attributes to create a significantly more fair world monetary system than what we have currently.
Click to expand...
What could possibly be more corrupt than a system where a handful of early adopters own almost all the money?
 
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Flobee

Flobee

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Tmac said:
One thing we haven't discussed much about BTC is acquisition strategy. So, what's yours if you're not diversified and BTC is at ATH's?

My limit buy continues to hover around $33k.
Click to expand...
You're being given the opportunity to buy the future world reserve currency IMO. Altcoin USD gains won't keep pace with that in the long term. That said I'm still selling the alts that I bought when I first got into the space, so I guess you could say I'm already diversified in that sense. I expect that I'll sell all or nearly all of those

As for buying BTC... I just DCA in every month. I have high conviction and see BTC like a piggy-bank. I vary how much I buy depending on what I need money for, but I wouldn't adjust that due to Bitcoin price. I believe that its a good value at just about any USD cost. I'm not trading, I buy and hold things I think are valuable.

Mist said:
What could possibly be more corrupt than a system where a handful of early adopters own almost all the money?
Click to expand...
Data I've seen suggests that is not the case. However I don't know for sure so I won't bother arguing about who holds the coins.

I would be willing to argue that I'm less concerned about who owns the MONEY and more concerned about who controls the SYSTEM. Nobody can print infinite Bitcoin and hand it to their friends. The existing coins will distribute as they are spent and will be disburse more widely with time. This has already been demonstrated. Our current system allows a small, centralized, group of oligarchs create new money whenever it best suits them. They own most of the assets that are denominated in this currency as well so not only do they get the newly minted currency first, the resulting inflation also pumps their bags.

How could Bitcoin be more corrupt than that?

Also, the rich hold all the money in our current system too:
www.businessinsider.com

The top 1% officially have more money than the whole middle class

The most recent data from the Federal Reserve shows that the top 1% wealthiest Americans have a collective net worth of about $36.2 trillion.
www.businessinsider.com www.businessinsider.com
 
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Flobee

Flobee

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Putin agrees with me

ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero
www.zerohedge.com www.zerohedge.com
Russian President Vladimir Putin further rattled American financial officials after hinting that while he considers cryptocurrency "crude and under-developed," it could "some day" be used instead of the US dollar to trade with.

The Russian president discussed potential use cases of cryptocurrencies in a Thursday CNBC interview following a plenary session of the Russian Energy Week forum.

"I believe that it has value," Putin told CNBC at the Russian Energy Week event in Moscow on Wednesday, when asked whether bitcoin or cryptocurrencies can be used in place of the US dollar.
...

"I believe the US makes a huge mistake in using the dollar as a sanction instrument," he said.
"We are forced. We have no other choice but to move to transactions in other currencies."

"In this regard, we can say the United States bites the hand that feeds it," the world leader added.

"This dollar is a competitive advantage. It is a universal reserve currency, and the United States today uses it to pursue political goals, and they harm their strategic and economic interests as a result."
"We aren’t interested in cutting off dollar payments completely, and we are so far satisfied with payments for energy resources in dollars, primarily for oil," he added.
Click to expand...
 
Mist

Mist

REEEEeyore
<Gold Donor>
31,200
23,384
Flobee said:
I'm not cheering for the collapse of the traditional system per se. I just believe:

1. Traditional system is unbelievably corrupt. Cantillon effect is being used to buy control of our society (see Blackrock RE purchases, PPP loan distribution, Billionaire farmland purchases, forcing of ESG score on publicly traded companies, etc)
Click to expand...

My point is that the system has always been this bad or worse. The workers and small business owners have never been 'playing the same game' as the elites. Not even playing with the same pieces.
 
Flobee

Flobee

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Mist said:
My point is that the system has always been this bad or worse. The workers and small business owners have never been 'playing the same game' as the elites. Not even playing with the same pieces.
Click to expand...
And my point is that we may live in a time where a more fair system is possible. Just because its always sucked, doesn't mean it always has to. Bitcoin could fail to live up to my expectations... but I do think its better than the IMF/WEF/China monetary system that is going to be pushed on us soon. The conversation about -why- Bitcoin is so superior is a long and deep one that I won't try to do justice here. I'm just saying after the time I've put in, I genuinely believe it is both superior and actually quite likely to win.
 
Kiroy

Kiroy

Marine Biologist
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Flobee said:
You're being given the opportunity to buy the future world reserve currency IMO. Altcoin USD gains won't keep pace with that in the long term. That said I'm still selling the alts that I bought when I first got into the space, so I guess you could say I'm already diversified in that sense. I expect that I'll sell all or nearly all of those

As for buying BTC... I just DCA in every month. I have high conviction and see BTC like a piggy-bank. I vary how much I buy depending on what I need money for, but I wouldn't adjust that due to Bitcoin price. I believe that its a good value at just about any USD cost. I'm not trading, I buy and hold things I think are valuable.


Data I've seen suggests that is not the case. However I don't know for sure so I won't bother arguing about who holds the coins.

I would be willing to argue that I'm less concerned about who owns the MONEY and more concerned about who controls the SYSTEM. Nobody can print infinite Bitcoin and hand it to their friends. The existing coins will distribute as they are spent and will be disburse more widely with time. This has already been demonstrated. Our current system allows a small, centralized, group of oligarchs create new money whenever it best suits them. They own most of the assets that are denominated in this currency as well so not only do they get the newly minted currency first, the resulting inflation also pumps their bags.

How could Bitcoin be more corrupt than that?

Also, the rich hold all the money in our current system too:
www.businessinsider.com

The top 1% officially have more money than the whole middle class

The most recent data from the Federal Reserve shows that the top 1% wealthiest Americans have a collective net worth of about $36.2 trillion.
www.businessinsider.com www.businessinsider.com
Click to expand...

anything that uses 1% as the metric is retarded.

some fucking small business owner making 250k a year is the 1%

these people are not “the rich”
 
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Mist

Mist

REEEEeyore
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Right, it's the 0.1% or the 0.01% that're really playing a different game, and they're also the ones that are actively paying politicians to manipulate the rules of the game even further in their favor.

The 1% includes like, doctors and decent lawyers who aren't even partners in their firms, high paid engineers. Still ultimately people who collect a paycheck as their primary income.
 
swayze22

swayze22

Elite
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Kiroy said:
anything that uses 1% as the metric is retarded.

some fucking small business owner making 250k a year is the 1%

these people are not “the rich”
Click to expand...
Yes but even that proves his point, but moreso. or at least conversely how many people are absolutely poor. You are saying only a small fraction of the top 1% of people are truly "rich". Therefore everyone else is "not rich". Which means extremely top heavy.

Atleast with BTC if i'm playing the same game as the one that exists I get to start earlier
 
Flobee

Flobee

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You're arguing semantics. Central banks control the money printer, they have infinite money, thus infinite power. Inflation is a mechanism to steal your time-value by debasing your currency. To (vastly)oversimplify, they print money and give it to friends, they buy all your stuff at 20% over value. As they throw this free money into the market prices go up, your income does not keep pace. Value of each dollar decreases as asset prices (things you want to buy) rise. The rich(1% or whatever you want to call them) are those that hold the most assets.

Most people don't hold assets, they hold cash. Cash gets devalued, they lose the value of the time they've worked in the past.

You're being robbed by people that control the monetary system. Nobody should have this power. Currency should maintain value over time, thus maintaining time-value of work. You've only ever lived in a fiat system (1971-now) you don't know any better. Being forced to speculate on assets to maintain time-value is wrong and not historically normal.

Buy Bitcoin.

Best analogy I've heard regarding what is happening RE: fiat vs crypto. Andreas is weird, but he nailed this one.


US got off the gold standard in 1971. The world reserve currency became Fiat.
wtfhappenedin1971.com

WTF Happened In 1971?

"I don't believe we shall ever have a good money again before we take the thing out of the hands of government, that is, we can't take it violently out of the hands of government, all we can do is by some sly roundabout way introduce something that they can't stop." - F.A. Hayek 1984
wtfhappenedin1971.com wtfhappenedin1971.com

This is literally the cause of 90%+ of 'political' and economic problems
 
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