DOTA 2

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Sutekh

Sutekh

Blackwing Lair Raider
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Nah I don't think he'll get reverted so quickly, people in this game have a way of over reacting when it comes to this shit, Jugg's been popular for a grand total of like 3 days. I'm sure in a week or two he'll be getting countered pretty easily.

Can I just say that for a minute that "mynuts" for alliance is the greatest name in dota.
 
Zaphid

Zaphid

Trakanon Raider
5,862
294
Icefrog works in mysterious ways. Jugg still needs to finish games relatively fast, because his lategame mobility is based on items, so one of the solutions right is now to out-lategame them with heroes that don't give a fuck, like Ember or Medusa and dance around him with puck/brew/VS ... PR have shown that you can also outheal his damage, which leaves him completely inept, since he still relies on snowballing and he doesn't deal his damage nowhere near as fast as some other heroes or in a very predictable fashion. I loved the cow pick from VPP, you even saw chinese ban it and it seems like he might be an interesting counter, since he has a lot of HP, stuns that don't give a shit about spin and the aura let's your team outrun him. No Spin+TP limits his farming options considerably.
 
Ossoi

Ossoi

Potato del Grande
<Rickshaw Potatoes>
17,720
8,757
I was watching Arteezy's stream yesterday, and for his Juggernaut he went 1 point in spin, 0 points in heal, 1 point in crit, and 1 point in crit by level 7 (1-0-1-1). Twitch chat was berating him for his build, saying things like "stats Juggernaut DansGame" and "wtf, just max crit to farm faster."

Assuming level 7 Juggernaut has Power Treads (Agi) and Mask of Madness, I ran calcs for both builds using this:Dota 2 Hero Calculator(thank you to the person who made it!)

1-0-1-1 build (with 4x stats, w/o MoM active): 137.70 DPS
1-0-4-1 build (with 1x stats, w/o MoM active): 139.71 DPS
1-0-1-1 build (with 4x stats, with MoM active): 210.12 DPS
1-0-4-1 build (with 1x stats, with MoM active): 215.43 DPS

The build with crit max has more DPS in both cases, but not by much (~2 w/o MoM, ~5 with MoM). Keep in mind the build with 4x stats has 6 more Str/Agi/Int, so it makes up for the slight loss in DPS with bulk. Here are some numbers:

1-0-1-1 build (with 4x stats): 1387 Physical EHP, 1188 Magical EHP
1-0-4-1 build (with 1x stats): 1170 Physical EHP, 1036 Magical EHP

Tl;dr: While losing a minuscule amount of DPS, Juggernaut gains a significant amount of bulk (by going 1-0-1-1 and stats at 7). His new scaling on crit is 20/25/30/35, so the first point gives you over half of the total bonus of the entire skill. Your farm rate will be practically the same with just 1 point in crit.

Bonus fun fact: The DPS from Bladefury is 80/100/120/140 magical damage, and a level 7 Juggernaut can outdo Bladefury with Power Treads (Agi) and Mask of Madness. It's magical vs physical though, so the reduction will be different. Even so, an enemy needs 17 armor to reduce Juggernaut's right click DPS down to that of rank 4 Bladefury.
Early Juggernaut DPS: 1-0-1-1 vs 1-0-4-1 : DotA2
 
Pyros

Pyros

<Silver Donator>
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Sutekh_sl said:
Nah I don't think he'll get reverted so quickly, people in this game have a way of over reacting when it comes to this shit, Jugg's been popular for a grand total of like 3 days. I'm sure in a week or two he'll be getting countered pretty easily.

Can I just say that for a minute that "mynuts" for alliance is the greatest name in dota.
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There's most likely a patch before TI like every year, and unless between now and then he stops getting banned every time or FPed, I don't see him not getting nerfed. Don't care either way, the hero is pretty fun to watch, not a 40mins ricing split push illusion stuff that leads to boring ass games.

And yeah mynuts' name is hilarious. Literally every 2mins something funny is being said. I don't know if it'll get old, but it hasn't yet.
 
N

Nutron_sl

shitlord
712
0
Sutekh_sl said:
Nah I don't think he'll get reverted so quickly, people in this game have a way of over reacting when it comes to this shit, Jugg's been popular for a grand total of like 3 days. I'm sure in a week or two he'll be getting countered pretty easily.

Can I just say that for a minute that "mynuts" for alliance is the greatest name in dota.
Click to expand...
He's been picked in almost every damn game i've played for the past month o more.

Ok I've nly played like 20 or so games, but still, THE AGONY.
 
Sutekh

Sutekh

Blackwing Lair Raider
7,489
106
Nutron_sl said:
He's been picked in almost every damn game i've played for the past month o more.

Ok I've nly played like 20 or so games, but still, THE AGONY.
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You know who's good against him? DROW RANGER. ILL CARRY YOU MY LITTLE FRENCH BULLDOG.
 
O

Obtenor_sl

shitlord
483
0
I mean, if you're going to talk about counters, Omniknight does a good job at countering him, build an Aghs and Jugg will have a hard time ulting anyone on the map
 
Pyros

Pyros

<Silver Donator>
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Obtenor_sl said:
I mean, if you're going to talk about counters, Omniknight does a good job at countering him, build an Aghs and Jugg will have a hard time ulting anyone on the map
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Jugg does well with a Diffusal though, and you can diffusal during ulti iirc.
 
Zaphid

Zaphid

Trakanon Raider
5,862
294
Yeah, and medusa's ulti vaporizes manta illusions. If you are playing serious, it's better to pick another hero to drain her, Kotol is surprisingly good at that, since the drain is % based, so it remains relevant for a long time.

OD should be fun Jugg counter, he has huge mana issues early game, so a single Astral fucks you up, He can hide from spin or omni and do the same for his allies. The ulti is just a cherry on top.
 
Pyros

Pyros

<Silver Donator>
11,222
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Sutekh_sl said:
Eh, Diffusal kind of sucks on him for any reason other than dispelling GA/Ghost.
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Slowing people increases DPS, kinda. It's not an item you'd build if you didn't want to counter stuff, but Diffusal is never an item you build if you don't plan on using it to counter shit. Just meant, it's better on Jugger than on some other heroes as he's not really that item dependant, he has strong base damage via ult and innate crit, so going for a diffusal as a counter to Omni doesn't ruin his build or whatever. So I wouldn't put Omni as a very good Jugg counter, he just forces him into spending some of his money on a semi decent item. Heroes that have a large amount of units like Broodmother or Chen can be a lot more annoying, as well as heroes that can constantly deny him his targets(good ole SD for example, though no one plays him anymore cause too defensive, or Dazzle for a more common pick).
 
Jackie Treehorn

Jackie Treehorn

<Gold Donor>
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Spec'ing a game where a Bloodseeker is keeping 600-800 (up to 900 at points) runspeed almost all the time even when no one is hurt. The specs are all WTFing over it. Interesting bug / exploit. Maybe there's some rational answer but no one could figure it out, anyway.
 
Zaphid

Zaphid

Trakanon Raider
5,862
294
-1 armor.

NERFED TO THE GROUND

Omni cast range is nice, but when you typically go phase+mom, that 100 range flies by pretty fast imo, but it definitely gives him a weakness you can now try to exploit.
 
Intrinsic

Intrinsic

Person of Whiteness
<Gold Donor>
15,038
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If anyone wants to low tier group this weekend just join the RR guild. We'll low tier the hell out of it.
 
Zaphid

Zaphid

Trakanon Raider
5,862
294
A tournament with no t1 teams attending ends up being the best ran event outside TI with the final match so good it's comparable to TI3 final.

No, seriously, go watch the last game of the SL XI grand final, it was awesome. Or rather, watch the whole match to avoid spoilers
 
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