Drugs to steer clear of

Mr_Bungle said:

Rajaah, I know I have gently busted on you before but in all seriousness I like talking games with you, I think you're a good dude and I want you to stick around with us.

Please seek some sort of professional / 3rd party treatment. I'm sorry you are going through this. Stay strong and don't feel guilty about finding what help you need. I've seen people in my own life ruin their futures with all kinds of opioids, regulated or not, because they were either too scared, proud, ashamed, or thought they could do it themselves. There is only one Rajaah in this world, treat him well.

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Thank you sir. Don't worry, I'm not gonna die or anything. I might even be making the whole thing sound worse than it is due to being freaked out at an inability to control a drug. Makes you feel like a sack o' crap when you realize you dug yourself into a hole without even knowing it.

Since I'm completely unable to quit it on my own, yeah, I'll need to go get help. It's either that or bump the dose up and I ain't doing that, it just kicks the can down the road every time you do that and makes the eventual stopping worse.

Sludig said:

To violate "grown up rules" for a second. It's fucking Rajaah man. Pretty much the person I'd pick out of a wallboard of forum names to have this story. (Yknow outside the existing known junkies of some proscription). That the name mixes with indian store pills is kinda funny too.

Raj if I'm not blocked already from calling you out other times. Treat this aggressively, stop trying to self manage, and get your self into a treatment clinic and onto suboxone and whatever else resources for normal "addicts" that you can find. You are fighting something that messes with your brain chemicals and decision making. Plenty of seemingly put together people fall to it. I don't know how your job is putting up with it, and if you have like any benefits, but they often have a lot of free or at least options for this kind of treatment even on shitty plans. (Probably fed bucks go into them)

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I don't block anybody, I just take punches on the chin. Been doing it for 35 years already, people taking shots at me is a pretty normal part of life which I'm sure isn't a surprise. I actually like people who are honest about shit even if it means they're telling me I suck.

Treatment program is going to get done soon as I can. Holding the drug mostly at bay in the meantime, this is not going to continue.

Sylas said:

All that info is freely available on wikipedia, generally within the first paragraph.

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Cool, I don't need anybody else telling me how I should have known better. It's marketed as concentrated kratom or whatever, something one would assume is benign based on how benign most kratom products were until recently. Now these companies are putting out all these super-addictive products like Feel Free and 7-OH. Back in October, there were tons of rave reviews online about this stuff and how great it is; now months later there are a lot more cautionary warnings out about it (though they're still largely relegated to addiction forums, while 7-OH forums are all flyin' high about it).

Rest of your post, super interesting stuff. The "concentrated kratom" that helps people relax and get rid of anxiety is actually Temu Fentanyl, nuts. They need big red lettering on the packaging telling people it has a high risk of addiction, instead of "may be habit-forming" buried in the small print on the back. Like yeah no shit, lots of things can be habit-forming. This goes well beyond that into the realm of "destroys your life very quickly and with little warning"

Yeah, I'm on a "maintain" dose now. About 7 mg twice a day, so half of what it was before I decided to stop. This lets me get things done and chug along with life without being bedridden, but any sort of further taper seems out of reach. The taper I did to go from 28 to 14 was already a crushingly bad few days, but I leveled out on 14. It still demands more from me, especially late at night, and I say no.

Void said:

This is the adult forum, so I am asking this earnestly.

How long have you been on this stuff? Because I know I've specifically wondered if you take drugs when posting some of your theories in other threads, and you (understandably) got a little annoyed and told me that you didn't. Except now we find out you've been basically taking heroin. That would explain a lot.

I sincerely hope you get whatever help you need to kick this habit, and my suggestion would be to get actual medical help because doing it yourself seems like you are just going to drag it out forever hoping that some day you get a couple of weeks free, but when those weeks finally come it will probably be too hard to actually quit, since no one wants to be miserable for a couple of weeks right? You've already tried to do it yourself, go to the doctor and get help. Hell, maybe you can help educate the doctor as well so they maybe stop someone else from doing the same thing.

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Wouldn't shock me if my doctor didn't even know about 7-OH yet since it's so new. Apparently it's only really been a thing since last April, and only really got popular last Fall. Not sure what the people who have been on it for "years" were taking before that. Maybe ordering it from overseas or something.

Going to meet with my doc soon and if I haven't made any progress with further tapering in the next ten days, which I don't expect to, I'll submit to Suboxone because I can't have this interfering with work and I refuse to go back to 30mg or even up the dosage at all. Like straight-up refuse no matter how bad it gets.

As for your question, I don't do hard drugs, no morphine, no Vic/Perc/whatever, no Oxy. Not even weak painkillers with any frequency, so if I said I avoid drugs that's probably what I was talking about. However drugs in general, maybe I lied about that one. Since 2022 I have been regularly hitting the weed, and kratom powder, and even weak painkillers here and there (mainly Gabapentin to sleep). So yeah, I've had some stuff in my system when I'm on here, or playing EQ, and sometimes I'm even a bit blitzed while still being high-functioning.

I had a lot of injuries (mostly back) when I was younger and was on and off of various painkillers back then due to how physical my lifestyle was. I was on and off with meds for a few years once they were no longer that needed, though some were difficult to kick, nothing insurmountable. Especially if you use things like light kratom powder to eliminate withdrawals. By the end of 2020 I was pretty much off of everything.

I haven't had more than a couple of shots of alcohol since 2017. Which kinda sucks because I've got Dan Ackroyd's Crystal Skull Vodka here and it's really good. I just have zero interest in alcohol after seeing friends and family destroy themselves on it, like the interest flat-out dropped off the map and when I think about having some it just makes me think of those people.

After my longtime girlfriend died two years ago while we were separated (she started seeing another guy and it went south fast, then she did some really stupid shit while intoxicated) I could have jumped right into full-on substance abuse, but instead I just kept chugging along, while yes, relying on medications to calm down in a way I didn't have to before. At least I've been enjoying the fact that I don't need to be on anyone else's sleep schedule, which I needed after like 13 years of one girlfriend after another (mostly her). She was my favorite person, though, and I expected us to reunite like we always did after our breaks (this happened 3 times previously, we'd see other people, even get serious, then we'd both go back to each other). I was super protective of her even if we didn't get back together.

She'd been through some stuff in the past and I pretty much swore to myself that nothing would ever happen to her again on my watch. Turns out all it took was for me to stop watching and her to shack up with an enabling alcoholic with a gun collection he didn't know how to fucking secure like an adult. So losing her knocked the wind out of my sails completely and I only really started to feel better at all in 2024 with the help of drugs, EQ, and just being too damn busy to think about it. Lord knows relaxing without taking something is really elusive now.

Cad said:

GHB is not rohypnol btw, rohypnol is a benzodiazepine. GHB is a GABA-b agonist. Completely different drugs, even if they can have similar effects depending on dosage.

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That's another thing, this is a good example of how I don't know much about drugs, thought they were the same thing. Far as kratom and 7-OH went, I just know "oh, this one's a benign herb that gets people off of hard pharmaceuticals" and "oh, this is just a better version of the benign herb" respectively.

I should probably get some credit for going so light on the stuff, "just in case". At the very maximum I was taking about 30mg/day, and that maximum was only for several weeks. Go to 7-OH addiction reddits and whatnot and you'll see a slew of people who were taking 200-300mg/day, or taking it for YEARS, and generally only quit when it either:

A) Bankrupts them from spending $3000 a month on it (if male)
B) Causes their hair to start falling out or their skin to get pale (if female)

I'm nowhere near either one of those things. I went light as hell with it. About 7mg at a time, and at max that was 4x a day. The "you want to quit? lol fuck you" from this new drug is a new feeling, and one I'm quite frankly shocked even happened considering how low my doses were. Half of the serving size, FFS. Then you got all these people taking a whole pill (two servings) right out of the box on their first try, going "huh, these are nice" and then writing an addiction plea for help on reddit 8 months later because they ran out of all their savings and discovered that their ten pill a day habit is hard to get off of. Oh yeah, what a shock.

In my case the fact that anything of the sort happened even with a low dose is pretty much a sign that the stuff is laced with something seriously not-right, and smoke shops shouldn't be pushing it on people, especially not under the auspices of "it's just kratom" because it sure as fuck isn't just kratom. The free samples they give out are another thing that makes me want to throw a brick through their window.

Cad You down for a class action lawsuit? I bet a ton of people would jump on board.

Hateyou said:

I can’t wrap my head around regularly buying Indian gas station pills and never thinking to research wtf you’re ingesting. Jesus man.

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God Dammit. They're not "Indian gas station pills". They're Indian Smoke Shop Pills. There's a big difference. People get their kratom powder from smoke shops. They get another "kratom" product in that purports to also be harmless, and it feels super relaxing to take? Sure why not. They even tried to get me on that Feel Free stuff with free samples that I didn't actually use because liquids are so much easier to go overboard with than pills. Being able to measure your intake of anything with any remote addictive properties is important.

Foler said:

I mean he’s Indian so chances are it’s his gas station. Rajaah don’t try to break this yourself. Go get some help. It’s OK, to do that. Don’t put this shit off any longer.

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Not Indian. After this latest escapade I'm no longer even pro-Indian. Musk was wrong. Down with H1-B!

Furry said:

I've said it before, but it bears repeating. This is me pretty much every time I read a rajaah post and try to engage with what's happening.



I completely believe him here too.

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Well, one thing I am is pretty honest, so if I say something, 97% chance it's the truth as I know it, 3% chance it's close to the truth and I'm leaving something out because it's some personal matter. Often telling the truth doesn't make me look good, but it is what it is. Not out to embellish here. Though it does sound like I downplayed the fact that I do take some drugs. Maybe I've even taken more than I realized the last two years to deal with my loss. I know I've had a lot of trouble with this latest EQ server compared to past servers (in terms of remembering things or keeping up), and thought my ADHD had just worsened or something.

The 7-OH use however is very recent and short term:

Void said:

How long have you been on this stuff?

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Since last October, middle of the month. I think I tried it a few times before that and found it to be pretty relaxing, over the summer maybe. Doubt it was more than 3 or 4 times total. Mid-October was when I had really fallen behind on work, and I took a dose to help me chill out. It was a different brand, and not only did it chill me out, it made me want to get things done, so I started rapidly catching up. And kept taking it every couple days specifically for work. Some time in November it turned into an every-day thing, and it wasn't until March that I started taking a full pill every day. Before that it was fragments. Never exceeded one pill. One of the reasons I wrote about it to begin with is how much this stuff attacks you even if you're only taking one per day.

Looking forward to Suboxone (and getting off of it fairly quickly before it too becomes a problem) to just clear out my system so I can be fully sober.

Uriel said:

Look into agmatine and NAC, both good supplements for other things but I think they have to do with drugs and withdrawal too. Then I'd grab a couple pounds of good kava powder, make a big batch each day and chug it to get through the withdrawals, it'll relax you and help you pass out at night, with no tolerance or addiction to it. Don't drink alcohol or take tylenol with the kava though. It's something where you have to rip the bandaid off, the sooner the better (and as prepared as you can be with healthy supplements), unless you're gonna check into rehab which is maybe the right course too if it's an option. Brain chemicals and the lack thereof can be terrible, but they get better with time.

For every supplement I take, I always research them as much as I can, and it's a strict no for me is if they have any sort of withdrawal or tolerance build up. Never touch any of that shit again, it's never worth it. This includes regular kratom, I've heard plenty of horror stories with that too.

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I've got Agmatine around here somewhere, I could dust it off.

Once I'm off this stuff I'll probably need to repair my dopamine production a bit so I'm looking into things that could get that back to normal.


This in particular seems like a possible option to go with for 3 months or so to get my brain chemicals back to normal. However right now I'm understandably skeptical of pretty much any newer compounds that haven't really been regulated, and need to read about this more when it isn't 5 AM.

Tomorrow is off from everything and I'll be resting up, yet another dropped day to deal with the issue.

Hateyou said:

Sorry but that’s basically the same thing. The smoke shop is misrepresenting what they’re selling, just like a gas station pill. I have these Indian smoke shops in my town, as well as a couple gas stations that have sections in them that sell the identical products that the smoke shop is selling. It’s not different, the smoke shop just has a larger selection.

Also, kratom functions the exact same way that the pill you took, and how opioids function. They bind to your opioid receptor and are addictive and hard to get off of. Some are just harder than others. Kratom is not some harmless happy go lucky pill like you’re making it out to be, it’s just easier to manage.

Here’s free advice. Stay off of every drug you can, especially from gas stations or smoke shops, and I highly include caffeine in that. I quit caffeine cold turkey last year and holy fuck it was an extreme life change. I had no idea cause I’ve been drinking it my entire life basically. Use diet and exercise to enhance your mood or life outlook instead and you won’t go searching for magic life improving pills, they do not exist unless you’re combating some specific health issue.

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I used to exercise all the time and it was certainly a different world from now. And yeah Caffeine is way stronger than people think it is. I stopped all Caffeine back in...I want to say 2019 or so and haven't had any since. Hell, by 2021 I wasn't on much of anything except sugar. Started having some serious family issues (my mom turned into a shrieking banshee for a while after Jan 6 and some of my family members were refusing to talk to each other, etc), my GF and I separated again, etc. It was all fine, I was busy and chugging along. Then she dies and that plus all the family stuff just knocked me back into susceptibility I guess. Last 2 years or so have been like I'm in some sort of parallel universe where every punch I "rolled with" before turned into a battering ram to the chest and life seems just that much more pointless. Been doing work and EQ and Elden Ring and those things are good, at least.

Getting off of everything completely is the plan, provided Suboxone works, after a month (or whatever) of that I'll be "factory reset" on any substances and have no desire to do anything else.

After controlling the (low) dose again yesterday and stopping very early in the day, I woke up pretty decent today and had a few hours of feeling a bit better, seems the physical aspects may have blown over a bit? So instead mental aspects roared in! Lots of "Damn, I actually hate how I've spent my life" type stuff. I guess that's the next stage? Just totally regretting most of my life decisions, like letting certain people walk away, or focusing on work and play instead of socializing, things like that. Oh shit, my mom is probably never going to have grandkids because I dropped the ball so much and refuse to go out and meet women now. Oh shit, my apartment has turned into a complete pig sty when I wasn't looking. How did I not notice this all these weeks? I've got a Bowflex in here, yeah a full home gym, and it seems to be covered in towels and whatnot right now like a coat rack. When did that happen? God damn, I'm 30 pounds heavier than I was in January and none of it is muscle? I've got a day entirely to myself today, why am I not cleaning the place or working out? Why do I feel like dogshit instead?

....wait, maybe it's good to have all this mental stuff going on because I'm noticing all the shit that's wrong.

Lots of addiction subreddits to look around when I've got time, and boards and whatnot. Already did some googling and saw a ton of people dealing with similar issues as we speak. Yeah, I feel like this is going to turn into a big mess of lawsuits and congressional regulations, and maybe it should.

Hateyou said:

Just keep cutting your dosage down and ween off. Make a list of (realistic) things you can fix like your dirty house and start focusing on it. I think you’re having problems because you aren’t occupying yourself with tangible things that matter. Video games are fun time wasters but they accomplish nothing. Cleaning out your apartment or house is productive. Maybe do some kind of project with your hands. Keep yourself busy, make time go by faster and you won’t dwell on shit and think about the drug so much.

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Yeah, I spent way too much time on games the last few years. Turns out having free time and no women keeping me honest = I can finally catch up on all my games = That ends up eating up way too much of my free time.

TBH I should have quit gaming in mid-2022 after I finished the second Elden Ring platinum, because that made all other games feel obsolete for a while, and there was really no need to go back to gaming after that.

What I'm saying is that Elden Ring is the Suboxone of games