Everquest Confessions

Zehnpai · Jan 10, 2023

I can only imagine the clusterfuck that would have been GoD if anybody had stuck around. By the time enough people had passed those stupid overtuned Ikkinz trials or whatever to start doing raid content, all the good players had already bailed for WoW. I know Hartsman did some good for the EQ dev team and made them less...egotistical. Unfortunately he fell prey to his own success and by the time he went off to Rift he was just as bad as McQuaid had been.

It's a shame really. All they had to do was admit that shit was broken and was going to take time to fix. They just couldn't fathom that players knew more than they did. Then again, given the state of Flameplay back in the day, who could blame them.

---

Anyways, other things I remember...slightly less dickish stuff.

Had a friend who was high up at a major tech retailer. Verant would give him all kinds of stuff in game. His SK was always kitted out in top tier raid gear day 1 of any given expansion as well as a few GM only items like the Oily Black Vial. Occasionally we'd go romp through old content with him just for giggles. We only abused his account a few times for CRing on raids since he was con neutral to everything.

During raids we would form a 'wizard kill squad' to get all the xp and gold from killing trash mobs. Most raid nights we'd end up net positive exp even if other people were at risk of de-leveling. I think early PoP our guild leader made us stop because too many people were complaining. Sad times. 8(

Another 'early zone scouting' technique was to rename whatever zone file you wanted to match the tutorial zone file and then launch the tutorial. Made it nice for practicing how to get through a few dungeons and see expansions a bit early before they broke the tutorial.

I never really realized just how 'weird' it was being max level in EverQuest back in the day. You were in such a bubble in any uber guild thinking that shit was normal. I remember going to the midnight launch of Velious to pick up my copy and of the ~15 people there that night, my friend, his gf and I were the only level 60's. Next highest level player was a dude who was in the mid 30's. Whenever someone else would ask what level we were we just lied and said mid 30's as well because we didn't want to be outed as uber-nerds who had cleared VP and whatnot.

Synj · Jan 10, 2023

Zehnpai said:
I can only imagine the clusterfuck that would have been GoD if anybody had stuck around. By the time enough people had passed those stupid overtuned Ikkinz trials or whatever to start doing raid content, all the good players had already bailed for WoW. I know Hartsman did some good for the EQ dev team and made them less...egotistical. Unfortunately he fell prey to his own success and by the time he went off to Rift he was just as bad as McQuaid had been.

It's a shame really. All they had to do was admit that shit was broken and was going to take time to fix. They just couldn't fathom that players knew more than they did. Then again, given the state of Flameplay back in the day, who could blame them.

---

Anyways, other things I remember...slightly less dickish stuff.

Had a friend who was high up at a major tech retailer. Verant would give him all kinds of stuff in game. His SK was always kitted out in top tier raid gear day 1 of any given expansion as well as a few GM only items like the Oily Black Vial. Occasionally we'd go romp through old content with him just for giggles. We only abused his account a few times for CRing on raids since he was con neutral to everything.

During raids we would form a 'wizard kill squad' to get all the xp and gold from killing trash mobs. Most raid nights we'd end up net positive exp even if other people were at risk of de-leveling. I think early PoP our guild leader made us stop because too many people were complaining. Sad times. 8(

Another 'early zone scouting' technique was to rename whatever zone file you wanted to match the tutorial zone file and then launch the tutorial. Made it nice for practicing how to get through a few dungeons and see expansions a bit early before they broke the tutorial.

I never really realized just how 'weird' it was being max level in EverQuest back in the day. You were in such a bubble in any uber guild thinking that shit was normal. I remember going to the midnight launch of Velious to pick up my copy and of the ~15 people there that night, my friend, his gf and I were the only level 60's. Next highest level player was a dude who was in the mid 30's. Whenever someone else would ask what level we were we just lied and said mid 30's as well because we didn't want to be outed as uber-nerds who had cleared VP and whatnot.

I have to admit I was a bit starstruck by max level characters or anyone that stood out with unique high end gear. Early EQ was such a grind and to even see someone at level 50 floored me. It’s hard to describe why, but looking back on it, I realize how much poopsocking people had to have been doing because I played all the time but I was never at the front of the power curve but I also could never be bothered with raiding.

Honestly, raiding was such a fucking chore to me and while I get the appeal of having the fear and high level kills, it just seemed like another job and I avoided it like the plague.

Masakari · Jan 10, 2023

Synj said:
I have to admit I was a bit starstruck by max level characters or anyone that stood out with unique high end gear. Early EQ was such a grind and to even see someone at level 50 floored me. It’s hard to describe why, but looking back on it, I realize how much poopsocking people had to have been doing because I played all the time but I was never at the front of the power curve but I also could never be bothered with raiding.

Honestly, raiding was such a fucking chore to me and while I get the appeal of having the fear and high level kills, it just seemed like another job and I avoided it like the plague.

People cut their teeth on those raids.

Wingz · Jan 11, 2023

Zehnpai said:
Another 'early zone scouting' technique was to rename whatever zone file you wanted to match the tutorial zone file and then launch the tutorial. Made it nice for practicing how to get through a few dungeons and see expansions a bit early before they broke the tutorial.

What?? That's insane.

Arbitrary · Jan 11, 2023

Wingz said:
What?? That's insane.

Blew my mind for a second as well.

Synj · Jan 11, 2023

Wingz said:
What?? That's insane.

There were so many good exploits early on.

I remember going to the Sploitz.net and Dr. something or other to look for bullshit exploits to get ahead.

They were way more prevalent in UO but obviously EQ had a bunch of shit you could do too.

I remember very, very early in Beta 1 coming across a level 18 ranger in Qeynos that was fishing.

He told me that he had been hired as a consultant of sorts by Verant/989/whatever they were at the beginning to break their stuff. My memory is foggy, but essentially he was working on some sort of fishing dupe that would allow him to mess with the DB and allowed him to "fish" for any item as long as he could figure out the item data.

Obviously I know way more about pellets than programming, so please excuse my layman description, but I remember thinking that guy was cool LOL

Muligan · Jan 23, 2023

Synj said:
I have to admit I was a bit starstruck by max level characters or anyone that stood out with unique high end gear. Early EQ was such a grind and to even see someone at level 50 floored me. It’s hard to describe why, but looking back on it, I realize how much poopsocking people had to have been doing because I played all the time but I was never at the front of the power curve but I also could never be bothered with raiding.

Honestly, raiding was such a fucking chore to me and while I get the appeal of having the fear and high level kills, it just seemed like another job and I avoided it like the plague.

I think this was what hooked me... I remember on my first server/character finally going out to Guk to see 2-3 guys sitting around the entrance. I held my breath my entire way going with an escort and a few others that were also trusting some dude who gave us SoW and was willing to lead us. The guys at the entrance had some awesome looking great... probably the first time I saw a tank with plate and DPS holding Yaks. That seems like such an insignificant story but then it was just another page in your adventure. Every piece of that was a big deal, especially it being your first, where you find a group, choose to adventure out to the unknown, and then talking to several different people along the way.

I was determined to be as cool as those guys. I miss the days of armor being somewhat exclusive. You knew every piece by name and what you needed to do to obtain it. I guess that's simply not possible now. Now, I'm farming ilvl and primary stats. I couldn't tell you one piece of armor in WoW except a few tmog pieces.

Thanks for the nostalgia trip. I hadn't thought about that moment in awhile. Good times!

Regime · Jan 23, 2023

Muligan said:
I think this was what hooked me... I remember on my first server/character finally going out to Guk to see 2-3 guys sitting around the entrance. I held my breath my entire way going with an escort and a few others that were also trusting some dude who gave us SoW and was willing to lead us. The guys at the entrance had some awesome looking great... probably the first time I saw a tank with plate and DPS holding Yaks. That seems like such an insignificant story but then it was just another page in your adventure. Every piece of that was a big deal, especially it being your first, where you find a group, choose to adventure out to the unknown, and then talking to several different people along the way.

I was determined to be as cool as those guys. I miss the days of armor being somewhat exclusive. You knew every piece by name and what you needed to do to obtain it. I guess that's simply not possible now. Now, I'm farming ilvl and primary stats. I couldn't tell you one piece of armor in WoW except a few tmog pieces.

Thanks for the nostalgia trip. I hadn't thought about that moment in awhile. Good times!

I got into the game pretty early thanks to the massive lan party scene in KC. Tons of our Tribes and quake tournament people would be playing EQ after the matches were done. So I was definitely mesmerized but kinda had a high level group of friends from the get go helping the lowbies out.

GuardianX · Jan 26, 2023

Playing through the TLPs recently and I gotta ask.

Are my expectations too high for EQ? Am I out of touch with what EQ has become?

I wanted a game where I could re-experience old content and then progress into content I never experienced while playing with people I met along the way.

I'm not looking to spend 100+ a month just to 3-6 box "Solo" for XP during my down time and then raid during the evenings. It SEEMS like most people complain about botters and then they do everything they can to 6 box with shit like auto-hotkey and whatever keyclone software they can find. Then they complain about not being able to find good guild applicants when they only ever group with themselves.

It FEELS like most people treat EQ as a solo-ish game and the TLP's as a seasonal "play through pop" treadmill.

Is this a good assessment?

Korzax Stonehammer · Jan 26, 2023

It all depends. What are your expectations. Only you can decide if they are too high. And what do you think EQ has become that you are now completely out of touch with it.
If you played on Mischeif and then say that the game no longer feels the same way, then yeah, the game was radically changed for that server. But if you are playing on one of the phinny clones, less so.

Every year there will be less people that play on the tlp's at launch. Launch is so much fun. Don't miss out on a closing window. But if you really want nostalgia, you play P99. But most folks really don't want that anymore. They want to see the scenery, not be stuck in traffic.

I think 'most people' on the offical forums is one guy with 50 email accounts.

Animosity · Jan 26, 2023

GuardianX said:
Playing through the TLPs recently and I gotta ask.

Are my expectations too high for EQ? Am I out of touch with what EQ has become?

I wanted a game where I could re-experience old content and then progress into content I never experienced while playing with people I met along the way.

I'm not looking to spend 100+ a month just to 3-6 box "Solo" for XP during my down time and then raid during the evenings. It SEEMS like most people complain about botters and then they do everything they can to 6 box with shit like auto-hotkey and whatever keyclone software they can find. Then they complain about not being able to find good guild applicants when they only ever group with themselves.

It FEELS like most people treat EQ as a solo-ish game and the TLP's as a seasonal "play through pop" treadmill.

Is this a good assessment?

Boxers either play on live or EQ TLPs to krono farm. You shouldnt have any issues finding groups from classic-PoP. But yes it is very much a seasonal thing. If you are looking for a "good ol days" vibe you wont really find it. As TLPs are pretty fast paced in progression and a lot of people are repeat players. Its still fun to play but lower your expectations as the game has changed immensely.

yerm · Jan 26, 2023

GuardianX said:
Playing through the TLPs recently and I gotta ask.

Are my expectations too high for EQ? Am I out of touch with what EQ has become?

I wanted a game where I could re-experience old content and then progress into content I never experienced while playing with people I met along the way.

I'm not looking to spend 100+ a month just to 3-6 box "Solo" for XP during my down time and then raid during the evenings. It SEEMS like most people complain about botters and then they do everything they can to 6 box with shit like auto-hotkey and whatever keyclone software they can find. Then they complain about not being able to find good guild applicants when they only ever group with themselves.

It FEELS like most people treat EQ as a solo-ish game and the TLP's as a seasonal "play through pop" treadmill.

Is this a good assessment?

My ignorant personal opinion is that people who play entirely by themselves while also bitching about shit like missing classes on raids are the single biggest guild killers. I get nasty when people recruit like "need int casters" or "always looking for clerics" or whatever. I know why.

But I think what's desired by most is a relatively social game but not a forced one. They can choose to raid or group, but by and large, wanna do shit themselves. People like playing with others; they don't like NEEDING to or else having nothing to do.

GuardianX · Jan 26, 2023

Korzax Stonehammer said:
It all depends.

Unironically, this answers so many things.

Animosity said:
You shouldnt have any issues finding groups from classic-PoP.

yerm said:
My ignorant personal opinion is that people who play entirely by themselves while also bitching about shit like missing classes on raids are the single biggest guild killers. I get nasty when people recruit like "need int casters" or "always looking for clerics" or whatever. I know why.

But I think what's desired by most is a relatively social game but not a forced one. They can choose to raid or group, but by and large, wanna do shit themselves. People like playing with others; they don't like NEEDING to or else having nothing to do.

What got me is, there was never an issue with finding people to group with, until people started filling out their groups with boxes. It seems like it's an entirely self created issue and the solution, MORE BOXES!

Like shit, we've had so many guildies get hit with 7 day suspensions on aradune that you figure they would have gotten the memo at this point. I guess the good part is that Aradune is such a ghost-town now that no one is reporting 2+ boxers. We have a dude that routinely 6 boxes on raids and many people that routinely 3 box.

yerm · Jan 26, 2023

GuardianX said:
Unironically, this answers so many things.

What got me is, there was never an issue with finding people to group with, until people started filling out their groups with boxes. It seems like it's an entirely self created issue and the solution, MORE BOXES!

Like shit, we've had so many guildies get hit with 7 day suspensions on aradune that you figure they would have gotten the memo at this point. I guess the good part is that Aradune is such a ghost-town now that no one is reporting 2+ boxers. We have a dude that routinely 6 boxes on raids and many people that routinely 3 box.

Starting with I think ldon the game begins to enforce min char requirements, while a lot of content becomes kinda stale to do with an actual real person group. Farming hive missions for da and lev clicks isn't really something you want guildmates along for usually. While I'm super criticial of fully antisocial (outside raids) players sometimes, the opposite with enforced social play isn't fun for most either.

Ikkan · Jan 26, 2023

Animosity said:
Boxers either play on live or EQ TLPs to krono farm. You shouldnt have any issues finding groups from classic-PoP. But yes it is very much a seasonal thing. If you are looking for a "good ol days" vibe you wont really find it. As TLPs are pretty fast paced in progression and a lot of people are repeat players. Its still fun to play but lower your expectations as the game has changed immensely.

I 24 box on TLPs and I've literally never sold a single krono. Some of just like treating older EQ content like an RTS.

Fight · Jan 26, 2023

Ikkan said:
I 24 box on TLPs and I've literally never sold a single krono. Some of just like treating older EQ content like an RTS.

Ok Bro.

GuardianX · Jan 26, 2023

Fight said:
Ok Bro.

See I get botting though, it's interesting to build something with code that does something that takes "Skill" to accomplish.

Unless they are just running a generic script they paid a subscription for..

yerm said:
While I'm super criticial of fully antisocial (outside raids) players sometimes, the opposite with enforced social play isn't fun for most either.

I understand to a degree, but with the server I main being Aradune, it's comical to have a sister server that allows boxing without limits and people aren't just switching (free transfers) to play there. Instead they are just rolling 3+ boxes and dealing with it every time they get a 7 day. We have 4 of 5 people on their 3rd-4th 7 day.

Ambiturner · Jan 26, 2023

GuardianX said:
What got me is, there was never an issue with finding people to group with, until people started filling out their groups with boxes.

That's definitely not true

OhSeven · Jan 26, 2023

GuardianX said:
Playing through the TLPs recently and I gotta ask.

Are my expectations too high for EQ? Am I out of touch with what EQ has become?

I wanted a game where I could re-experience old content and then progress into content I never experienced while playing with people I met along the way.

I'm not looking to spend 100+ a month just to 3-6 box "Solo" for XP during my down time and then raid during the evenings. It SEEMS like most people complain about botters and then they do everything they can to 6 box with shit like auto-hotkey and whatever keyclone software they can find. Then they complain about not being able to find good guild applicants when they only ever group with themselves.

It FEELS like most people treat EQ as a solo-ish game and the TLP's as a seasonal "play through pop" treadmill.

Is this a good assessment?

Pretty much. Matches my own experience with modern EQ. I made a lot of friends leveling up through classic and kunark so ended up with a semi static group for a long time but once they quit through normal attrition it became a lot tougher to get groups together in a reasonable time frame.

I understand the desire to be able to do things on your own and not be forced to group but it does seem like boxing is a solution that ends up contributing to the problem. Don't know what other solution there is though without essentially rewriting the game from scratch.

Pogi.G · Jan 26, 2023

Korzax Stonehammer said:
It all depends. What are your expectations. Only you can decide if they are too high. And what do you think EQ has become that you are now completely out of touch with it.
If you played on Mischeif and then say that the game no longer feels the same way, then yeah, the game was radically changed for that server. But if you are playing on one of the phinny clones, less so.

Every year there will be less people that play on the tlp's at launch. Launch is so much fun. Don't miss out on a closing window. But if you really want nostalgia, you play P99. But most folks really don't want that anymore. They want to see the scenery, not be stuck in traffic.

I think 'most people' on the offical forums is one guy with 50 email accounts.

I tried to play P99 when green broke out, but some of the magic about EQ classic was that I was 17 almost 18 when it came out. I wasn't out of high school, no job, and no real responsibilities. I drove home from school, logged in, and would typically play until about 2-3 in the morning. Get up at 7 and do it all over again.

Now, I own a company with 70ish employees, married, and 5 kids. I think I made it to level 7 on my ogre warrior on green before I realized that there is not a snowballs chance in hell that I will ever have the time to invest in it like I did back then. Sad, but that is life.

Hopefully, p99 will still be around and have green server v.20 when I retire. Maybe then I'll have the time it requires.

It was fantastic, and I absolutely loved that I got a chance to experience it in March of 99; although, sadly, I have also come to the realization that the captivating appeal that EQ had back then will probably never happen again.

Pogi Ironhorse <Legion> and <Cestus Dei> Veeshan server

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