Final Fantasy: Brave Exvius

  • Guest, it's time once again for the massively important and exciting FoH Asshat Tournament!



    Go here and give us your nominations!
    Who's been the biggest Asshat in the last year? Give us your worst ones!
Gavinmad

Gavinmad

Mr. Poopybutthole
43,738
52,286
2B is garbage, but 9S is a really solid support, and both 9S and 21O TMs are broken as fuck. Plus the raid gacha unit has a 20% hp TM which should retire every single one of my 15% hp materia heh
 
T

Tiphares

Golden Squire
698
40
I am pretty sure i will want 2 of 9S for his TM. If i happen to pull 2B then great, but i am not going ham for her. I am sure i will get a 21O or two along the way as well. Will have to wait and see on the GE units. Definitely trying to save for Onion Knight next.
 
Sinzar

Sinzar

Trakanon Raider
3,149
269
Orlandeau, Dark Veritas etc can do well with minimal teambuilding, but with a proper setup, Onion will outdps them all.
 
Sinzar

Sinzar

Trakanon Raider
3,149
269
Just for fun, let's compare Dark Veritas to Onion Knight with BIS except 5* TM's (beyond their own):

Gear:
Onion (5 TM's):
Weap1: Onion Sword (Onion TM)
Weap2: Aigon's Fist (Trial Reward)
Helm: Black Cowl (Hayate TM)
Chest: Demon Mail (Trial Reward)
Acc1: Champion Belt (Snow TM)
Acc2: Champion Belt (Snow TM)
Materia1: Greatsword Mastery (Trial Reward)
Materia2: Fist Mastery (Trial Reward)
Materia3: +40% Atk (Earth Veritas TM)
Materia4: +30% Atk (Trial Reward)


Dark Veritas (5 TM's):
Weap1: Organyx (Event Reward)
Weap2: Genji Blade (Trial Reward)
Helm: Imperial Helm (Event Reward)
Chest: Demon Mail (Trial Reward)
Acc1: Desch TM (Desch TM)
Acc2: Desch TM (Desch TM)
Materia1: Greatsword Mastery (Trial Reward)
Materia2: Blade Mastery (Chizuru TM)
Materia3: Dual Wield (Zidane TM)
Materia4: +60% Atk (Dark Veritas TM)

Onion Knight: 1,189 ATK
457,777 damage w/ Onion Cutter vs 50 DEF

Dark Veritas: 955 ATK
239,242 damage w/ Dark Ruination vs 50 DEF
358,863 damage w/ 50% imperil included vs 50 DEF

Bonus: Dark Veritas with Genji Glove + Earth Veritas TM instead of DualWield/Desch TM
Dark Veritas w/ Genji: 1,001 atk
264,788 damage w/ Dark Ruination vs 50 DEF
397,182 damage w/ 50% imperil included vs 50 DEF

Now, those numbers are with DV using his own 50% imperil and Onion using no imperil at all. If we want to get crazy and add something like a Dark Cecil finisher (-100% dark imperil) and give Onion a Darkness Weapon to take advantage of it..... it's not even close anymore.

Extra credit to Onion for having the strongest DEF break at -74% (when it's relevant), and a +105% party ATK buff on his limit break (+200% hightide and auto-limit in his BIS gear).
 
Last edited:
Vinen

Vinen

God is dead
2,790
495
Sinzar said:
Just for fun, let's compare Dark Veritas to Onion Knight with BIS except 5* TM's (beyond their own):

Gear:
Onion (5 TM's):
Weap1: Onion Sword (Onion TM)
Weap2: Aigon's Fist (Trial Reward)
Helm: Black Cowl (Hayate TM)
Chest: Demon Mail (Trial Reward)
Acc1: Champion Belt (Snow TM)
Acc2: Champion Belt (Snow TM)
Materia1: Greatsword Mastery (Trial Reward)
Materia2: Fist Mastery (Trial Reward)
Materia3: +40% Atk (Earth Veritas TM)
Materia4: +30% Atk (Trial Reward)


Dark Veritas (5 TM's):
Weap1: Organyx (Event Reward)
Weap2: Genji Blade (Trial Reward)
Helm: Imperial Helm (Event Reward)
Chest: Demon Mail (Trial Reward)
Acc1: Desch TM (Desch TM)
Acc2: Desch TM (Desch TM)
Materia1: Greatsword Mastery (Trial Reward)
Materia2: Blade Mastery (Chizuru TM)
Materia3: Dual Wield (Zidane TM)
Materia4: +60% Atk (Dark Veritas TM)

Onion Knight: 1,189 ATK
457,777 damage w/ Onion Cutter vs 50 DEF

Dark Veritas: 955 ATK
239,242 damage w/ Dark Ruination vs 50 DEF
358,863 damage w/ 50% imperil included vs 50 DEF

Bonus: Dark Veritas with Genji Glove + Earth Veritas TM instead of DualWield/Desch TM
Dark Veritas w/ Genji: 1,001 atk
264,788 damage w/ Dark Ruination vs 50 DEF
397,182 damage w/ 50% imperil included vs 50 DEF

Now, those numbers are with DV using his own 50% imperil and Onion using no imperil at all. If we want to get crazy and add something like a Dark Cecil finisher (-100% dark imperil) and give Onion a Darkness Weapon to take advantage of it..... it's not even close anymore.

Extra credit to Onion for having the strongest DEF break at -74% (when it's relevant), and a +105% party ATK buff on his limit break (+200% hightide and auto-limit in his BIS gear).
Click to expand...

Keep telling yourself this. You need an external imperil for Onion Cutter. This in an of itself makes it worse.
Do you want to lose a finisher slot for an imperil?
 
Sinzar

Sinzar

Trakanon Raider
3,149
269
I'm guessing you didn't look at the numbers? Onion Cutter with no imperil still outdamages Veritas with imperil.

The reason is that Onion has 192 base ATK, with 80% passive and innate dualwield (another TMR slot freed up). DV has 180 base atk with 70% passive and has to "waste" a TMR on dualwield/genji.
It's also 520% Onion Cutter vs 400% Dark Ruination.
 
Last edited:
GonzytheMage

GonzytheMage

Golden Knight of the Realm
627
102
Go me, I farmed a rainbow robe to add like 2 more MAG over sirens robe for Fryevia. Can't break 900 MAG without genji glove or a creepy mask I guess. Sad times.

How many ribbons and discernments should I farm up guys?
 
Vinen

Vinen

God is dead
2,790
495
Sinzar said:
I'm guessing you didn't look at the numbers? Onion Cutter with no imperil still outdamages Veritas with imperil.

The reason is that Onion has 192 base ATK, with 80% passive and innate dualwield (another TMR slot freed up). DV has 180 base atk with 70% passive and has to "waste" a TMR on dualwield/genji.
It's also 520% Onion Cutter vs 400% Dark Ruination.
Click to expand...

Still not seeing how OK does more damage without imperil.
Please post the full math including formulas.

What you posted has a funny smell.
 
Sinzar

Sinzar

Trakanon Raider
3,149
269
Vinen said:
Still not seeing how OK does more damage without imperil.
Please post the full math including formulas.

What you posted has a funny smell.
Click to expand...
If I'm wrong, please point it out, especially because I've been saving for Onion for a long time. Formula's are from the Wiki. Calculations as follows:

Using the above gear loadout (see earlier post), Onion has 1044 mainhand atk, 1054 offhand atk (on Odin). Onion Cutter does 5.2x damage.
Dark Veritas (using the Genji loadout) has 893 atk mainhand, 926 atk offhand, Dark Ruination does 2x damage + 50% def ignore + 50% imperil.

Sigh having to retype this by hand from my spreadsheet!

Weapon Variance and Final Variance left out, because it's the same for everyone. Enemy base Def of 50 for example. 0 Def break applied.

Physical damage: (Unit ATK2 / Enemy DEF) * Physical Killer Effects * Elemental Weakness/Resistance * Skill Modifier * Level Correction * Weapon Variance * Final Variance

Onion Cutter Mainhand:
Atk = 1044 * 1044
Enemy Def = 50
Def Ignore = 0
Imperil = 0
Skill Mod = 5.2
Level Correction = 2
((1044*1044)/50) * 5.2 * 2 = 226,706 (mainhand swing)

Onion Cutter Offhand:
Atk = 1054 * 1054
Enemy Def = 50
Def Ignore = 0
Imperil = 0
Skill Mod = 5.2
Level Correction = 2
((1054*1054)/50) * 5.2 * 2 = 231,071 (offhand swing)

Final Damage Onion Cutter: 457,777

Dark Ruination Mainhand:
Atk = 893 * 893
Enemy Def = 50
Def Ignore = 50% (*0.5)
Imperil = 50% (*1.5)
Skill Mod = 2
Level Correction = 2
((893*893)/(50*0.5)) * 1.5 * 2 * 2 = 191,387 (mainhand swing)

Dark Ruination Offhand:
Atk = 926 * 926
Enemy Def = 50
Def Ignore = 50% (*0.5)
Imperil = 50% (*1.5)
Skill Mod = 2
Level Correction = 2
((926*926)/(50*0.5)) * 1.5 * 2 * 2 = 205,794 (offhand swing)

Final Damage Dark Ruination: 397,181

So even with no Imperil, Onion Cutter does more damage. Again, please point out a flaw in the math, because I don't claim to be perfect.
 
T

Tiphares

Golden Squire
698
40
GonzytheMage said:
How many ribbons and discernments should I farm up guys?
Click to expand...
Ideally, one for everone that is susceptible to status ailments. Tank should be immune to most between the helm and other gear. Then just need to cover the rest of the team. A minimum, i would say 2 of each.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 user
Angelwatch

Angelwatch

Trakanon Raider
3,053
133
One thing I'll point to in Sinzar's favor is that a lot of things are dark resistant or immune. So OK should always be able to do solid damage where DV gets gimped on some fights.
 
Vinen

Vinen

God is dead
2,790
495
Sinzar said:
If I'm wrong, please point it out, especially because I've been saving for Onion for a long time. Formula's are from the Wiki. Calculations as follows:

Using the above gear loadout (see earlier post), Onion has 1044 mainhand atk, 1054 offhand atk (on Odin). Onion Cutter does 5.2x damage.
Dark Veritas (using the Genji loadout) has 893 atk mainhand, 926 atk offhand, Dark Ruination does 2x damage + 50% def ignore + 50% imperil.

Sigh having to retype this by hand from my spreadsheet!

Weapon Variance and Final Variance left out, because it's the same for everyone. Enemy base Def of 50 for example. 0 Def break applied.

Physical damage: (Unit ATK2 / Enemy DEF) * Physical Killer Effects * Elemental Weakness/Resistance * Skill Modifier * Level Correction * Weapon Variance * Final Variance

Onion Cutter Mainhand:
Atk = 1044 * 1044
Enemy Def = 50
Def Ignore = 0
Imperil = 0
Skill Mod = 5.2
Level Correction = 2
((1044*1044)/50) * 5.2 * 2 = 226,706 (mainhand swing)

Onion Cutter Offhand:
Atk = 1054 * 1054
Enemy Def = 50
Def Ignore = 0
Imperil = 0
Skill Mod = 5.2
Level Correction = 2
((1054*1054)/50) * 5.2 * 2 = 231,071 (offhand swing)

Final Damage Onion Cutter: 457,777

Dark Ruination Mainhand:
Atk = 893 * 893
Enemy Def = 50
Def Ignore = 50% (*0.5)
Imperil = 50% (*1.5)
Skill Mod = 2
Level Correction = 2
((893*893)/(50*0.5)) * 1.5 * 2 * 2 = 191,387 (mainhand swing)

Dark Ruination Offhand:
Atk = 926 * 926
Enemy Def = 50
Def Ignore = 50% (*0.5)
Imperil = 50% (*1.5)
Skill Mod = 2
Level Correction = 2
((926*926)/(50*0.5)) * 1.5 * 2 * 2 = 205,794 (offhand swing)

Final Damage Dark Ruination: 397,181

So even with no Imperil, Onion Cutter does more damage. Again, please point out a flaw in the math, because I don't claim to be perfect.
Click to expand...

How are you spec'ing out OK's ATK. It seems way higher then it should be.
You are also underspecing the ATK that DV will have.

This is a poor comparison. You should be doing a BIS comparison not a F2P comparison.
 
Sinzar

Sinzar

Trakanon Raider
3,149
269
Vinen said:
How are you spec'ing out OK's ATK. It seems way higher then it should be.
You are also underspecing the ATK that DV will have.
Click to expand...
Totally posted this a few posts back!

Onion (5 TM's):
Weap1: Onion Sword (Onion TM)
Weap2: Aigon's Fist (Trial Reward)
Helm: Black Cowl (Hayate TM)
Chest: Demon Mail (Trial Reward)
Acc1: Champion Belt (Snow TM)
Acc2: Champion Belt (Snow TM)
Materia1: Greatsword Mastery (Trial Reward)
Materia2: Fist Mastery (Trial Reward)
Materia3: +40% Atk (Earth Veritas TM)
Materia4: +30% Atk (Trial Reward)


Dark Veritas (5 TM's):
Weap1: Organyx (Event Reward)
Weap2: Genji Blade (Trial Reward)
Helm: Imperial Helm (Event Reward)
Chest: Demon Mail (Trial Reward)
Acc1: Desch TM (Desch TM)
Acc2: Desch TM (Desch TM)
Materia1: Greatsword Mastery (Trial Reward)
Materia2: Blade Mastery (Chizuru TM)
Materia3: Dual Wield (Zidane TM)
Materia4: +60% Atk (Dark Veritas TM)

Without going whale mode crazy with 5* TM's, what's better option for DV gear?
 
Sinzar

Sinzar

Trakanon Raider
3,149
269
Vinen said:
This is a poor comparison. You should be doing a BIS comparison not a F2P comparison.
Click to expand...

The original discussion started based on who should most people go for (assuming they're not going for both). Even in pure whale mode BIS gear, OK still wins, but I don't feel like retyping an enormous comparison to prove it again.
 
Vinen

Vinen

God is dead
2,790
495
Sinzar said:
The original discussion started based on who should most people go for (assuming they're not going for both). Even in pure whale mode BIS gear, OK still wins, but I don't feel like retyping an enormous comparison to prove it again.
Click to expand...

I'm discussing it with someone rightnow
We are coming out with 1130 ATK (not Onion Knight: 1,189 ATK) as being pure BIS for OK at release. That also includes both weapons. So no idea where you are getting such high values for each hand.

Where are you getting you ATK numbers from? We modeld' it off Luneth who has the same base and then added

Edit: You are 100% correct in which one does more damage assuming BIS for Turn 1. Turn two with the Imperil already applied Dark Veritas does more damage.

Math-boy I'm talking to is stating it will take 4 turns to break even. Keeping in mind this is with no external Imperil and no counter. If DKC counters the tables wildly swing in in the favor of Dark Veritas.
 
Last edited:
Sinzar

Sinzar

Trakanon Raider
3,149
269
Vinen said:
Where are you getting you ATK numbers from?
Click to expand...

Base: 192
Passives: +80%
Odin: +62

Weap1: Onion Sword +135
Weap2: Aigon's Fist +145
Helm: Black Cowl +28
Chest: Demon Mail +10
Acc1: Champion Belt +30 and +20%
Acc2: Champion Belt +30 and +20%
Materia1: Greatsword Mastery +50%
Materia2: Fist Mastery +50%
Materia3: +40% Atk (Earth Veritas TM)
Materia4: +30% Atk

192 base + 80% (passive) + 210% (gear) = 749
62 (odin) + helm, chest, acc1, acc2 = 160

749 + 160 = 909 atk (global)

909 + 135 (mainhand weap) = 1044
909 + 145 (offhand weap) = 1054

1189 tooltip "fake" atk on char sheet

Add in Adventurer lvl 5 for an extra 10% if you want to go real whale mode with refreshing expeditions (brings OK to the 300% passive cap), or a 2nd Earth Veritas TM if they stack (they won't).

Edit: Refreshing expeditions dont work!
 
Last edited:
Vinen

Vinen

God is dead
2,790
495
> Refreshing Expeditions

This isn't possible. You can't spend money to force them to finish... less I would have. The best you can do is refresh and hope for 3HR B? or are there A also. I don't really pay attention to it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.