Flu Outbreak

You can't get sick from a vax that doesn't use live virus (aka most versions of the flu shot - dunno if she's getting the one version that isn't which I think might be the nasal one?).

The "sick" feeling you get in those instances is a stimulation of the immune system. Not full blown flu. Just putting that out there. Biochemically speaking impossible to contract the flu or any other viral disease from a vax that isn't 'live'.

Yeah that was the other lecture he gave me, about how I am a moron for saying "the shot makes me sick."

chaos_sl said:

Yeah that was the other lecture he gave me, about how I am a moron for saying "the shot makes me sick."

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He's right. Like literally its impossible given how it works. Which I understand not a lot of folks specifically understand the mechanics (and the chief reason I do was that my concentrated areas of study while a biochem major was virology, immunology and genetics) but its not possible. When they 'kill' the virus they essentially remove the genetic material. Which codes for the actual cell invasion and replication process. The virus cant use your body cells to replicate if there's nothing there to replicate. All the vax is is the 'protein coat' (a virus is essentially an outer protein coat shell with genetic material (RNA or DNA) - that's it) and how your body develops immunity is that your cells need to be able to learn to recognize the outer protein coat as 'foe' and create specific killer cells to bind to said protein coat and destroy it before there are so many protein coats (ie an actual infection) that it temporarily overwhelms your system.

So without the ability to replicate you literally can't be infected. And you can't have the ability to replicate without the presence of genetic material. And removal of genetic material is how you 'kill' a virus.

I'm oversimplifying of course but that's the basic principle.

Edit - I do want to be clear not all vaccines are 'dead' - some are live (I think one component of the MMR is IIRC) - but when you're talking about a vaccine that is solely dead viruses there's no infection risk.

Cutlery_sl said:

I didn't say it gave her the flu.

I do however think it's got a long way to go before it deserves to be called a vaccine and treated with the same respect the rest are. It's fucking snake oil, in my book. Of course, I think the flu is fucking bullshit too. Either the flu is this giant pandemic that can cripple the country and every man, woman and child needs to be vaccinated immediately, or it's a fucking sniffle and you sit at home and eat some chicken noodle soup and sleep alot. It can't be both.

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The term 'vaccine' has no implications of efficacy. Respect...meh that's another thing as well.

The problem with the flu isn't the flu itself its the secondary complications and infections that can arise in at risk populations (which is why I'm meh about getting it when otherwise not knocked up). So children, the elderly, pregnant women, people who are immunocompromised but can receive vaccines with minimal risk.....60% protection >>>>>>>>>>>> 0%. Its pretty simple math.

You also oversimplify when you say 'the flu must be one or the other, a problem or a sniffle'. Certain strains are much worse than others. Its like ebola. Last time I looked into it there were three identified strains and one was MUCH less worse than the other two. And I think that's the one that they're saying actually is more of a flu like infection in a lot of the population. But I highly doubt you'd say the same thing about ebola.

I would never go to the ER for the flu because my co-pay for it is $500.

Ive never had a serious cold, strep, flu, pneumonia, bronchitis, or anything. My immune system is likely armed with the biological equivalent of M60 wielding Arnold Schwarzeneggers. Then again, I get an allergic reaction every year or so when the pollen comes around.

Cutlery_sl said:

I didn't say it gave her the flu.

I do however think it's got a long way to go before it deserves to be called a vaccine and treated with the same respect the rest are. It's fucking snake oil, in my book. Of course, I think the flu is fucking bullshit too. Either the flu is this giant pandemic that can cripple the country and every man, woman and child needs to be vaccinated immediately, or it's a fucking sniffle and you sit at home and eat some chicken noodle soup and sleep alot. It can't be both.

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Well of course it is just a sniffle until it isn't. You've never seen a serious pandemic in your lifetime, you don't know what that looks like, so to you the flu is some minor annoyance. That isn't historically the case. Saying it is either one or the other thing is just willful ignorance.

Yeah, but the last time there was a flu pandemic was prior to the modern era (in a modern country). I mean, did they even use soap regularly back in the early 20th century? And I don't wanna hear shit about the ones they call pandemics where like a few hundred people die. That's not a pandemic, that's just a day in the world.

As an able bodied adult, I say fuck getting the flu vaccine.

Everyone has an elderly grandma/grandpa and a young nephew/niece/cousin. If you aren't getting it for yourself, get the flu shot for them.

Elurin_sl said:

Yeah, but the last time there was a flu pandemic was prior to the modern era (in a modern country). I mean, did they even use soap regularly back in the early 20th century? And I don't wanna hear shit about the ones they call pandemics where like a few hundred people die. That's not a pandemic, that's just a day in the world.

As an able bodied adult, I say fuck getting the flu vaccine.

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The 50s and 60s had pretty bad pandemics. Yes, obviously the media sells the scare tactics for everything they can. Media gonna media. But saying the ERs around the country are filling up with panicking healthy people who got a cold is just as bad, if not worse. At least the media inspires people to action.

Had a flu shot, thought I had the flu Thursday,(puking the shits, fever etc.) only to be almost a 100% better by Friday. Found out it was food poisoning from a local Chinese joint down the street. I will never eat at that shithole again.

Cutlery_sl said:

Oh come the fuck on. "Flu season" is the biggest overblown pile of shit that currently exists. There's absolutely no reason for anyone with any normal health conditions to give half a shit about it, and yet here we are, with scare tactic 'EVERYONE GET A VACCINE QUICK B4 U DIE" campaigns and overloaded emergency rooms because of a little post nasal drip.

If you're 80, yeah, fine, go get a shot. If you're 30 (which most of us are), put your big girl panties on and get over it.

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My brother who was 30 when this happened had a rare complication of myocarditis from having the flu. It enlarged his heart and almost killed him.

Elurin_sl said:

Yeah, but the last time there was a flu pandemic was prior to the modern era (in a modern country). I mean, did they even use soap regularly back in the early 20th century? And I don't wanna hear shit about the ones they call pandemics where like a few hundred people die. That's not a pandemic, that's just a day in the world.

As an able bodied adult, I say fuck getting the flu vaccine.

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Actually, the last influenza pandemic was H1N1 in 2009. A pandemic is classified as a disease that spreads across a large region.

Yeah, I said I didn't wanna hear about those. Sure, the definition of a pandemic may be that, but when someone hears pandemic, they picture shit hitting the fan and 1/3 of the population dying. 2009 fits the definition of a pandemic, but it certainly wasn't a dire matter.

Shit, looking it up, the most serious pandemic is a category 5. That's only a 2% death rate. I'll take my chances.

Wolfen_sl said:

I would never go to the ER for the flu because my co-pay for it is $500.

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The people in the US who go to the emergency room for the FLU, or even pregnancy tests are the ones with no insurance or medicaid who aren't going to pay the bill anyways. You walk into a private doctors office with no insurance and no way to pay, you're getting turned away, whereas an ER generally can't turn you away except in rare circumstances(like this flu ordeal filling up hospitals in some cities).

Read an article a while back about a lady who always went to the ER to get a pregnancy test rather than spending $15 on one at the store, because she just didn't pay the bill. Same idea for the flu

yeah what Cutlery said is pretty fucking retarded. You not only get a flu shot to make yourself less likely to get the flu, but you get it because you're also less likely to pass it on if you do get it, but don't get sick from it.

Had my boss claim she got swine flu over Christmas. She no doubt had the flu but the swine flu? I'm not sure I believe her. Then of course she comes back to the office saying she's better except for a sore throat which turned out to be strep...