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Captain Suave said:

While the direct mortality rate from measles is low, 1 in 10 kids infected suffered hearing loss and it can cause bigtime problems for pregnant women. If you don't think measles are scary enough, insert your disease of choice. Structure is the same.

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I already know I am going to get a lot of shit for this, but I don't care.

I keep seeing this same anti-vaxx = stupid meme over and over. Anybody who treats something as complex as the human immune system and biology as this simple one line subject indicates their intelligence. Additionally, the way people recite their doctors words or health professionals with the same fervor as the religious people they love to bash astounds me.

Scientific reasoning predicates that we are always skeptical i.e. we don't just assume something is working even if all the evidence points to it being that way. We may have missed something. Case and point this chart you linked. I always see it and I always ask the same question. What happened before the dates listed? Could this chart just be a small sample size designed to make vaccines look more impressive? Turns out the answer is yes.



Death from disease has been on the decline since the 1900's. This notion that vaccines are the holy grail to combating diseases is a shallow look at a broad span of history.

Furthermore the fact that people are so willing trust these vaccine manufactures that cannot be held civilly liable is baffling. If you could operate with impunity what would you do? Do you know how much money is in vaccines?

Dismissing peoples arguments (as long as the argument comes from a place of sincerity) keeps you stupid. Consider the other side. I have looked at both sides of the argument and I feel comfortable sitting in the no vaccination camp (for now) and I respect your right to be in the vaccination camp, but can we please stop with this belittling dismissive attitude towards a very nuanced subject that has dire consequences on both sides of the fence?

Health Sentinel - Vaccines
Products - Vital Statistics of the US - Homepage

Also, here are some pictures so you don't think I am a total shitbag.



Plasma jets coming off a black hole

projoking said:

I already know I am going to get a lot of shit for this, but I don't care.

I keep seeing this same anti-vaxx = stupid meme over and over. Anybody who treats something as complex as the human immune system and biology as this simple one line subject indicates their intelligence. Additionally, the way people recite their doctors words or health professionals with the same fervor as the religious people they love to bash astounds me.

Scientific reasoning predicates that we are always skeptical i.e. we don't just assume something is working even if all the evidence points to it being that way. We may have missed something. Case and point this chart you linked. I always see it and I always ask the same question. What happened before the dates listed? Could this chart just be a small sample size designed to make vaccines look more impressive? Turns out the answer is yes.


Death from disease has been on the decline since the 1900's. This notion that vaccines are the holy grail to combating diseases is a shallow look at a broad span of history.

Furthermore the fact that people are so willing trust these vaccine manufactures that cannot be held civilly liable is baffling. If you could operate with impunity what would you do? Do you know how much money is in vaccines?

Dismissing peoples arguments (as long as the argument comes from a place of sincerity) keeps you stupid. Consider the other side. I have looked at both sides of the argument and I feel comfortable sitting in the no vaccination camp (for now) and I respect your right to be in the vaccination camp, but can we please stop with this belittling dismissive attitude towards a very nuanced subject that has dire consequences on both sides of the fence?

Health Sentinel - Vaccines
Products - Vital Statistics of the US - Homepage

Also, here are some pictures so you don't think I am a total shitbag.

Click to expand...

Did you mean to win the Dunning-Kruger prize, or just stumble into it?

I hope you put as much effort into 2nd guessing every other expert in your life; be them Chef, Auto Mechanic, or Builder. If for no other reason than it'll burn up all so many extra hours you would otherwise be out and about bothering normal people.

No, I'm not even going to try to refute your fruitloops; you can call it winning, I'll call it having better things to do.

projoking said:

Could this chart just be a small sample size designed to make vaccines look more impressive? Turns out the answer is yes.

View attachment 192909

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No, what you have done is to pick a metric and scale that obscures the effect of vaccines compared to improvements in the availability and quality of medical care to the general population. Of course the death rates had been going down. Sick people were getting better treatment and died less often. This is an expected and good thing in a society with improving standards of living, and a separable causality from vaccination.

There isn't data going fully back to 1900, but here's measles reported cases per 100k (adjusts for effects of changing population size, which the first round of charts did not) back to 1920. Data wasn't even collected nationally in the US until 1912.

Ninen said:

Did you mean to win the Dunning-Kruger prize, or just stumble into it?

I hope you put as much effort into 2nd guessing every other expert in your life; be them Chef, Auto Mechanic, or Builder. If for no other reason than it'll burn up all so many extra hours you would otherwise be out and about bothering normal people.

No, I'm not even going to try to refute your fruitloops; you can call it winning, I'll call it having better things to do.

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I'm sorry you felt the need to be so mean towards me. I understand though it's easy to be mean to people on the internet. You know nothing about me. All the best to you.

Captain Suave said:

No, what you have done is to pick a metric and scale that obscures the effect of vaccines compared to improvements in the availability and quality of medical care to the general population. Of course the death rates had been going down. Sick people were getting better treatment and died less often. This is an expected and good thing in a society with improving standards of living, and a separable causality from vaccination.

There isn't data going fully back to 1900, but here's measles reported cases per 100k (adjusts for effects of changing population size, which the first round of charts did not) back to 1920. Data wasn't even collected nationally in the US until 1912.

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Thanks for the info. Do you have citations? I am not trying to be an asshole, just would like to read what you are talking about.

projoking said:

Thanks for the info. Do you have citations? I am not trying to be an asshole, just would like to read what you are talking about.

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I'll PM and avoid shitting up FSR further. Appreciate the civil engagement.

Hey look, it's a couple of retarded new posters ruining FSR talking about how vaccinations are bad and/or meaningless. On the bright side, we don't have to worry about them living very long!

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Gamma Rays said:

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View attachment 192933

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Which one of the swords from the Lord of the Rings looks like a samurai sword?



Was it Glamdring?



Or maybe Orcrist?

Perhaps, but I don't think it looks like this...

Captain Suave said:

I'll PM and avoid shitting up FSR further. Appreciate the civil engagement.

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I wanted to say thanks for taking the time to thoughtfully respond to my post. I did read your citations and see why my statement about sample size was incorrect. I'll keep researching and endeavor to learn more on the subject.

Sorry for another momentary derail, but I wanted to post this response for all those who are being so vitriolic towards my post. Not everyone is a nut job and being dismissive and mean is easy, but taking the time to respond to people thoughtfully just might pay off.