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Siliconemelons

Siliconemelons

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I live in a place where 200k normal 1950 block homes on 0.15 Acer lots and bought to be torn down and replaced with McMansions. 1m+ people dense in the county...

You people with land...so jelly...

If I hadn't just made the best career choice in my life and my wife lined up in hers where she wants to be- we would be willing to move... but we got blessed with our house and no complaints...It's just nice to have some ... space.

I would post pics- but I also made a playset - just ordered a few brackets and the swing hardware - did the rest of it myself as a hybrid of a few plans I liked - for space reasons lol.

Its many years old now and weathered AF...so, yeah... but to this day my big ol self can play on it with the kids and it's solid.
 
Noodleface

Noodleface

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If you call it a shed sure. It's this giant two story thing. The ugliest yet most glorious shed I've ever seen
 
Foler

The_Black_Log Foler

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Ok boys. Need some advice. Have a pretty small 2 bed 2 bath cabin. Built pre 1965 so the thing is all concrete block and with wood interior paneling.

Needs to be repiped.. Sucks because some of the wood paneling will prob need to be cut and block removed.

I've gotten two bids so far. My biggest question right now is pex or cpvc? One company wants to use zurn pex which currently has a class action going against it for early failures and quoted me 4.7k... Other gave me a 6.2k quote for cpvc (seems overpriced?)

Internet seems to prefer pex but some people seem to think rats are an issue. Place is in Florida in the middle of the woods. Ideally rats won't be getting in, I mean that's a whole nother problem if they are? I've heard downsides to pex like make sure you get uponor pex-a but then some people recommended pex-b for max flow less toxic, then some people just said cpvc is easier to fix.

Problem with this old house is if a leak happens it's gonna be a BITCH to get to with block wall and wood panels. I already have no idea how I'll fix the wood paneling to match.

Tldr: pex vs cpvc on old old house and why?
 
Foler

The_Black_Log Foler

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Also is 20 ft between water heater and bathroom/kitchen gonna be annoying amount of wait time in hot water? Really don't wanna do added cost of recirculator.
 
BrutulTM

BrutulTM

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I love pex, and I would never pay a plumber to install it because it's so easy to use. I re-plumbed my whole house with it in a day and a half for about $500. Why do you need to re-pipe the cabin? Pex has an added benefit for a cabin because if a heater fails while you're gone and things freeze up it won't break, but I don't imagine that's a consideration in Florida. I can't imagine why anyone would say CPVC is easier to repair. I don't think any aspect of plumbing is easier than with pex.

20 feet isn't too bad. You will have to wait a few seconds for hot water but I don't think it will be too annoying.
 
Foler

The_Black_Log Foler

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BrutulTM said:
I love pex, and I would never pay a plumber to install it because it's so easy to use. I re-plumbed my whole house with it in a day and a half for about $500. Why do you need to re-pipe the cabin? Pex has an added benefit for a cabin because if a heater fails while you're gone and things freeze up it won't break, but I don't imagine that's a consideration in Florida. I can't imagine why anyone would say CPVC is easier to repair. I don't think any aspect of plumbing is easier than with pex.

20 feet isn't too bad. You will have to wait a few seconds for hot water but I don't think it will be too annoying.
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Right now it's all polybutyene and there's loose pipes coming out of walls, poor piping places. It's just not worth repairing. Place hasn't been lived in in like 50 years. Also want a laundry/dryer hookup installed. Hell I went to go plug in my router yesterday for the cable I had run to the house, all the outlets are 2 prong! No 3... Soo now I gotta do that.

It's such a shitshow with plumbers. One company that gave me a bid for a decent price wants to do zurn pex which currently has a class action against it so I've crossed then off the list. The other company wants 6600 fucking $ to do viega pex-b which seems overpriced... There's tons of plumbing companies around with 4.7-5 star reviews but you go to their bad ones and it's fucking horror stories.

I honestly am not sure what to do. It's like rolling a dice hoping they do a good job. Get another bid or overpay for these guys who seem like they're on the ball with QA.
 
Foler

The_Black_Log Foler

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lurkingdirk said:
There is no good reason for that. I didn't know they were, but I'd do some research. Pex is superior in every way.
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I've done the research and I don't doubt you. But it seems like there's some shenanigans in Florida with insurance on it. One company I wanted a quote from said they only do cpvc because of it, that and rats.
 
Uber Uberest

Uber Uberest

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CPVC is the better product. The fittings for CPVC are similar to copperthe pipe goes in to the socket of the fitting, thus allowing no restriction of flow, you get 1/2” flow through a 1/2” pipe.

Pex on the other hand the fitting goes inside the pipe, immediately choking down your 1/2” nominal diameter. This is why high efficiency tankless water heaters struggle in these newer built homes where pex is used. Same for shower with multiple sprayers.

The internet is full of homeowners using this stuff and raving about how easy it is to use, but they have no idea about demand factors and factor values.

The installation of CPVC looks more professional as well, which in Massachusetts is a requirement in our plumbing code. This is just an aesthetic preference to me. You would prefer to see my installation of CPVC in a house you were building versus another plumbers installation of Pex.

I have never, and will never use pex in my
 
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Foler

The_Black_Log Foler

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Uber Uberest said:
CPVC is the better product. The fittings for CPVC are similar to copperthe pipe goes in to the socket of the fitting, thus allowing no restriction of flow, you get 1/2” flow through a 1/2” pipe.

Pex on the other hand the fitting goes inside the pipe, immediately choking down your 1/2” nominal diameter. This is why high efficiency tankless water heaters struggle in these newer built homes where pex is used. Same for shower with multiple sprayers.

The internet is full of homeowners using this stuff and raving about how easy it is to use, but they have no idea about demand factors and factor values.

The installation of CPVC looks more professional as well, which in Massachusetts is a requirement in our plumbing code. This is just an aesthetic preference to me. You would prefer to see my installation of CPVC in a house you were building versus another plumbers installation of Pex.

I have never, and will never use pex in my
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Hah. So funny, most of the raving reviews were from DIY's saying how easy it was to install. Yep I was aware of the crimps cutting down on flow, uponor makes expansion ones that allegedly solve this but it's pex-a. Fuck it cpvc it is.
 
Uber Uberest

Uber Uberest

rdr^2
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Even with Uponor A the pipe is still going over the fitting, and the fittings aren’t a true nominal size.

Pricing is tough, but for new construction or remodels, in the Boston area, you can figure between $1200-$1500 per fixture, with the owner buying finishes (faucets, toilet, sinks, anything where appearance is a preference) so a 3 piece bathroom is generally $3500-$4500 as a fair price.
 
BrutulTM

BrutulTM

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Plumbers don't like pex because it's so easy to use that people do it themselves instead of paying plumbers. The real old school plumbers swear that only copper is acceptable because they can really charge for that shit. If water restriction is an issue, just use a 3/4" line. The numbers in the post above are outrageous to me for how much work is actually done. I don't have any problem with people charging it if they can get it, but I would never pay it. $3500-4500 to plumb in a toilet, sink and shower into a bathroom? Half a day's work for one guy with very little skill required and knowledge that is readily available online and maybe $200 worth of materials. The only reason you can get that kind of money is because people don't realize how easy it is or they're scared of getting it inspected.
 
Khane

Khane

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BrutulTM said:
Plumbers don't like pex because it's so easy to use that people do it themselves instead of paying plumbers. The real old school plumbers swear that only copper is acceptable because they can really charge for that shit. If water restriction is an issue, just use a 3/4" line. The numbers in the post above are outrageous to me for how much work is actually done. I don't have any problem with people charging it if they can get it, but I would never pay it. $3500-4500 to plumb in a toilet, sink and shower into a bathroom? Half a day's work for one guy with very little skill required and knowledge that is readily available online and maybe $200 worth of materials.
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This doesn't make any sense. It's not like the vast majority of a plumber's customers are asking for cpvc specifically, a plumber could get away with using pex themselves very easily if they wanted to and could still charge whatever it is they want to charge.

A plumber's money comes from labor, not materials upcharges.
 
BrutulTM

BrutulTM

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PVC doesn't cost more than pex really. It takes longer to install though, and is easier to fuck up. You can make it look nicer because it goes in straight lines, but in some ways that's bad for the customer (more elbows, longer runs because you can't go places diagonally, so you have to run out more cold water before the hot gets there, etc. Also, nobody looks at plumbing except for plumbers so the straight lines and such don't matter to most customers even if it's a point of pride to the plumber. Where you really hurt the plumber is by not hiring him at all, which is easy to do with pex.
 
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Khane

Khane

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And most customers wouldn't know the difference in installation times or have any idea if the job was taking too long. They would definitely notice lower flow though.
 
BrutulTM

BrutulTM

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No reason for lower flow if you just use a bigger line for higher demand fixtures. Also, the fact that you don't need as many elbows somewhat cancels out the restrictions at the fittings.
 
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