Home Improvement

Oblio · Dec 17, 2021

Lanx said:
oh yea additions, my last house had a (i'm guessing) deck converted into an enclosed sunroom, and the bottom was just gravel and tarp (basically the deck) it was always freezing in the winter and when i went underneath it was just bats loosely sealed with plywood, that coulda used a partial crawlspace to regulate temps more.

but the sunroom looked really nice and i'd consider it a good addition for value and usable sq/ft

would a crawl space have been better? as far as i know, it's the only house on the block w/ an addition (you can see the house further down has the same sized deck)

Adding Above Grade Living Square Footage is always a plus, barring the rare exception where you might ruin your own view which I have seen.

Regarding, the addition in your photo....

In my opinion an actual concrete footing that created an actual crawl space would have been better for livability/climate control, however, without more data I cannot speak to the cost effectiveness of it. What I mean by that is what if that concrete footing install cost is $10,000, but would only make a difference of $400 annually in heating/cooling costs. That is a 25 year break even, not exactly cost effective. I mean maybe you could recoup that in a resale, but the typical market participant isn't going to think of that angle. And the vast majority of so called Real Estate experts (Realtors) will never even mention it, they are sales people they will just highlight the positives of the added sq.ft..

EDIT: Even if the footing only costs $5,000 that would be a 12.5 year breakeven, not super cost effective either. Made up numbers are just that, I am just using them to illustrate my point.

Lanx · Dec 17, 2021

Oblio said:
Adding Above Grade Living Square Footage is always a plus, barring the rare exception where you might ruin your own view which I have seen.

Regarding, the addition in your photo....

In my opinion an actual concrete footing that created an actual crawl space would have been better for livability/climate control, however, without more data I cannot speak to the cost effectiveness of it. What I mean by that is what if that concrete footing install cost is $10,000, but would only make a difference of $400 annually in heating/cooling costs. That is a 25 year break even, not exactly cost effective. I mean maybe you could recoup that in a resale, but the typical market participant isn't going to think of that angle. And the vast majority of so called Real Estate experts (Realtors) will never even mention it, they are sales people they will just highlight the positives of the added sq.ft..

EDIT: Even if the footing only costs $5,000 that would be a 12.5 year breakeven, not super cost effective either. Made up numbers are just that, I am just using them to illustrate my point.

yea 10k for a crawlspace? the previous owner wouldn't have recouped that, in this crazy sellers market, he would have.

but yea since it's a sunroom thats barely used, i doubt it would have added anything, but if it was a livable spare bedroom i'm sure that could be more justified, who wants to wake up to freezing temps

Oblio · Dec 17, 2021

Lanx said:
yea 10k for a crawlspace? the previous owner wouldn't have recouped that, in this crazy sellers market, he would have.

but yea since it's a sunroom thats barely used, i doubt it would have added anything, but if it was a livable spare bedroom i'm sure that could be more justified, who wants to wake up to freezing temps

The way you are describing that space I wonder if it was even permitted, was the finish done in a workman like manor consistent with the remainder of the home? Again, based off your description I don't it was and I don't think it would count as actual living space. It sounds like it was an enclosed porch.

Hateyou · Dec 17, 2021

The pic just looks like an enclosed porch to me, not a living space. People just call them sun rooms for some reason.

Oblio · Dec 17, 2021

I have seen many porches/patios get walls and have heating and cooling ran to them. Heating is a must for it to considered livable sq.ft., I guess I left that out earlier.

Lanx · Dec 18, 2021

Oblio said:
I have seen many porches/patios get walls and have heating and cooling ran to them. Heating is a must for it to considered livable sq.ft., I guess I left that out earlier.

they knocked out the walls in the original house to "open it up" to the sun room, and i guess to "qualify" as a room theres a baseboard heater in there.

Fucker · Dec 18, 2021

Spent an hour fixing the stairs down to the basement.

House was built 16 years ago and cheaply I might add. They STAPLED the basement stairs together which meant they were loud and springy. People have been living here with loud boingy fucking steps and never thought TO FIX IT.

I used screws in it and almost good as done.

The top 3 stairs are off angle so...gotta fix that. Tree DIFFERENT angles too...surprised no one has died walking down the stairs. There's no fix for that other than to rip it out and do over. Takes what...3 hours start to finish? It is amazing how lazy previous owners of this house were.

I mean...they lived in this house for YEARS without a garage door opener....but the built in garage door opener has a LEARN fuction right there. Took me...maybe...10 seconds to program a remote.

OTOH, whoever whomever buys this house is going to get a nice house because I've very nearly got it well sorted.

Erronius · Dec 18, 2021

I've honestly never heard of, or seen, stairs put together with staples

What...the fuck...MANG

Fucker · Dec 18, 2021

Erronius said:
I've honestly never heard of, or seen, stairs put together with staples

What...the fuck...MANG

Yep...staples. No nails. Staples. No one has ever taken the time to fix them is what weirds me out. It only took me a while because I tossed boxes under there and had to move them out. Otherwise maybe 15 minutes and $7 in screws in trade for solid steps. I've seen lots of houses with shitty steps, but this one is the pinnacle of them all. What's even worse are the top steps which are not flat, and by a lot. Dangerous shit right there....and only really a 3 hour job to fix.

Lanx · Dec 18, 2021

Fucker said:
I mean...they lived in this house for YEARS without a garage door opener....but the built in garage door opener has a LEARN fuction right there. Took me...maybe...10 seconds to program a remote.

OTOH, whoever whomever buys this house is going to get a nice house because I've very nearly got it well sorted.

how about this,

when i bought the house, there was a cute this was our house letter (from the wife) and a bag of various junk...(more on this later)

the garage door opener is in a horrible spot, it's behind the water heater close the stairs.

yes, you have to walk down the stairs, turn into the water heater and the switch is on the wall behind the water heater. (i'm pretty it was this way b/c they just ran the wire straight across from the physical garage opener)

oh, also the garage light... is not in the garage, it's in a cluster of 3 receptacles in the kitchen...

the spot where there "should be" either the garage door opener or the lights is missing a big patch of drywall (i showed you all the pics)... so i was wonder why is there this big patch of drywall missing?

so i happened across the bag of junk again and there it is the missing patch of drywall/paint, it was attached to another remote garage door opener...

yup instead of running a wire to the proper location they just slapped on another garage remote to the wall w/ double sided tape.

Oblio · Dec 18, 2021

Lanx said:
they knocked out the walls in the original house to "open it up" to the sun room, and i guess to "qualify" as a room theres a baseboard heater in there.

That floor duct alone would likely suffice, but EBB as supplemental heat really brings it home. Then just comes the question of legality, was it built with or without permits? The question is can it be rebuilt in the case of a disaster? If it was not permitted by the local authority your homeowner's Insurance will not pay for it to be rebuilt that way and it also gives them reason to start snooping and see what else was done illegally that have caused a fire etc.

From your description of how cold it was in there, I am guessing the contractor did the absolute minimum in regards to insulation.

Lanx · Dec 18, 2021

Oblio said:
View attachment 388586

That floor duct alone would likely suffice, but EBB as supplemental heat really brings it home. Then just comes the question of legality, was it built with or without permits? The question is can it be rebuilt in the case of a disaster? If it was not permitted by the local authority your homeowner's Insurance will not pay for it to be rebuilt that way and it also gives them reason to start snooping and see what else was done illegally that have caused a fire etc.

From your description of how cold it was in there, I am guessing the contractor did the absolute minimum in regards to insulation.

it was there b4 the owners i previously bought it from, so they didn't really pass on any information, all i remember is that my home inspector wasn't thrilled about the roof (sunroom) being different materials from the main roof.

yea insulation was an issue, there were huge gaps from the tile floor to the moulding, which i sealed up w/ caulk. i couldn't walk there at night barefoot cuz the tiles were frozen b/4 i caulked all around, actually where the base heater was installed, there was a literal half in gap between the floor and wall, when i removed the baseboard heater to caulk all around, i was thinking "whats that grass doing there?"

then i realized i'm actually looking at the lawn, the gap was so big. (i used expanding foam for that)

Oblio · Dec 18, 2021

Lanx said:
it was there b4 the owners i previously bought it from, so they didn't really pass on any information, all i remember is that my home inspector wasn't thrilled about the roof (sunroom) being different materials from the main roof.

yea insulation was an issue, there were huge gaps from the tile floor to the moulding, which i sealed up w/ caulk. i couldn't walk there at night barefoot cuz the tiles were frozen b/4 i caulked all around, actually where the base heater was installed, there was a literal half in gap between the floor and wall, when i removed the baseboard heater to caulk all around, i was thinking "whats that grass doing there?"

then i realized i'm actually looking at the lawn, the gap was so big. (i used expanding foam for that)

Sounds like it was not done in a workmen like manner consistent with the rest of the home. Sadly people will pay "market value" for the extra space as if it were actually livable sq.ft. because of shitty inspectors, realtors and appraisers. That room is just a huge energy suck, it is actually costing the homeowner more in terms of energy efficiency that it is actually worth. In that particular case some one either needs to go back and really seal it properly with the correct insulation vapor barrier etc or leave the room as is and install some exterior French Doors and call it and enclosed deck.

Lanx · Dec 18, 2021

Oblio said:
Sounds like it was not done in a workmen like manner consistent with the rest of the home. Sadly people will pay "market value" for the extra space as if it were actually livable sq.ft. because of shitty inspectors, realtors and appraisers. That room is just a huge energy suck, it is actually costing the homeowner more in terms of energy efficiency that it is actually worth. In that particular case some one either needs to go back and really seal it properly with the correct insulation vapor barrier etc or leave the room as is and install some exterior French Doors and call it and enclosed deck.

it was, one of the houses w/ the most sq/ft, i had 2700 while my neighbor nextdoor is listed at 1300 cuz he never finished the basement (i say he cuz he's an original owner of the home when they put up the culdesac)

after i sealed up the room, it wasn't leaking really, i scanned my thermal gun everywhere and just caulked where there differences, the door was pretty gappy and the sliding windows weren't really air tight.

Oblio · Dec 18, 2021

Lanx said:
it was, one of the houses w/ the most sq/ft, i had 2700 while my neighbor nextdoor is listed at 1300 cuz he never finished the basement (i say he cuz he's an original owner of the home when they put up the culdesac)

after i sealed up the room, it wasn't leaking really, i scanned my thermal gun everywhere and just caulked where there differences, the door was pretty gappy and the sliding windows weren't really air tight.

The most important question of all is can it be rebuilt in the case of a disaster?

Lanx · Dec 18, 2021

Oblio said:
The most important question of all is can it be rebuilt in the case of a disaster?

damn'd if i know, maybe thats why they took down the tree directly behind it, heh

it took me 2 years to fucking grow grass in that barren spot where the tree was

Tmac · Dec 18, 2021

Oblio said:
That is exactly why my suggestions are for the typical market participant. The more specific you get the more niche your design is the smaller your buyer pool becomes. Adding bedrooms and bathroom are always going to add value. My suggestion is if you are dead set on a game room, make it so it can easily convert to your typical rec room and at least have a 1/2 Bath so if you are hanging out playing games down their people do not have to go up stairs to take a leak. Ideally you would add 2 bedrooms with a full or 3/4 bath and a rec room. Not sure of your sq.ft. so perhaps only a 1 bed 3/4 bath and a rec room. Also, a bedroom can become an art/hobby room and/or office

if you want to play around with some design ideas I recommend Room Sketcher. It will allow you to draw your area add walls furniture fixtures etc. Depending on which version you buy you can even do a 3D rendering so you can virtually walk around in your proposed layout. Here are my up coming basement plans...

View attachment 388273

We are dividing up a large rec room to make two bedrooms and adding two large walk-in storage closets, this house desperately needs more storage. I did not bother drawing the mud room because nothing is being done to it, it houses our mechanical, laundry, my keezer, my sauna and is the back up pantry all while being the place the kids take off snow clothes or drop off their dirty river clothes in the summer months.

Here is one with a furniture mockup to make sure everything fits. That table you see in the rec room is actually going to be a foldable poker table that will be used for poker nights with some buddies of mine, but more often as the family game room.

View attachment 388277

View attachment 388279 View attachment 388280 View attachment 388281

The fact that your bedrooms and office don’t connect to a bathroom or a closet, but have separate huge closets triggers tf out of me, lol.

And why is the shower hidden behind a door?

Tmac · Dec 18, 2021

And for folks w duct work in the basement that kills head room, you can rip it out and replace it w a mini split. My parents added two feet to their basement ceiling this way.

Lanx · Dec 18, 2021

Tmac said:
And for folks w duct work in the basement that kills head room, you can rip it out and replace it w a mini split. My parents added two feet to their basement ceiling this way.

besides jumping rope (we have to do it outside cuz of ceiling fans in every room), is ceiling height that important?

i mean, i know bitches swoon over vaulted ceilings

Oblio · Dec 18, 2021

Tmac said:
The fact that your bedrooms and office don’t connect to a bathroom or a closet, but have separate huge closets triggers tf out of me, lol.

And why is the shower hidden behind a door?

The circled items are the closets, we are still debating between actual closets or installed/built-in wardrobes. The shower and toilet are behind a door so one person can take a dump and/or shower and one person can still use the sink/vanity. Just this morning I mentioned the idea to my wife about moving the into and extending the big walk-in shower area represented in green. The red represents the new hall closet configuration and the blue would be to add a closet to the office. Which means I would lose some wall space, but would appeal to more buyers in my market as it would be a true bedroom in use as an office. This house desperately needs more storage hence the two big hall closets.

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