Loki

Hoss · Nov 13, 2023

Aldarion said:
What? Sacred timeline Loki got killed by Thanos. The Loki show followed a variant produced as a result of Endgame time shenanigans.

I forgot all about that. At any rate, he's still just one loki out of an infinite number.

spronk · Nov 13, 2023

Hoss said:
Do you think that victor timely was the one from the sacred timeline? He was HWR's backup plan and he seemed different enough that I figured he was a kickstarter kang to get the ball properly rolling again. And then he became time spaghetti so I'm pretty sure I'm right.

yeah its pretty unclear from the season who exactly HWR is and his relationship to Timely, he made some comments about Timely in the long scene between him and Loki which suggests there is more going on there but doesn't outright say anything too much.

I think it just gives Marvel a lot of outs, if they want to keep Kang as Jonathan Majors they can, if they want to recast him they can just use the "he's the new variant in Lokis new multiverse", or they could use Loki to close the book on Kang for now. I imagine there is a lot of backroom huddling going on about where they want to take the MCU now especially after the Marvels bombed and Captain Black America is pushed out to 2025.

The weird thing is Deadpool 3 is maybe gonna play a central part so if they start setting stuff up in it its gonna be weird having to wait 2-3 years to see the next step. I have no idea how the heck Deadpool 3, Captain America, Thunderbolts, and Blade are supposed to lead into Kang Dynasty or if Kang Dynasty is still the plan. We know it ENDS with Secret Wars, but it feels like they don't have a clue anymore how to get there.

Hoss · Nov 13, 2023

spronk said:
yeah its pretty unclear from the season who exactly HWR is and his relationship to Timely, he made some comments about Timely in the long scene between him and Loki which suggests there is more going on there but doesn't outright say anything too much.

I felt like he was making fun of timely in that scene. But it could have just as easily been self deprecating humour if kang is capable of that.

Araysar · Nov 13, 2023

Haus said:
Here's a question. As someone who didn't watch season one because I heard in advance what a load of nonsensical grrrl boss they were throwing in. Would I be able to watch/enjoy season 2? As it sounds like it was much better.

I think it will be near impossible to understand Season 2 without having watched Season 1. Season 1 sets up all the rules, the whole concept of pruning timelines, why they have Hunters, why they have Variants, why they have Timekeepers, why they have the TVA, etc.

Season 1 is also way better in terms of set pieces and visuals. You have Loki traveling through various cataclysms like Lamentis and Pompeii, you have the smoke dragon Alioth, you also get the other Loki variants which are pretty funny, and then you get to see end of time.

Season 2 happens mostly at the TVA (basically an office) and pretty much all of it is people talking and yelling.

Burns · Nov 13, 2023

Araysar said:
I think it will be near impossible to understand Season 2 without having watched Season 1. Season 1 sets up all the rules, the whole concept of pruning timelines, why they have Hunters, why they have Variants, why they have Timekeepers, why they have the TVA, etc.

Season 1 is also way better in terms of set pieces and visuals. You have Loki traveling through various cataclysms like Lamentis and Pompeii, you have the smoke dragon Alioth, you also get the other Loki variants which are pretty funny, and then you get to see end of time.

Season 2 happens mostly at the TVA (basically an office) and pretty much all of it is people talking and yelling.

Well now you have sold me on season 2, since I didn't care for half that shit in season 1! Actual good dialog and character development, with a side dish of magic, is all I really want.

Araysar · Nov 13, 2023

Burns said:
Well now you have sold me on season 2, since I didn't care for half that shit in season 1! Actual good dialog and character development, with a side dish of magic, is all I really want.

I don't remember any good dialogue or character development in season 2

Angerz · Nov 13, 2023

Araysar said:
Do you think this was always the plan or do you think they rewrote chunks of Loki to minimize the role of Jonathan Majors and make him more replaceable in light of his legal scandals?

I dont think they made any changes due to Majors' arrest, all the outs they have possible are just dumb luck. As far as I remember, this was the first marvel show with 0 reshoots, and it was done last year.

They could even have Renslayer return as a/the Kang, if they really wanted to, since, in the comics, she has had Kang powers. Her end, I assume, was supposed to signal her being eaten by Alioth, but they could just say the purple light she saw could be Kang tech from HWR at the End of Time.

Homsar · Nov 14, 2023

Ok I didn't think about it but Loki getting involved in the new Deadpool sounds great since it's him fucking with the timeline. Loki/Deadpool mashup please

Mist · Nov 14, 2023

Angerz said:
I dont think they made any changes due to Majors' arrest, all the outs they have possible are just dumb luck. As far as I remember, this was the first marvel show with 0 reshoots, and it was done last year.

They could even have Renslayer return as a/the Kang, if they really wanted to, since, in the comics, she has had Kang powers. Her end, I assume, was supposed to signal her being eaten by Alioth, but they could just say the purple light she saw could be Kang tech from HWR at the End of Time.

Or that Alioth ends up serving her.
Kinda like that actually.

Mist · Nov 14, 2023

spronk said:
yeah its pretty unclear from the season who exactly HWR is and his relationship to Timely, he made some comments about Timely in the long scene between him and Loki which suggests there is more going on there but doesn't outright say anything too much.

I think it just gives Marvel a lot of outs, if they want to keep Kang as Jonathan Majors they can, if they want to recast him they can just use the "he's the new variant in Lokis new multiverse", or they could use Loki to close the book on Kang for now. I imagine there is a lot of backroom huddling going on about where they want to take the MCU now especially after the Marvels bombed and Captain Black America is pushed out to 2025.

The weird thing is Deadpool 3 is maybe gonna play a central part so if they start setting stuff up in it its gonna be weird having to wait 2-3 years to see the next step. I have no idea how the heck Deadpool 3, Captain America, Thunderbolts, and Blade are supposed to lead into Kang Dynasty or if Kang Dynasty is still the plan. We know it ENDS with Secret Wars, but it feels like they don't have a clue anymore how to get there.

It would be weird for them to have central MCU plot stuff in an R-rated movie.

Narac01 · Nov 14, 2023

An r rating really doesn't mean s*** anymore. The whole thought process that you lose way too much money hasn't been true for years. Sure. You would lose some but look at Deadpool. Besides, it could be a soft r rating instead of a hard r rating.

Downhammer · Nov 15, 2023

They could have a Deadpool 4th wall break recap of overarching plot stuff in whatever PG movie follows it to catch everyone up if they're worried about it. Honestly though, whatever viewers they lose from the R rating seems negligible to the numbers they lose from the overload of mediocre film and tv shows since Endgame.

Homsar · Nov 15, 2023

Tom really doesn't seem like he's over the role. It really was a decent end but Deadpool fucking up HWR could be great

Rajaah · Nov 15, 2023

Pretty off-putting how Marvel and Disney have seemingly completely looked the other way on Majors' abusiveness. I was always a proponent of "innocent until proven guilty" like any sane person, but the double standard between how Disney treated Johnny Depp versus their lack of action on Majors really jumps out like a sore thumb. It's like if DC decided to not only keep Ezra Miller on board, but also decided to go forward with a whole slate of Flash movies where he's the center of the overall DCU story.

Grizzlebeard · Nov 15, 2023

Rajaah said:
Pretty off-putting how Marvel and Disney have seemingly completely looked the other way on Majors' abusiveness. I was always a proponent of "innocent until proven guilty" like any sane person, but the double standard between how Disney treated Johnny Depp versus their lack of action on Majors really jumps out like a sore thumb. It's like if DC decided to not only keep Ezra Miller on board, but also decided to go forward with a whole slate of Flash movies where he's the center of the overall DCU story.

The MCU Is Now Reportedly Backing Away From Jonathan Majors’ Kang

Chukzombi · Nov 18, 2023

Mist said:
2 episodes in and this is garbage? Where's the fucking plot?

i thought the first two were decent, but holy shit, that third episode brought the entire season off the tracks. they recovered some by episode 5, but this show felt like everything could have been resolved in 3 episodes. they dragged this entire thing the fuck out. i'm glad i binged all of this at once because if i had to wait 6 weeks to be this disappointed then i would have been pissed. overall it was ok with some real stinker subplots in between. i hope this means they ditch Kang once and for all and its likely why they havent publicly fired Majors, because they were going in another direction and there was no reason to.

Tarrant · Nov 18, 2023

Grizzlebeard said:
The MCU Is Now Reportedly Backing Away From Jonathan Majors’ Kang

lol

According to MCU expert Joanna Robinson on the House of R Ringer podcast, who cautions that this should be taken with a large amount of salt, and is currently unverifiable

Mr Creed · Nov 20, 2023

Araysar said:
The Loom story device is so stupid.

Whats even stupider is how you're supposed to fix it. You literally just have to make it bigger so more "timelines" can squeeze through the ring. Its laughable. I'd be more impressed if they gave me an extremely convoluted techno babble explanation that I couldn't understand, but nope. Its just "mAkE iT BiGgEr". That's how stupid they think the viewer is.

Then they spend an entire season aimlessly running around chasing macguffins or trying to convince each other why they should or should not "fix" the Loom. Like I said a few pages ago, what makes it even worse is that you're supposed to care about saving billions of timelines and quadrillions of lives but you dont know any of them, never been to any of them, so you literally just don't care. There are no stakes of importance. The Multiverse makes everything meaningless.

I am pretty done with any kind of multiverse/time travel shenanigans coming out of Hollywood. Maybe they've done that too much in the last decade or two and it's just superhero fatigue, but I think the lack of tangible stakes is exactly the issue. They just expand the theoretical threat level to make it sound grander, but who really cares? Nobody. It's a Simpsons style "won't somebody think of the children" appeal.

Downhammer · Nov 20, 2023

Along those lines, did the ability to time loop using antman tech go away? What's to stop the avengers from pulling a Loki and looping a million times until they "win"? I guess that's why they have to push multiversal threats so you can't just prune them before they're born.

joz123 · Nov 20, 2023

Downhammer said:
Along those lines, did the ability to time loop using antman tech go away? What's to stop the avengers from pulling a Loki and looping a million times until they "win"? I guess that's why they have to push multiversal threats so you can't just prune them before they're born.

Avengers needed Pym Particles to go back in time and they had a very limited supply.

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