MTG thread

We have Tuesday and FNM Legacy every week around here, I forget how spoiled I am sometimes. Numbers are still pretty strong but we outnumber the FNM Standard people now so i'd guess that player base really is dropping like a stone.

Few girls once in a while, always someone's GF, always playing real decks tho. Who the fuck is Sprankle?

The bay is weird for magic. There's plenty of shops and a decent scene for eternal stuff. Collections are... intense. Any given sunday afternoon legacy event might have more black border duals than revised ones on the tables. There's also a resistance to having more events, which often seem strange. I have to drive all the way to berkeley to play vintage.

CFB is also a dog of a store. It's shocking how low rent their home location is.

Sprankle is/was a Cosplayer who was not super popular, but then started doing MtG stuff and jumped in popularity because of it.

Heylel said:

CFB is also a dog of a store. It's shocking how low rent their home location is.

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Gotta pay for LSV's globe trotting somehow! I still haven't wandered down there and seen the store. But then again I have a job and I can't be fucked to visit them during the week.

ronne said:

I'm pretty legitimately concerned they are going to blunder ahead the same way comic books have. Make massive changes to your product to try and placate a non-existent female customer base, alienate your existing male-dominated player base, then whine on Twitter about how inclusive you are and how all the terrible misogynists are ruining your game and driving away players.

I don't understand their fascination with trying to so hard to push their idea that the game is open/for everyone. It very clearly is not, when you have a 90+% base of male players the game very obviously is not interesting to females, and it has nothing to do with how progressive you are, or card art, or any of that shit. It's the same reason STEM is dominated by men, they just won't admin reality.

I seriously give 0 fucks about the recent dramus over at the MTG subreddit. The dude everyone is losing their minds about is a complete cunt, but he's not wrong on a lot of fronts is the real issue. The vast, vast majority of your player does not in fact give any shits about Sprankle or her cosplays, and probably never will.

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And why should they?
She doesn't play magic in any meaningful sense(see below).
She is an absolute attention w****(see my twitter notes)
She seems to provide no meaningful commentary or even have a interest in magic mechanics or gameplay. OMG cute dinosaurs awww etc.

I have been playing magic for 20+ years. PTQ's, GP's, RPTQ's, all sorts of professional events.
This year I made a major drawdown in my mtg activities, because of real life and all, but there are all sorts of reasons to get out of the game now.
- Massive reprinting of older staples is going to drag down the value of any collection.
- Making an attempt to appeal to women is just going to alienate the other 90% of your playerbase ala Marvel. Playing at a card store has no appeal to me anymore.
- My local magic society is 100% on board with psycho women who want to feel 'empowered' by dressing up as cartoon characters and parading around. Playing magic is secondary. Playing professional magic? fuhgeddaboutit.

- After making the point that this sprakle person has 33 thousand tweets in 6 years (15 a day, 1 per waking hour) and NOT one-not one- has a picture of her actually playing magic, i've effectively been evicted from mtg society.

- Articles like 'The struggles of trannies playing magic' is not content that you want to promote if you ever want mainstream acceptance.
- I have no desire to bring my kids in the future to play a tournament when it's dominated by freaks and sjw's. So long to your long term customer base wotc.

It's weird, being out of magic after 20 years, but I'm already over it.

The really really bad news for WotC is they don't have any brands they can sell for MovieBux to pay for any of this virtue-signalling bullshit. If it dominates their thinking and design, call it 2-3 years and they're sunk. Margins aren't that huge in the card industry.

Bonus:
I asked a judge if my opponent was scared of bears, and I had bear sleeves, could he make me desleeve? The answer is yes.
I asked a judge if my opponent was scared of bears, and I wore a bear costume, could he make me disrobe? The answer is yes.
Wizards is finished. You had a good run guys.

Yeah...not sure I want to support a company that is that idiotic. No common sense and no business sense. I care fuck-all about the value of my cards and I only ever play with family or friends a coupe of times a year. But, out of principle, I don't want to purchase anything from them if they're really going to alienate 95-99% of the players, to appease a couple of dozen morons.

Tinger said:

Bonus:
I asked a judge if my opponent was scared of bears, and I had bear sleeves, could he make me desleeve? The answer is yes.
I asked a judge if my opponent was scared of bears, and I wore a bear costume, could he make me disrobe? The answer is yes.
Wizards is finished. You had a good run guys.

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Arkoudaphobia is a serious and pervasive issue, bir! Why do you think they haven't printed a bear since Dragons of Tarkir?

Now, if you were a Bearsoul, I oppose this rude judge's attempts to other you.

Jesus christ some of you guys are as pussy shit as all the 'feel feel SJWs' and just cant admit it.
'Alienating' you by making a couple of their fictional characters on cards female/gay instead of straight males? By telling people to just NOT be assholes to women?
They arent forcing you to come to FNM in drag, for fucks sake. What are you so god damned butthurt about? Treating women nicely is SUCH an inconvenience?

Magic is more then just the interactions in a game, or the competitive side. A VERY small percentage of magic players are any good at the game, and a very small percentage of them will ever win a tournament bigger then FNM. Acting like a woman has to play the game at a high level to be contributing to the community is so clueless i struggle to comprehend how you even came up with that.

Saying women arent capable of playing it at a high level when melissa del toro, jadine klomparens and emma handy are all better then every single one of the posters in this thread. Compare that with the number of female players 10 years ago. Obviously things are improving and continuing to improve.

Have you ever listened to what these women have said? How uncomfortable it was for them and how they were treated in the community? Can you really not see how that would reduce the percentage of female players drastically?

All you guys 'telling us how it is' are the fucking problem. You dont even understand the problem and are telling everyone else its not a big deal. You point to facts about the distribution of male/females in the community as your proof, when thats exactly the point being made. Just become something IS male dominated does not mean it will ALWAYS be male dominated.

Its not a genetic thing that makes these things appeal to males, or not appeal to females, its societal conditioning. There are many countries with a more balanced male/female ratio in STEM then us. There's even a handful where its a female dominated field of education. If it was a genetic difference, that wouldnt be the case.

You are functionally retarded and should stop gargling the feminine penis so often.

Emma Handy has a Y chromsome.

And plenty of women not fishing for approval have said they haven't experienced the "toxicity" you white knights claim is prevalent. Which is funny, because everyone online is so appalled at this behavior but it happens and they're the playerbase. So either they're a bunch of shit heads virtue signaling online while being smelly, fat, ugly, socially awkward neck beards in real life or, no, that's what they are. Hypocritical fuckwits.

The pros' letter about harassment is the most comical bit of bullshit I've read in awhile. These people are some of the shitiest people on the planet to each other.

Women don't play competitive games at anywhere near the level men do. And it's largely unrelated to the environment created by the men. It's that it doesn't interest them in being outwardly aggressive and competitive.

But keep ignoring basic biology and cheering as the chucks burn their game down.

fanaskin said:

who do you think will spend more money on magic enzee? the troglydytes or the womenz?

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Apparently its the casuals who have no clue this shit is going on or really even do events lol

Yeah, anyone who has posted on an MTG forum or reddit is not in the bulk of people who keep the game alive by buying booster packs at MSRP by the fistfull after they've had a shit day at work and need a hit of something to make their life feel less shit and more fantastical.

You weren't excited by another cycling mechanic expansion or tribal garbage with no real mechanic?!

(Growing Rites as proxies for Gaea's Cradle is pretty nice though)

I would have been excited for tribes if they had actually made them work.

Tribes still have a chance once we get the other half of their block, but I'm not optimistic. The merfolk lord is gonna be 4 mana or something awful, and there's no way in hell islandwalk comes back.

Kuro said:

I would have been excited for tribes if they had actually made them work.

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How do you make them work though in this block? Everything is hard locked by tribal colors. There's no splash, and the overall power is so low that you're pidgeoned into a predetermined wedge immediately. And the color fixing is treasures... sigh.

Leadsalad said:

Emma Handy has a Y chromsome.

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Honestly, in the interest of fairness, I did not know that. Know why? I don't really give a shit what genitals she/he has. Those were just the first 3 female names I could think of that I've seen who have more of an interest in the game competitively, rather then EDH/cosplay/whatever. But, as for the larger point of being inclusive to everyone, she'd still apply then. I just didn't get into the whole trans thing in that post.

And plenty of women not fishing for approval have said they haven't experienced the "toxicity" you white knights claim is prevalent. Which is funny, because everyone online is so appalled at this behavior but it happens and they're the playerbase. So either they're a bunch of shit heads virtue signaling online while being smelly, fat, ugly, socially awkward neck beards in real life or, no, that's what they are. Hypocritical fuckwits.

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Why do I always see this line of thinking when someone has your mindset? Where you think because you've seen AN example of your point, that means ALL counter examples are invalid. Things are not 100% black and white. When we say females are made to feel uncomfortable, that does mean every single one has experienced those same issues, in that same exact same way. Yes, some locations may not have that many toxic players, and/or the females that play there never ran into it. That doesn't mean it's not happening. You can't actually be taking the stance that 100% of women who complain about this issue are making it up and 100% of women disagreeing are right, can you? Some part of your brain has to realize that's bullshit.

Women don't play competitive games at anywhere near the level men do. And it's largely unrelated to the environment created by the men. It's that it doesn't interest them in being outwardly aggressive and competitive.

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The fact that you lump aggression in with being competitive is part of the issue. When we are talking non-physical games, aggression is not necessary and can even be a hindrance, clouding your judgement.
Now, when you say they don't play at the same 'level', it's unclear if you mean skill level or percentage. i.e. Are men better at the games, more interested in games or both?
If you are taking the stance men are biologically better at games, that's incorrect. The ratio of good female players, of most non-physical games that have ever tracked this data, shows they compete at roughly the same level as men. There's clearly less of them playing, no one is arguing that, obviously, that's the problem. They are less drawn to these games because it's reinforced their whole lives, by people like you who say it's all 'biology', that sports (and games) are for boys. Boys start developing more hand-eye coordination and more spatial awareness from an early age by these activities. Girls are pushed towards developing their emotional intelligence and interpersonal skills instead.

Do I think magic will ever be 50/50? Hell no. Not in my lifetime, anyway, assuming the game is even still around. There's too much societal conditioning to ever undo. No one said that's WotC's goal, either. Just because they want to be inclusive does not mean they want, or expect, an equal split. Going from a 1/99 split to a 10/90 split is still an improvement, and that's all they want to do. IMPROVE the situation.