NBA 2015-2016 Season thread

Alex

Still a Music Elitist
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40 points on 14/18 is just stupid.
Curry had a true shooting percentage of 105.2% last night. He broke the formula.

Also, in that 28 point quarter video, I love Kemba Walker's reaction when he sees Steph wide open on that first three. Doesn't even bother trying to recover on defense. Just looks completely defeated and frustrated.
 

Djay

Trakanon Raider
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I'm actually kinda annoyed that the Raptors are winning without JV because it's going to make the casual fans think he's not as valuable as he truly is. I absolutely love Kyle Lowry, but this team isn't going to win in the playoffs if Casey is still planning on DeRozan getting 15 free-throws per game. The playoffs aren't usually like the Heat/Mavs 2006 Finals, but he seems to think that offensive strategy is viable there.

I was listening to the Hawks broadcast instead of the Raptors last night because I like to hear what's being said outside the team's bubble and it was killing me that Dominique Wilkins wouldn't shut up about how DeMar wasn't getting the ball in the 4th quarter while Lowry was tearing it up. Every possession that went by, even when we scored, he'd say something about the Raptors not getting the ball in the hands of their "best player". I resisted yelling at my tv, but that was some Reggie Miller level announcing right there.
 

Ambiturner

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The only thing that'll hurt his legacy is he didn't make the jump from "All Star" to "Best Player in the League" until he turned 26.

What he is doing now though is simply amazing. He's the best and most entertaining player in the NBA and no one else is even close.
I can't imagine that would have much of an impact on his legacy. He's easily over taken Lebron who's still got a year or two of his prime left and everyone thought it would be Durant once Lebron's abilities started to fade.

I don't think there's been a precedent for what Curry's doing.
 

Slaythe

<Bronze Donator>
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I can't imagine that would have much of an impact on his legacy. He's easily over taken Lebron who's still got a year or two of his prime left and everyone thought it would be Durant once Lebron's abilities started to fade.

I don't think there's been a precedent for what Curry's doing.
LeBron was the best player on the planet for essentially a decade. Are you telling me Curry will play at this level when he's 37? That is the impact.
 

Alex

Still a Music Elitist
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I don't think there's been a precedent for what Curry's doing.
I think this is the important part here, Slaythe. Curry is doing things that many thought couldn't happen. Two years ago, hell, even the beginning of last year people were just calling Curry a "better Reggie Miller" because all he did was shoot the ball well. There's never been a time when anyone's been able to shoot the ballthiswell. It's completely changed the way offenses are being run. Outside-in was how it used to be. Just look at the Small Ball Death Squad that the Dubs rolled out against the Cavs. Draymond Green, a 6'7" dude as your center? Every player in that lineup (Curry, Barnes, Klay, Andre, Green) can shoot threes and defend at least above average. It's just not a thing that anyone thought would ever happen. A team that can overcome size and strength based on pure talent, skill, and discipline. It's unprecedented and that's why I think Curry's legacy won't be hurt at all by his "late" development.
 

Slaythe

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Ultimately we're just going to agree to disagree on this which happens a lot but I'll still try and explain my perspective.

First, while I think Curry these past two seasons is proving to be the greatest shooter the league has ever seen, I don't think he's really redefining the game the way you're terming it. He's the prototype player of the modern NBA, which relies of movement and reaction more than anything else. Curry is simply the perfect player for that style, but his emergence didn't create it.

As far as age goes, all I'll say is that when all is said and done you'll be able to look at essentially a decade span where LeBron was the best player in the league vs a stretch of, I don't know, 5 or 6 years where presumably Curry will be there. Now will people look at those 6 years as a reinvention of basketball like you're saying...maybe. I think that's a stretch and if Curry takes the throne from James long term, I'm still going to value LeBron's longevity. Something I think most other people not completely tied to one of those players will do as well.
 

Djay

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It's way too early to be having a discussion about Curry's legacy. If his career ended tomorrow he might be on the fringe of a Top 50 list. Maybe. I'll get back to you in 4-5 years if he's still performing at this level.
 

Slaythe

<Bronze Donator>
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It's way too early to be having a discussion about Curry's legacy. If his career ended tomorrow he might be on the fringe of a Top 50 list. Maybe. I'll get back to you in 4-5 years if he's still performing at this level.
The speculation is certainly hypothetical.

Edit: At least to me.
 

Djay

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I guess...and I guess these are the types of conversations that have happened in bars for years. Ignore my grouchiness and carry on.
 

Ambiturner

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I'm also not in agreement that Lebron was on top for 10 years. You really think be was better than Kobe in 2005?
He was definitely below Kobe in '06 and '07. '08 and '09 Lebron was probably better, but it was still pretty close.

Then you have Durant who outplayed him in 2014. Not sure where you get this entire decade of absolute dominance from. He had probably 4 of being unquestionably the best and a couple more where he was neck and neck.
 

Slaythe

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"He was definitely below Kobe in '06 and '07."

That statement is funny to me because I woulddefinitelysay the opposite, but we look at different things, you know that.

I think Kobe is probably the most overrated superstar to ever play the game, personally. Maybe just Iverson above him on that list.
 

Djay

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You forgot Wade.
wink.png

Sorry, I haven't had enough of a chance to bash on him this season.
 

Pharazon

Silver Knight of the Realm
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Silly to say Kobe is overrated. He played with a lot of talent but he was far and away the best player on those last two title teams. That Celtics team he beat was probably better than any Jordan had to face in the Finals (one might argue the Jazz were on par at best, but I don't think so.)

Legacies aren't based on how long guys were the best player in the league, they're based on titles. If Steph were to keep playing at this level and win 4-5 more (unlikely) he'd get into the goat discussion. If he plays at this level another 5+ years and wins 1-2 more he's maybe labelled the best "small point guard" (ie, not Magic) ever.

I didn't see the guys of this era play, but based on the numbers year by year, how many would have called Russell the greatest player in the game back in the 60's? From all I've heard Wilt was the superior talent, but because Russell played on a stacked team he won all those rings as the most important player on the team and is still labelled by many as a top 5 player of all time. Yet people back then might have argued that he was never even the best player in the league because of Wilt. Legacy is all about rings.
 

Sterling

El Presidente
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Kobe is overrated because there are people putting him in stupid lists like he's an alltime top 5 player or whatever. He's been an elite player and he clearly belongs in the HOF but he shouldn't be in that kind of discussion. People put way too much emphasis on championships when judging individuals in team sports. Swap Wilt and Russell and Celtics probably win even more titles. It's just dumb. Horry 7th greatest player of all time! Sam Jones 2nd best player of all time!
 

a_skeleton_06

<Banned>
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The speculation is certainly hypothetical.

Edit: At least to me.
If Curry's career ended today, he would probably be hanging out with Bob McAdoo on the greatest ever list, which might not even be top 100. Talking Legacy is insane in regards to Curry right now.
 

Warrik

Potato del Grande
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Watching Curry play is something special. I'm seriously in awe of this dude and what he's doing on the court.

Also glad Kobe woke up.
 

skrala

Silver Knight of the Realm
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Kobe and Lebron are also head and shoulders above Curry on the defensive end if we're talking legacy. Curry is no James Harden on the defensive end, but nobody is ever going to accuse him of being a lock down defender.
 

Djay

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Yeah, basing legacy on titles is retarded. This isn't bowling, golf, boxing, or tennis. You can maybe use it as a tie-breaker for guys that are otherwise relatively even, but even the greatest like Bird, Magic, and Michael didn't do it on their own. I wouldn't rate Malone or Stockton any higher if they had pulled out title wins against the Bulls. I wouldn't rate Hakeem any lower if he didn't get his two titles while Jordan was retired. Titles are a lazy and uninformed barometer for measuring greatness.
 

Alex

Still a Music Elitist
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If the Warriors actually do end up winning three titles while Curry is the best player on the team he would absolutely be remembered for years. I mean, we're talking about literal legacy right? 25 years from now everyone would remember the Curry-led Warriors. Curry could fall off worse than Kobe by the time he's 30 which could keep him from all-time player status, but everyone would still remember the title years.