NFL 2020 Season: Gravy Edition!

Merrith · Oct 21, 2020

a_skeleton_06 said:
I remember people arguing with me on this board that AB was a better receiver than Julio. Those were the days.

Prime AB was an absolute beast. 2013-2018 stats

2013: 110 catches, 1499 yards, 8 TD
2014: 129 catches, 1698 yards, 13 TD
2015: 136 catches, 1834 yards, 10 TD
2016: 106 catches, 1284 yards, 12 TD (15 games)
2017: 101 catches, 1533 yards, 9 TD (14 games)
2018: 104 catches, 1297 yards, 15 TD (15 games)

Julio has only broken 100+ receptions 3 times in his career (although to be fair, the overall yardage is probably about the same, he averages a little more yard per catch), and hasn't had more than 8 TD's since 2012 (10).

Interestingly, AB was drafted a year earlier than Julio, but both basically had their big "breakout" year in their 4th season after both missing some time with injuries I assume in Year 3. Brown had 6 straight years of elite production, and if you look at Julio starting in his Year 4 (2014), his 6 years in a row through last year match up pretty similarly...with him having already missed as many games this year as he did in any of those 6 previous years.

Without listing Julio's individual years during 2014-2019, it's pretty crazy how similar their stats are during those 6 year spans.

AB (2013-2018) 92 games, 686 catches, 9145 yards, 67 TD's.
Julio (2014-2019) 92 games, 623 catches, 9388 yards, 37 TD's.

I mean, they're both absolute studs over these time frames. I will say the 30 TD difference over 6 years stands out quite a bit. Big difference currently is Julio is still an elite receiver playing in the NFL (when healthy), while AB is a fucking nutcase that either just went crazy or shit finally boiled over after whatever they were able to do in Pittsburgh to keep him under wraps was no longer present.

Animosity · Oct 21, 2020

Gankak said:
2 words... Percy Harvin

*edit* and we need defensive help... not offensive. If we had a D that could reliably stop teams more than twice a game we'd be blowing people out

Name one defensive star thats out there on the free agent market. Ill wait.

Gankak · Oct 21, 2020

Animosity said:
Name one defensive star thats out there on the free agent market. Ill wait.

There isn't one.... but adding a headcase on offense isn't going to help us. AB will do damage to the team he won't add do the team

Genjiro · Oct 21, 2020

Animosity said:
DK, Lockett and AB on the field at the same time. You literally cant defend that. How would this be a bad signing. Hes gonna come cheap and motivated. And if Gordon ever gets reinstated that top 4 is fucking insane.

Lol

Ameraves · Oct 21, 2020

Animosity said:
Name one defensive star thats out there on the free agent market. Ill wait.

Pretty sure JJ Watt would be available if the price was right. Sure he isn't quite the star he once was, but he would be an immediate upgrade to the Seahawks terrible pass rush.

Animosity · Oct 21, 2020

Ameraves said:
Pretty sure JJ Watt would be available if the price was right. Sure he isn't quite the star he once was, but he would be an immediate upgrade to the Seahawks terrible pass rush.

The Seahawks have little to trade right now. They gave away most of it to bring in Adams. I was specifically refering to free agents.

Ameraves · Oct 21, 2020

Animosity said:
The Seahawks have little to trade right now. They gave away most of it to bring in Adams. I was specifically refering to free agents.

Fair enough on the free agent part.

However, good GM's find ways to make trades happen. Yes the Seahawks parted ways with 2 1st round picks, but JJ Watt will not fetch a 1st rounder at this point. I would guess the Seahawks would want to push all in this year, as this is as good as they have been since their last SB runs, and they understand how hard it is to get back there. As of now their defense is an absolute liability. Maybe they will improve once Adams gets back, but they weren't exactly world beaters when he was in.

I realize it's all armchair GM, and you were talking about Free Agents. But the Seahawks would be wise to try and find something to help out their pass rush.

Gavinmad · Oct 21, 2020

Merrith said:
Prime AB was an absolute beast. 2013-2018 stats

2013: 110 catches, 1499 yards, 8 TD
2014: 129 catches, 1698 yards, 13 TD
2015: 136 catches, 1834 yards, 10 TD
2016: 106 catches, 1284 yards, 12 TD (15 games)
2017: 101 catches, 1533 yards, 9 TD (14 games)
2018: 104 catches, 1297 yards, 15 TD (15 games)

Julio has only broken 100+ receptions 3 times in his career (although to be fair, the overall yardage is probably about the same, he averages a little more yard per catch), and hasn't had more than 8 TD's since 2012 (10).

Interestingly, AB was drafted a year earlier than Julio, but both basically had their big "breakout" year in their 4th season after both missing some time with injuries I assume in Year 3. Brown had 6 straight years of elite production, and if you look at Julio starting in his Year 4 (2014), his 6 years in a row through last year match up pretty similarly...with him having already missed as many games this year as he did in any of those 6 previous years.

Without listing Julio's individual years during 2014-2019, it's pretty crazy how similar their stats are during those 6 year spans.

AB (2013-2018) 92 games, 686 catches, 9145 yards, 67 TD's.
Julio (2014-2019) 92 games, 623 catches, 9388 yards, 37 TD's.

I mean, they're both absolute studs over these time frames. I will say the 30 TD difference over 6 years stands out quite a bit. Big difference currently is Julio is still an elite receiver playing in the NFL (when healthy), while AB is a fucking nutcase that either just went crazy or shit finally boiled over after whatever they were able to do in Pittsburgh to keep him under wraps was no longer present.

Don't forget who their quarterbacks were and how differently their teams were performing also. Falcons had two winning seasons along with a SB run, but mostly losing seasons. Steelers never went below 8-8.

Genjiro · Oct 21, 2020

Gavinmad said:
Don't forget who their quarterbacks were and how differently their teams were performing also. Falcons had two winning seasons along with a SB run, but mostly losing seasons. Steelers never went below 8-8.

More importantly than that, the Steelers had Mike Wallace, Emmanuel Sanders, Martavis Bryant, Le'Veon Bell, JuJu etc all coming through there opposite to keep defenses honest.

AB never saw the coverage over/under brackets Julio did, and when he did, the Steelers eviscerated teams with Bell JuJu etc who all had 1 on 1 coverage. Granted, AB was still great but its kind of an apples to oranges comparison.

Merrith · Oct 21, 2020

Gavinmad said:
Don't forget who their quarterbacks were and how differently their teams were performing also. Falcons had two winning seasons along with a SB run, but mostly losing seasons. Steelers never went below 8-8.

I know we like to shit on Matt Ryan, but the guy is a more than capable QB. He hasn't been the main problem in their losing seasons there.

Merrith · Oct 21, 2020

Genjiro said:
More importantly than that, the Steelers had Mike Wallace, Emmanuel Sanders, Martavis Bryant, Le'Veon Bell, JuJu etc all coming through there opposite to keep defenses honest.

AB never saw the coverage over/under brackets Julio did, and when he did, the Steelers eviscerated teams with Bell JuJu etc who all had 1 on 1 coverage. Granted, AB was still great but its kind of an apples to oranges comparison.

Julio did have prime Roddy White, and Tony Gonzalez the first bit of his career there. Later on Sanu, Austin Hooper, and last couple years Calvin Ridley as well (who has turned into a monster in his own right that produces whether Julio is out there or not).

It's not THAT apples to oranges comparison. Not like Julio is Terry McLaurin looking at literally a bunch of guys lining up opposite him.

Genjiro · Oct 21, 2020

Roddy White is the only good player on that list who was at a high level, and he was near the end of his career talent wise.....aside from perhaps this year Calvin Ridley

Not to mention the Steelers prolly had the best OL in the league or right there with Dallas in those years

Sterling · Oct 21, 2020

It's only a discussion because Calvin Johnson retired.

Merrith · Oct 21, 2020

Genjiro said:
Roddy White is the only good player on that list who was at a high level, and he was near the end of his career talent wise.....aside from perhaps this year Calvin Ridley

Not to mention the Steelers prolly had the best OL in the league or right there with Dallas in those years

I know we're used to Kelce/Kittle putting up 1k+ yard seasons at TE, but the 3 years Gonzalez played with Julio he had 80+ catches and 850+ yards in all 3 years.

Also if we're bringing up Bryant and Sanders, Sanu's seasons in Atlanta were equal to what either of those 2 put up while they were with Pittsburgh. Ridley has been better than those two all 3 years.

Mike Wallace put up a few very good seasons the first 3 years of AB being there, but coincidentally the start of AB really crushing it came in 2013 when Wallace went to Miami.

Kaines · Oct 21, 2020

Sterling said:
It's only a discussion because Calvin Johnson retired.

The only player that even COMPARES to Megatron is Larry F

Genjiro · Oct 21, 2020

Merrith said:
I know we're used to Kelce/Kittle putting up 1k+ yard seasons at TE, but the 3 years Gonzalez played with Julio he had 80+ catches and 850+ yards in all 3 years.

Also if we're bringing up Bryant and Sanders, Sanu's seasons in Atlanta were equal to what either of those 2 put up while they were with Pittsburgh. Ridley has been better than those two all 3 years.

Mike Wallace put up a few very good seasons the first 3 years of AB being there, but coincidentally the start of AB really crushing it came in 2013 when Wallace went to Miami.

Dude.

Merrith stop. Goddamn. Yes, the Falcons offense was above average. HOWEVER you missed the entire fucking point in your stat digging.

NO DC in the fucking NFL was sitting there looking at tape going OH FUCKBALLSHIT IF WE DOUBLE JULIO JONES THAT LEAVES MOHAMED SANU 1 ON 1. Teams happily did it to him almost every week, AB hardly ever saw double coverage.

That was the entire point. Not to dickwave stats.

Merrith · Oct 21, 2020

Genjiro said:
Dude.

Merrith stop. Goddamn. Yes, the Falcons offense was above average. HOWEVER you missed the entire fucking point in your stat digging.

NO DC in the fucking NFL was sitting there looking at tape going OH FUCKBALLSHIT IF WE DOUBLE JULIO JONES THAT LEAVES MOHAMED SANU 1 ON 1. Teams happily did it to him almost every week, AB hardly ever saw double coverage.

That was the entire point. Not to dickwave stats.

You really think AB hardly ever saw double coverage? I mean you're a Steeler fan, you should know that is wrong. Btw, if I didn't make it clear, I wasn't saying anything about who I thought was the better receiver. I thought it was an interesting thing to analyze and the stat deep dive was pretty interesting.

I do think AB benefited a lot from his situation, not so much because he had massively superior talent around him when compared to Julio at Atlanta, but because him and Ben's styles meshed very well. He was also elite. I do think Julio is a guy who would probably be able to have more success on average on whatever team you dropped him on around the league compared to AB.

Genjiro · Oct 21, 2020

Merrith said:
You really think AB hardly ever saw double coverage? I mean you're a Steeler fan, you should know that is wrong. Btw, if I didn't make it clear, I wasn't saying anything about who I thought was the better receiver. I thought it was an interesting thing to analyze and the stat deep dive was pretty interesting.

I do think AB benefited a lot from his situation, not so much because he had massively superior talent around him when compared to Julio at Atlanta, but because him and Ben's styles meshed very well. He was also elite. I do think Julio is a guy who would probably be able to have more success on average on whatever team you dropped him on around the league compared to AB.

I only watched every single Steelers game in his time there so no, he rarely ever saw double coverage.

Genjiro · Oct 21, 2020

Kaines said:
The only player that even COMPARES to Megatron is Larry F

Give it a year or two. Hell, nvm he already has 6 tds this year 5 games into his rookie year. Think that puts him #2 at WR in touchdowns?

Merrith · Oct 21, 2020

Genjiro said:
I only watched every single Steelers game in his time there so no, he rarely ever saw double coverage.

Antonio Brown hasn't let 'two-man' coverage slow him down

A couple of years ago, the Cincinnati Bengals came up with a new coverage for Brown. The Steelers call it “two-man,” and the Bengals enjoyed some success with it for a while.

“It’s a corner underneath and safety over the top,” another Steelers receiver, Darrius Heyward-Bey, explained. “It’s a double, but it’s a different type of double. Cincinnati started it with us, and every team has adopted it.”

While many teams might be dissuaded from attacking double coverage, the Steelers weren’t about to let opponents dictate to them. They were and remain committed to throwing to their best receiver.

Brown won’t divulge any secrets about defeating the coverage, but a lot the success traces back to the chemistry he has with Roethlisberger.

“He’s one of the few guys who has figured out how to defeat two-man,” Heyward-Bey said. “Three or four years ago, teams started playing that more against the top receivers. But we find a way. We don’t care if you do two-man. We’re still going to throw the ball to the best player on the field, and he still makes plays. That’s the great thing about A.B.”

NFL 2020 Season: Gravy Edition!

Golden Baronet of the Realm

Silver Baronet of the Realm

Vyemm Raider

Ahn'Qiraj Raider

New title pending...

Silver Baronet of the Realm

New title pending...

Mr. Poopybutthole

Ahn'Qiraj Raider

Golden Baronet of the Realm

Golden Baronet of the Realm

Ahn'Qiraj Raider

El Presidente

Golden Baronet of the Realm

Potato Supreme

Ahn'Qiraj Raider

Golden Baronet of the Realm

Ahn'Qiraj Raider

Ahn'Qiraj Raider

Golden Baronet of the Realm