Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

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Big Flex

Big Flex

Fitness Fascist
4,314
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"Phat lewtz: Fiery Avenger has been added to your General Inventory"

Oh man

He also had Brad's purple mushroom, raredropyo
 
Arden

Arden

Blackwing Lair Raider
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Eidal_sl said:
I guess we shouldn't underestimate how much of an impact Everquest made in the psyches of young growing people. I've got a few friends that literally think nothing is wrong or was wrong with EQ back in its glory days -- imply otherwise and they react very angrily and emotionally.

Something like:

Me: ("Think about the dumb shit Everquest had us doing that would never fly now.")
Friend: ("Like what?")
Me: ("Well, corpse recovery in general was just a dumb fucking idea. Talk about the antithesis of fun, I mean--")
Friend: ("Sounds like you're a fucking casual who just couldn't hack it in a real game. CR's made the game hard, too hard for newbs!")
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It's been stated before but I'll state it again to fill my monthly troll-feeding requirements:

CRs weren't fun. Harsh experience loss on death wasn't fun. Long travel times weren't fun. These things weren't put in the game to be fun. Not everything in a good gameshouldbe "fun." If a game based on character progression is filled to the fucking brim with nothing but "fun," it almost always sucks.

A good game is greater than the sum of its parts. Many elements of a game, when taken independently, don't make sense or seem like they aren't a good idea. However, when taken in concert with the other elements of the game, they are not only beneficial but necessary.

CRs, harsh experience loss, long travel times, etc. sucked. I don't know anyone who liked any of those things independently. Their existence, however, was integral to creating the overall challenging/rewarding/high-risk environment for which EQ was famous.
 
Adebisi

Adebisi

Clump of Cells
<Silver Donator>
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Forgot about Dre
rrr_img_79666.jpg
 
M

Merlin_sl

shitlord
2,329
1
Arden_sl said:
It's been stated before but I'll state it again to fill my monthly troll-feeding requirements:

CRs weren't fun. Harsh experience loss on death wasn't fun. Long travel times weren't fun. These things weren't put in the game to be fun. Not everything in a good gameshouldbe "fun." If a game based on character progression is filled to the fucking brim with nothing but "fun," it almost always sucks.

A good game is greater than the sum of its parts. Many elements of a game, when taken independently, don't make sense or seem like they aren't a good idea. However, when taken in concert with the other elements of the game, they are not only beneficial but necessary.

CRs, harsh experience loss, long travel times, etc. sucked. I don't know anyone who liked any of those things independently. Their existence, however, was integral to creating the overall challenging/rewarding/high-risk environment for which EQ was famous.
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I was going to say something very similar. The mechanics, good or bad, mistake or purposeful, all worked together to create what EQ was. Without CR's, or in that case, watered down death penalties, it reduces the fear of death as the consequences are no longer influential. While I could probably talk for about three pages on this, I will keep it to this, if you remove CR's, then you never have fear. As we all remember our hearts pounding, palms sweaty before breaking Fear or racing into Naggys room or a running across Kith forest at night or a hundred other examples. You remove the negative consequences for making a mistake, you remove the fear, and you have just removed a huge reason people played in the first place. There in never that OMFG moment we all still tell stories about to this day if you convince someone that a CR is unnecessary and players don't want it. Sure, it was a pain to get your corpse back after a bad pull or raid wipe, but it was part of the entire experience.
 
Eidal

Eidal

Molten Core Raider
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Merlin_sl said:
I was going to say something very similar. The mechanics, good or bad, mistake or purposeful, all worked together to create what EQ was. Without CR's, or in that case, watered down death penalties, it reduces the fear of death as the consequences are no longer influential. While I could probably talk for about three pages on this, I will keep it to this, if you remove CR's, then you never have fear. As we all remember our hearts pounding, palms sweaty before breaking Fear or racing into Naggys room or a running across Kith forest at night or a hundred other examples. You remove the negative consequences for making a mistake, you remove the fear, and you have just removed a huge reason people played in the first place. There in never that OMFG moment we all still tell stories about to this day if you convince someone that a CR is unnecessary and players don't want it. Sure, it was a pain to get your corpse back after a bad pull or raid wipe, but it was part of the entire experience.
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I agree. However; if a game with all those same mechanics released today, it'd fail miserably. Who the fuck would play that shit? Die-hard basement dwellers who want to Uncle Rico their glory days of classic EQ... but the whole system fails if none of the casuals give a shit. I sure as hell do not have the time or inclination to be tied to a game against my will because I rolled snakeeyes and have a corpse rotting in a dungeon somewhere. The only people I know who can do that are my self-employed friends that, coincidentally, play R99 and lament how Blizzard ruined games and nothing will ever be as good as Everquest.

I suppose if I worked from home and had near-limitless time to poopsock an MMO, as well as nothing else significant going on in my life, I'd feel differently about how much bullshit I will tolerate from a video game.
 
K

kanak32_sl

shitlord
56
0
Kyndread-Pantheon_sl said:
Sigh, ok one more post. I sent this in a private message to Convo. Guess he logged off. I thought he would likely share it here. Anyway, here is what I said.

Yes he has been coding, he used to be a programmer back before Everquest was made and codes in C or C++ I believe. As far as what specifics I cannot give that out. What I can say is I can see his updates in the folder for the game though, and his contributions seem significant to say the least to me. I'm not trying to play it up, and I'm sure you have no reason to believe anything I say, but he really is up coding late at night with several other programmers, and they have really taken us far from where we started. I know this information isn't fun to goof on, as it goes against what everyone else has been saying, at least on rerolled. I wouldn't lie for him though or make it up if it wasn't true. Also I probably wouldn't still be involved if it wasn't true. My time is limited and I could be using it elsewhere if I thought we had no chance for success or if people were just goofing off.
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The person who claims to drink themselves to the brink of death and makes a point to try to tell a hostile crowd of people about it and tucks tail when nobody cares sure sounds like someone with "limited time," just not the kind you're thinking of
 
Mario Speedwagon

Mario Speedwagon

Gold Recognition
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Eidal_sl said:
I agree. However; if a game with all those same mechanics released today, it'd fail miserably. Who the fuck would play that shit? Die-hard basement dwellers who want to Uncle Rico their glory days of classic EQ... but the whole system fails if none of the casuals give a shit. I sure as hell do not have the time or inclination to be tied to a game against my will because I rolled snakeeyes and have a corpse rotting in a dungeon somewhere. The only people I know who can do that are my self-employed friends that, coincidentally, play R99 and lament how Blizzard ruined games and nothing will ever be as good as Everquest.

I suppose if I worked from home and had near-limitless time to poopsock an MMO, as well as nothing else significant going on in my life, I'd feel differently about how much bullshit I will tolerate from a video game.
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Teenage boys don't exist any more?
 
E

etchazz

Trakanon Raider
2,707
1,056
Eidal_sl said:
I agree. However; if a game with all those same mechanics released today, it'd fail miserably. Who the fuck would play that shit? Die-hard basement dwellers who want to Uncle Rico their glory days of classic EQ... but the whole system fails if none of the casuals give a shit. I sure as hell do not have the time or inclination to be tied to a game against my will because I rolled snakeeyes and have a corpse rotting in a dungeon somewhere. The only people I know who can do that are my self-employed friends that, coincidentally, play R99 and lament how Blizzard ruined games and nothing will ever be as good as Everquest.

I suppose if I worked from home and had near-limitless time to poopsock an MMO, as well as nothing else significant going on in my life, I'd feel differently about how much bullshit I will tolerate from a video game.
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You say you agree, but you still don't get it.
 
OneofOne

OneofOne

Silver Baronet of the Realm
6,887
8,712
And yet the Hardcore feature in games seems pretty popular /shrug (you know, where if you die, you lose your character) I do agree WE aren't that target audience anymore - I don't have time to play from the time I get home from work until I go to sleep (actually, I will soon... but you get my point!), or devote an entire Saturday to camping rare shit with my homies - but like Mario said, those people do still exist. That game needs MORE than EQ had to attract a solid audience simply because you have a SHIT TON more choice than you did in '99, but that audience is there. It's just not there for a $100m game, and that's kinda the issue. Too many studios have been going for the next WoW instead of the next EQ, or even the next Eve. Hell, Eve is every bit as hardcore (and I'd argue MORE so) as EQ was, and they are a pretty profitable company. (They squander that profit on stupid shit, but that's not the point)
 
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