Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

Arden · Jan 13, 2018

Early EQ was a lonely, cold, hard world. Maybe you could get by on your own, but it was much easier to band together for survival and prosperity. If you don't have a challenging world, you take away the need to for communities. When you take away the need for communities you lose player bonding. When you flood the world with easy access content via instancing, you take away the competition factor.

The truth of the matter is that the harder people have to fight for something, the more they value it. This is as true in mmos as it is in life. Ironically, many modern mmos are afraid of losing players by making content too hard or competitive. In reality, the opposite is true. The closer you get to giving it away, the less people want it.

Skanda · Jan 13, 2018

Flobee said:
Any MMO released with the level of attention that pantheon had been getting is going to sell a lot of boxes.

Flobee · Jan 13, 2018

Skanda said:

I bet it sells 150-200k boxes in the first year. Pulling those numbers out of my ass

Skanda · Jan 13, 2018

Flobee said:
Pulling those numbers out of my ass

Seems to be a common theme between both the McQuaid fans and McQuaid himself.

zzeris · Jan 13, 2018

Flobee said:
I bet it sells 15-20k boxes in the first year. Pulling those numbers out of my ass

FTFY lol

Flobee · Jan 13, 2018

Skanda said:
Seems to be a common theme between both the McQuaid fans and McQuaid himself.

I'm pretty firmly in the wait and see camp. Every "big" MMO that releases sells a lot of boxes though. Truth is unless the game is universally panned pre-release most of us here will buy it.

The mmorpg.com style hype train is going to guarantee it sells well. Doesn't mean it will be good, who knows

Flobee · Jan 13, 2018

zzeris said:
FTFY lol

I think it's more likely the game doesn't release at all then only sell that amount of boxes. If it releases it will sell well I imagine

Skanda · Jan 13, 2018

Flobee said:
The mmorpg.com style hype train is going to guarantee it sells well.

Is that community even all that active/relevant anymore? For fucks sake, they even tried to buy us to drum up their numbers.

zzeris · Jan 13, 2018

Flobee said:
I think it's more likely the game doesn't release at all then only sell that amount of boxes. If it releases it will sell well I imagine

Yeah, just fucking with you. I think it might sell 100-125k boxes if released right in the first few months. They may be able to add some more around Christmas if they get Steam or someone to partner with them. Honestly, as weak as the development team has seemed, the marketing team has been much worse so far. That video earlier was painful to watch especially after watching a much better marketing team show Ashes of Creation. AoCr has a nice, polished presentation and is much earlier in development(more money helped).

Dullahan · Jan 13, 2018

Even if I want to play a game like what they've shown, I still realize it has to be finished and mostly bug free to be successful. Long way to go.

goishen · Jan 14, 2018

daly said:
Your baseless claim of what generation he's from couldnt be more wrong.

Then he's free to tell me what generation he's from, you asshat.

Seeing as how time's moved on, I'm thinking the average age of this board has stayed the same. Which is about 20-30.

So, yah. He's more than free to tell me what generation he's from, or let my assumption stand. Which it is.

goishen · Jan 14, 2018

Dullahan said:
Feel free to post up the mmos that looked like Pantheon in the early aughts.

No one really knows what gameplay will be successful, because nearly everyone adopted the same gameplay and players adjusted or quit. Most quit. MMOs are the only genre not growing, which seems to suggest that something went wrong along the way.

No, wrong you asshat.

MMO's were growing at a very slow and steady pace until WoW came along. Then it experienced a big boom. Like the big bang boom. It experienced exponential growth. Then, everyone and their brother jumped on the bandwagon. Then a ton of people quit.

Fucking morons.

Jarek · Jan 14, 2018

goishen said:
MMO's were growing at a very slow and steady pace until WoW came along. Then it experienced a big boom. Like the big bang boom. It experienced exponential growth. Then, everyone and their brother jumped on the bandwagon.

Man I really have mixed feelings about WoW, because I loved my time playing from 2004-06, but my god that game totally fucking wrecked the MMO genre. All the clones aside, the best example is Star Wars Galaxies, who were so desperate to copy WoW that they burned their own game to the ground with the disastrous NGE. They literally changed an existing game into a WoW clone, like 3 years into the life of the game. They just straight up removed classes from the game, like, "Sorry your class is gone now lol, try Jedi instead, it's super Iconic and Star Warsy!"

Anyway, yeah I loved WoW, but man did it fuck up MMOs.

Dullahan · Jan 14, 2018

goishen said:
No, wrong you asshat.

MMO's were growing at a very slow and steady pace until WoW came along. Then it experienced a big boom. Like the big bang boom. It experienced exponential growth. Then, everyone and their brother jumped on the bandwagon. Then a ton of people quit.

Fucking morons.

They were growing, and now they're not. I didn't name any timeframes, nor did I deny that there was an explosion in growth. Just that the popularity has died out, and not for lack of interest. People still want mmorpgs, just not the shallow variety being made.

Dunno what exactly I'm wrong about or even what we disagree on.

Fyff · Jan 14, 2018

Become one of the fallen.

goishen · Jan 14, 2018

Dullahan said:
They were growing, and now they're not. I didn't name any timeframes, nor did I deny that there was an explosion in growth. Just that the popularity has died out, and not for lack of interest. People still want mmorpgs, just not the shallow variety being made.

Dunno what exactly I'm wrong about or even what we disagree on.

Where we disagree is on the number of MMO fans there are. Say that pre-WoW, you had a million MMO fans spread throughout the entire MMO genre. Then WoW came out and that number increased to twelve to twenty million. You know as well as I do that all of those people can't be true MMO fans. Some are really young, some are social butterflies, some are just along for the ride, some are there just because it's ya know... Blizzard. Do you know the number of true MMO fans? I sure don't. What is it? A million? Two million? Two? Zero? I don't know. Even the faithful are leaving the genre.

Then it dropped. Well... I think that's about the most obvious accusation that you can make. It's about like saying that someone used a knife to stab him forty-seven times after seeing the body.

What your post failed to point out is all the stuff in the middle. That is part of why this game is gonna fail. It's a shot in the dark.

Brikker · Jan 14, 2018

Skanda said:
Is that community even all that active/relevant anymore? For fucks sake, they even tried to buy us to drum up their numbers.

Didn't they want to turn rerolled into a tabletop gaming site?

goishen said:
Then he's free to tell me what generation he's from, you asshat.

Seeing as how time's moved on, I'm thinking the average age of this board has stayed the same. Which is about 20-30.

Think zaide's in his late 20s or so, which is younger than most posters. I think you're off by about a decade in your age range.

Daidraco · Jan 14, 2018

Isnt it safer to assume World of Warcraft is just old as fuck? What is it, 14 years old? The attrition that WoW is experiencing is a far cry from a thermostat of how the MMO genre's health is. WoW's success brought around great change, for the better or worse that included far more players under its umbrella. You know as well as I do that there are far more casual players than no-lifer's playing MMO's now, in 2018, then there was in 2004. You have to appreciate WoW for what it has become and hate that the market has not produced an extremely polished deeper MMO experience that would pick a veteran MMO player up after they quit WoW.

zzeris · Jan 14, 2018

Daidraco said:
Isnt it safer to assume World of Warcraft is just old as fuck? What is it, 14 years old? The attrition that WoW is experiencing is a far cry from a thermostat of how the MMO genre's health is. WoW's success brought around great change, for the better or worse that included far more players under its umbrella. You know as well as I do that there are far more casual players than no-lifer's playing MMO's now, in 2018, then there was in 2004. You have to appreciate WoW for what it has become and hate that the market has not produced an extremely polished deeper MMO experience that would pick a veteran MMO player up after they quit WoW.

Excellent post. I definitely hate the market and the inertia that has happened since WoW. I blame the developers just as much as the publishers. Why do we still have ancient turds like Brad and Smed developing MMOs? Is this the primary reason a deeper experience hasn't come in almost twenty years? Look at the expansion of console gaming and then look at MMOs. Remember when we thought MMOs were at the defining forefront of gaming? When this was actually the case? It's sad we have to keep coming back to guys like Brad for the future of MMOs. It actually makes little sense except as a nostalgic escape into 'better' times. Even in 2005 I thought the sky was the limit. The actual limit was with developers who had little imagination and talent to go beyond their first efforts in the field. And in the newer developers who didn't even have that much imagination or talent. So disappointing.

goishen · Jan 14, 2018

Brikker said:
Think zaide's in his late 20s or so, which is younger than most posters. I think you're off by about a decade in your age range.

Really? And where in this did I make the claim that it was anything but 20-30?

goishen said:
I'm thinking the average age of this board has stayed the same. Which is about 20-30.

I mean, I'm seriously questioning your mental ability right now.

Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

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