Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO
- Thread starter gogojira_sl
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The entire team has turned it around. They are rocking and rolling. And you can tell by the pledges. Steady as shit when I thought it was about to die.
Convo
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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PBG had some serious issues with the engine to where Simu had to fly their own Engineers down to assist with development.
Unfortunately due to those issues PBG ran out of funding and had to close up shop.
They really have kicked it into high gear. Ikik dropped by for a post on the player-ran servers over at pjpantheon.
Corey seems like a really likable dude, too. Had a few conversations with him on Twitter and our exchanges had me wanting to throw in more money.
Corey seems like a really likable dude, too. Had a few conversations with him on Twitter and our exchanges had me wanting to throw in more money.
No offense, but you have no clue what your talking about. They heavily modified that engine and like Vanguard, fucked it up. That's not all the fault of the Hero engine.
Schags
Bronze Knight of the Realm
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They had to heavily modify it just to get it to work for the game to ship. The engine is not a turn key engine. You end up gutting all of the code out of it and re-writing it because it's terrible.
Had no idea who Fates Warning is. Check them out on YouTube and they sounded a bit like Wolfmother, who I'm a big fan of.
Vandyn
Blackwing Lair Raider
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Reading those comments highlights what kind of uphill climb Brad has. Some gamers have long memories. I think people forgot how much of a cluster Vanguard was and the massive disappointment that ensued. There are few games that had the kind of hype of Vanguard. Not only that it failed, but the way it did (and Sigil with it).
Muligan
Trakanon Raider
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Ut... i'm with you in all your points. Seriously. Everything you said is business sense and even common sense but then again, this is another way the internet has closed the gap and broadened the scope on an everyday practice.
Example... I had a kid come knock on my door and he was looking for funding to study abroad in China. I knew the kid and also knew he had worked for months to supplement the money his parents could afford to give him but still came up short. Thus, he went to the community. We helped him out what little bit we could and while it was really supporting a good cause I can think of numerous occasions people have presented me opportunities from religious to business and I either contributed or not.
Probably the more relevant example... It was just the other night I was watching Andy Griffith (sorry, I love the show) and a man came into town looking for local talent to make a record. Some people couldn't sing and they wanted some way to get involved. They invested so the gentlemen could make the record and in turn hoping to get a little something in return.
You have to also consider that Brad is giving investors a copy of the game. So it is not like he's asking you to fund the game and then turn around and buy it. This is no different than any other investment venture. I did this same thing with a local OrangeLeaf. I helped bring the franchise into our town but guess who's paying for yogurt every week? Heck, the primary owner pays for yogurt. We get 10% off... that's it and everyone involved still has full time jobs so it's not like we are making a living at it. We just wanted to do something nice for the town, the people, kids, and we let people get involved to make it less of a financial burden and people banned together because of what it would provide the community overall. I guess people were willing to pay to let it be our headache.
Kickstarter just took this principle and widened the scope and people are taking advantage of the opportunity in attempt to fund anything and everything but here's the beauty... regardless of the situation not one of us have to give. If you want to, it's ok. If you find it against your principles, that's fine. Sometimes products just do not happen. Not everyone can be backed by some major investor. If someone has an idea, they have to get family involved, friends, acquaintances, neighbors, whatever to get it off the ground. Kickstarter is just the virtual version of knocking on someone's door.
As my wife pointed out, 95% of these people have no clue what they are even talking about. "They heard from a friend who had a friend who knew a guy who said Brad was a piece of shit for Vanguard", and they roll with that.
Convo
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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The people who post that kind of stuff have pretty much made up their mind...When Brad responds he's not just trying to reach them.. He's reaching the lurker and giving his side.. Brad replies professionally so he comes out the winner in the rational persons mind who hopefully goes and donates.. Haters gonna hate.. It's part of the deal
Utnayan
F16 patrolling Rajaah until he plays DS3
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Good to see you too. I am glad you got everything straightened out that you needed to get straightened out.
I agree. What I do not agree with is the reward structure for those that are back funding the game without a checks and balances system to see the investment through. I also do not agree with how a publisher can step in at any moment after a cap ex Kickstarter goal gets a team going, than the revenues created from what are becoming larger and larger crowd funding opportunities go to those who never took the risk, and they see zero return financially while JQ publisher and said development team get the fiscal rewards. I know you like to make games, but let me be blunt - you also like to make money. You are creating hand crafted content. Hero Engine is designed to pump out content as fast as possible. 1) You do not need that strength. 2) You are not going to pay 7% of revenues to those folks for feature sets you will not use while having access to the source. In the end, it's about the cash. I agree with your line of thinking, I disagree with the answer you gave these folks when you said you couldn't have access to the source. Bioware, Vogel, and Walton thought they could completely re-engineer the code, ended up paying for it, but then also couldn't do it. It's amazing SWTOR even runs at all at this point, and I know that developers I know still working on the game are amazed it even compiles after patches.
Unfortunately, Kickstarter is already being abused by silent publishers. Now, if a solid, creative, original, quality game comes from Kickstarter, I may change my mind and the reward will be we have nice things. But then I look back at publishers who 1) Will reap the financial success with no risk. 2) Never greenlit the project to begin with when they should have. 3) Consumers still get nothing fiscal in return while they had everything to lose monetarily if the game never saw the light of day because frankly, they don't get any of their cash back. In my eyes, the only difference between this and the 38/RI fiasco is that the consumer has choice with Kickstarter at least.
Let's hope your game is Another Day, rather than Pull me Under. You know you will get real unmoderated replies here. IGN is a shithole. Moderated by fanboys who are bucking for positions in the industry, you and I both know this. So lots of folks would just be banned for saying anything contrary to the golden fleece rule. IGN is like 1,505 Tad10's running around with internet connections.
So, I am glad you are here. I wish you well in the game design, I hope you stick to game design over running a company. You are good at it and you created a world I enjoyed with EQ for a very long time, even as dishonest a lot of the back end was after 989/Verant was fully absorbed. I still hope Ester the Tester is out living in a tent in Siberia, and if anything, I am happy you are away from the relics at SOE (Georgeson, Danuser) that haven't the slightest fucking clue as to what they are doing.
Brad, will your game have heroic scarecrows to grind on like in EQ2? Pls respond (serious question)
Muligan
Trakanon Raider
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One thing I could always agree with Ut his his thoughts and feelings on Georgeson.
Hey Brad.. you said you referenced a Project Manager or some other staff... How comfortable is Hartsman at Trion? haha
If there were ever two people who I would really like to see take a game from the very bottom it would be Brad and Scott. The two people I need MMO closure....
Hey Brad.. you said you referenced a Project Manager or some other staff... How comfortable is Hartsman at Trion? haha
If there were ever two people who I would really like to see take a game from the very bottom it would be Brad and Scott. The two people I need MMO closure....
Hey guys, I need more links to sites/blogs/message boards/etc where I haven't been and should be. HEPL!