Rent Vs. Buy housing
- Thread starter Porkchop
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Gravel
Mr. Poopybutthole
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All those fees get rolled up into the loan. It's $0 down. Believe me, if I were shelling out money I think I'd fucking know it. The only "down payment" I have is the earnest money (and the points), and there's no getting around that for any loan ever. But if you're going to argue that, there's technically no such thing as $0 down.
Khane
Got something right about marriage
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I wasn't really arguing man. You said they were covering 5k in closing costs, the fees are more than that and there is the 1% origination fee, which is the down payment. Is the VA funding fee getting waived? And I was asking where that half point was coming from since you went from 3.375 to 3.25 which is not half a point. It's just my hatred for how confusing they make everything and how full of shit most banks/mortgage brokers are when it comes to what you'll be paying.
They're allowed to make it sound like you'll be out of pocket a lot less than you will be in actuality. I wasn't trying to say anything else.
Several people call bullshit on your interest rate and then say I'm the asshole? Gimme a break.
They're allowed to make it sound like you'll be out of pocket a lot less than you will be in actuality. I wasn't trying to say anything else.
Several people call bullshit on your interest rate and then say I'm the asshole? Gimme a break.
Gravel
Mr. Poopybutthole
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I didn't call you an asshole. Honestly I'm just explaining my loan, since no one believed that I was offered 3.375% without points. I also never said anything about half a point.
Seller is covering $5k in closing costs, and yes, there are additional fees. The bulk of which are the VA funding fee and origination. But both of those get rolled up into the loan, so we don't need cash upfront for them. My offer on the house was $236.5k, but my actual loan will be in the $241k range (our $2kish in earnest money covers a portion of this).
I will say you're correct about lenders not being completely upfront about everything. The fact that I had to pay the appraisal and inspection fees upfront was kind of a surprise, as that ended up being almost $1k.
My entire point of all of this was that Draegan, a year ago, said that money will never be cheaper as he had just locked up a 3.99% loan. Well, in a year, I was offered a 3.375% loan without points. Seems to me like money got cheaper. Even discounting the fact that I may have significantly different financial conditions than Draegan and got offered a different loan, 3.5% seems to be pretty common right now (two of my coworkers also bought houses this month and both got 3.5% without points).
Seller is covering $5k in closing costs, and yes, there are additional fees. The bulk of which are the VA funding fee and origination. But both of those get rolled up into the loan, so we don't need cash upfront for them. My offer on the house was $236.5k, but my actual loan will be in the $241k range (our $2kish in earnest money covers a portion of this).
I will say you're correct about lenders not being completely upfront about everything. The fact that I had to pay the appraisal and inspection fees upfront was kind of a surprise, as that ended up being almost $1k.
My entire point of all of this was that Draegan, a year ago, said that money will never be cheaper as he had just locked up a 3.99% loan. Well, in a year, I was offered a 3.375% loan without points. Seems to me like money got cheaper. Even discounting the fact that I may have significantly different financial conditions than Draegan and got offered a different loan, 3.5% seems to be pretty common right now (two of my coworkers also bought houses this month and both got 3.5% without points).
Khane
Got something right about marriage
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Yea I wasn't arguing any of that, I just looked at the sheets you linked and said "hrmm, that doesn't match up and some of the info is confusing" but the fees being rolled into the loan makes sense.
The confusion comes from stuff like that loan discount fee in the second sheet, it says half a percent but it's not actually half a percent. I hate rate shopping because of stuff like that, it's constant phone calls because I can't make heads or tails of what half of it means to the bottom line and then inevitably the person on the other end of the phone doesn't really know either but tries to concoct some story that just rustles my jimmies.
The confusion comes from stuff like that loan discount fee in the second sheet, it says half a percent but it's not actually half a percent. I hate rate shopping because of stuff like that, it's constant phone calls because I can't make heads or tails of what half of it means to the bottom line and then inevitably the person on the other end of the phone doesn't really know either but tries to concoct some story that just rustles my jimmies.
Cad
scientia potentia est
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Am I reading your form wrong? You are paying points, you're just rolling them up in the cost of the loan?
Gravel
Mr. Poopybutthole
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Only paying points on the 3.25% one, and they are not rolled up into the loan. Only cash outlays we have are points (only on 3.25%), earnest money, and appraisal/inspection fees. The seller is covering up to $5k in closing costs, anything over that comes out of our earnest money and then we pay the difference. The only caveat is origination and VA funding fee, which will be part of the loan.
So for instance, if we have $6800 in closing costs, the seller is covering $5k of it, and $1,800 from our earnest money is covering the remainder. We still have $600ish in remaining earnest money ($2350 total I think), which would cover part of our points...the remaining $600ish we still need to come up with.
Which, going back to what Khane says; the entire fucking process is so convoluted.
So for instance, if we have $6800 in closing costs, the seller is covering $5k of it, and $1,800 from our earnest money is covering the remainder. We still have $600ish in remaining earnest money ($2350 total I think), which would cover part of our points...the remaining $600ish we still need to come up with.
Which, going back to what Khane says; the entire fucking process is so convoluted.
Porkchop
Mr. Poopybutthole
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Found a nice tool that shows where its cheaper to rent or buy, at least in southern california:http://graphics.latimes.com/rent-or-buy-los-angeles/
Falstaff
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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It sounds like your confusing points with rates. 1 point = 1% of the loan. If the loan is 250k, it would add $2500 to the cost of the loan, but would drop the rate in this case by 1/8%.
And saying it's '$0 down' but not including earnest money in there is disingenuous. Earnest money goes towards the closing costs. You're not paying extra at closing because it's a VA loan specifically, normally you can't roll those into the loan.
