Retro Game of the Month March 2018: Castlevania: Symphony of the Night (Playstation)

Rajaah

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Rezz said:
The dialogue I heard the most (of course) was the intro with Richter by far as I learned the moveset in order to start with slightly higher overall stats.

It doesn't make a real difference, but hearing the "What is a man?.." speech over and over was oddly kind of worth it haha.
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Wait, if you beat Dracula in the intro as Richter, you start with Alucard having higher stats? I didn't know this. I would have definitely done that myself. The one time I fought Dracula I nearly beat him, he was at like 10-20% HP.

For how much this game emulates Super Metroid, it's cool that they made the "unwinnable intro fight" actually have a benefit to winning. SM's similar fight does have an easter egg where you can stagger Ridley if you do enough damage, but it doesn't affect the game otherwise.

Siliconemelons said:
I always wished that the bosses had higher difficulty... but mostly because I want "more sotn!

For that, play the Gameboy Metroidvanias - even circle of the moon, great games.
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I played the 3 GBA titles and the 3 DS ones back-to-back over a year or two when I was in college. It really is like playing six SOTN-likes and I recommend all of them. Easy enough to emulate the 3 GBA ones too. The first two are a little weaker (Circle of the Moon and Harmony of Dissonance) while the other four are fantastic and maybe even better than SOTN in some regards. Though personally I like SOTN the most, it's the only one I've replayed multiple times after all. Like I said I recommend all six, but if someone is in a hurry and only wants to play the best ones then maybe start with Aria of Sorrow (the third one).

Siliconemelons said:
Wonder if that is worse than when I was farming for a crissagrim - going back and forth between screens killing the 1 guy - had a good pattern so it was like there and i just jump slash boom- land move a square - screen and go back - well... it dropped...but the muscle memory repetition was already in full play...goodbye sword...lol
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Yeah I remember that farm. Had to pause a moment to see if it dropped before I immediately turned around. Do that every time and it gets established as the muscle memory instead of running away.

Mostly just running around lost but I had a lot of fun with this over the weekend. If I had to guess I'm probably about a quarter of the way through it because I have about half the regular castle map now. Looking for bat form next because every area left that I can't get to seems to require it.
 
Rajaah

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Does this game have a speed booster type item like Super Metroid and Bloodstained do?

Could have sworn it did, but I'm not having much luck looking it up. Saw something about an item that boosts runspeed in dog form, which is at least something, but I remember there being a way to run really fast as Alucard.

Maybe I'm just confusing his superfast speed in the game's intro with an actual item he can get.
 
joz123

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Rajaah said:
Does this game have a speed booster type item like Super Metroid and Bloodstained do?

Could have sworn it did, but I'm not having much luck looking it up. Saw something about an item that boosts runspeed in dog form, which is at least something, but I remember there being a way to run really fast as Alucard.

Maybe I'm just confusing his superfast speed in the game's intro with an actual item he can get.
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Nothing for runspeed itself I think. There's an upgrade for wolf form so if you do the hadouken then hold right you run really fast through enemies.
 
Siliconemelons

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Aria of Sorrows has one but SoTN does not speed runners back dash and you can dash in wolf form, but if your turning everything into diced meat with the crissagrim your not doing either
 
Rajaah

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Yeah that's about what I figured. Beat the game, trying Maria mode now. I thought this was basically the same game just with Maria instead of Alucard, but nope, it's basically a "normal Castlevania" version of the game where you just need to fight through to and beat the bosses, no special items or equipment.

IIRC different versions of the game have different things for this mode, so there might be one version where she can equip stuff. On PS4 she's basically the Rondo version of the character except adult. So your main attack is siccing bird-boomerangs. Lawl.
 
Siliconemelons

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Most alt modes are just fun bonuses they are not really fully fleshed out different versions

I need to replay OOE and PoR as those have been my least played
 
Rajaah

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Siliconemelons said:
Most alt modes are just fun bonuses they are not really fully fleshed out different versions

I need to replay OOE and PoR as those have been my least played
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Yeah I only sped through the 6 GBA/DS SOTN-likes ten years ago to "check them off" more or less. Barely even remember any of them. After giving SOTN a second run and getting to know it a bit better, now I want to give a second shot to those other 6 if I can find the time for them somewhere.

The best SOTN-like Castlevania at this point is probably Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night though. That game is incredible, and modern. Anyone who is an SOTN fan and missed that one, drop everything and go get it.
 
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Siliconemelons

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Rajaah said:
Yeah I only sped through the 6 GBA/DS SOTN-likes ten years ago to "check them off" more or less. Barely even remember any of them. After giving SOTN a second run and getting to know it a bit better, now I want to give a second shot to those other 6 if I can find the time for them somewhere.

The best SOTN-like Castlevania at this point is probably Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night though. That game is incredible, and modern. Anyone who is an SOTN fan and missed that one, drop everything and go get it.
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Truth, and the Record of the Lodoss war: Deedlit in Wonder Labyrinth is also good a good Metroidvania - I liked it alot as well as Bloodstained, but its ending plot-line was good, but I felt it was a bow that was wrapped but not tied up... just missing a little something.

The 8-bit style Bloodstained games are great if you like CV3 style games all done well - they are each their own contained game and "story" that uses all the Bloodstained settings and characters but are not part of the main prime game timeline / plot etc. they are just there.

I have been very happy with how much content Bloodstained has given well after the release of the game etc. I do hope for a proper sequel to it.

Harmony of Dissonance is one of my favorite, its a GBA game and is a sequel to CV2, so that is why I love it perhaps. It also, is more of a /remake/ of CV2 in a way. Also I think it is the only CV metroidvania game that has a hidden room attached to a save room.

OOE is better than POR (they are both non-Belmont games closely released) - but if you only have time for one I would play OOE. Aria of Sorrows is great, Dawn of Sorrows is okay, but for me in terms of story it is decent and shows that the castle/chaos is the evil core... and well... the name of the series is Castlevania, not /Kill Dracula/

For extra-game content, I think it is Dawn of Sorrows? or Aria of Sorrows - but the Alucard and Juste modes are nearly a full game, more fleshed out than in SOTN.
 
Rajaah

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Siliconemelons said:
Truth, and the Record of the Lodoss war: Deedlit in Wonder Labyrinth is also good a good Metroidvania - I liked it alot as well as Bloodstained, but its ending plot-line was good, but I felt it was a bow that was wrapped but not tied up... just missing a little something.

The 8-bit style Bloodstained games are great if you like CV3 style games all done well - they are each their own contained game and "story" that uses all the Bloodstained settings and characters but are not part of the main prime game timeline / plot etc. they are just there.

I have been very happy with how much content Bloodstained has given well after the release of the game etc. I do hope for a proper sequel to it.

Harmony of Dissonance is one of my favorite, its a GBA game and is a sequel to CV2, so that is why I love it perhaps. It also, is more of a /remake/ of CV2 in a way. Also I think it is the only CV metroidvania game that has a hidden room attached to a save room.

OOE is better than POR (they are both non-Belmont games closely released) - but if you only have time for one I would play OOE. Aria of Sorrows is great, Dawn of Sorrows is okay, but for me in terms of story it is decent and shows that the castle/chaos is the evil core... and well... the name of the series is Castlevania, not /Kill Dracula/

For extra-game content, I think it is Dawn of Sorrows? or Aria of Sorrows - but the Alucard and Juste modes are nearly a full game, more fleshed out than in SOTN.
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Whoa, Harmony of Dissonance is a sequel to CV2? So it's got Simon?

I'm playing Circle of the Moon a bit now and it takes place hundreds of years after the others, with a new guy who isn't a Belmont.

Main thing I remember CotM for is the graphics being kinda dark and the sprites being tiny. Then HoD goes in the other direction and the graphics are too bright and colorful. Aria of Sorrow finally lands on the right balance, then it's off to the DS for the next 3.

I liked the two NES-style Bloodstained games too. They're not as hard as people make them out to be and yeah they're great CV3 tributes. However the main Bloodstained game is the best, a modernized SotN.

Is stuff like Blasphemous, Axiom Verge 2, Timespinner, or Ender Lilies in this same category of Metroidvania type game? Hollow Knight and the Oris too maybe? I haven't played any of the above so I don't know.
 
Siliconemelons

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Both Axiom Verge games are a blast and both different. Thomas happ has some mad talent.

blasphemous is good but there are, to me some hard parts that have yet to fight through and it can be more than mastering the pattern, so that’s good and bad lol

the visuals in blasphemous are shocking and truly fit the story where all things spiritual are visible. You “see” sin and evil and they do a darn good job at it, it can be as disturbing as any modern horror as the pixel art is well done in the range where your brain still has to fill in and imagine things, but the art is also detailed enough that your going to get what it’s horrifingly meant to be.

HoD is I think Simon’s grandson, I almost said ‘direct’ sequel but I change to sequel as it continues the story from CV2 directly. I may need to check on this lol

it’s good to play in emu as gba screens sucked

Edit: Yeah HoD is Simon's grandson. It re-hashes the collect draculas parts, only your in the castle vs throughout the countryside. It has 2 castles and follows SoTN style obviously as does AoS. Those 3 are the most of any all of the same "ilk" - they even started and kinda set a subtitle naming scheme Symphony, Harmony, Aria...

PoR is fun because it has lots of different locals all as separate "castles" or stages, rather than "Why does dracula have a desert broom closet and a swamp kitchen?"... I belive PoR is a continuation of Bloodlines...*checks notes this time....* ahh yes "Portrait of Ruin introduces characters to the Castlevania series: Jonathan Morris and Charlotte Aulin. Jonathan is the wielder of the legendary whip, "Vampire Killer", which was passed down to him by his father, John Morris from Castlevania: Bloodlines."

Many consider PoR the lesser of the 3 DS titles, DoS (DS, get it hur hur) PoR and OOE - but it was fun

Have you played Mirror of Fate?
 
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Rajaah

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Siliconemelons said:
Both Axiom Verge games are a blast and both different. Thomas happ has some mad talent.

blasphemous is good but there are, to me some hard parts that have yet to fight through and it can be more than mastering the pattern, so that’s good and bad lol

the visuals in blasphemous are shocking and truly fit the story where all things spiritual are visible. You “see” sin and evil and they do a darn good job at it, it can be as disturbing as any modern horror as the pixel art is well done in the range where your brain still has to fill in and imagine things, but the art is also detailed enough that your going to get what it’s horrifingly meant to be.

HoD is I think Simon’s grandson, I almost said ‘direct’ sequel but I change to sequel as it continues the story from CV2 directly. I may need to check on this lol

it’s good to play in emu as gba screens sucked

Edit: Yeah HoD is Simon's grandson. It re-hashes the collect draculas parts, only your in the castle vs throughout the countryside. It has 2 castles and follows SoTN style obviously as does AoS. Those 3 are the most of any all of the same "ilk" - they even started and kinda set a subtitle naming scheme Symphony, Harmony, Aria...

PoR is fun because it has lots of different locals all as separate "castles" or stages, rather than "Why does dracula have a desert broom closet and a swamp kitchen?"... I belive PoR is a continuation of Bloodlines...*checks notes this time....* ahh yes "Portrait of Ruin introduces characters to the Castlevania series: Jonathan Morris and Charlotte Aulin. Jonathan is the wielder of the legendary whip, "Vampire Killer", which was passed down to him by his father, John Morris from Castlevania: Bloodlines."

Many consider PoR the lesser of the 3 DS titles, DoS (DS, get it hur hur) PoR and OOE - but it was fun

Have you played Mirror of Fate?
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Nope, no Mirror of Fate or any of the console 3D CVs (the N64 ones and PS4 ones). Not into 3D CV for whatever reason, just really like the 2D ones. Same thing happened with Contra.

Trying to keep the CV timeline straight is kinda hard since the games bounce around so much. Castlevania Legends (third Game Boy game) has you playing as Alucard's girlfriend (Sonia) and it was made the same time as SOTN so I might check that out. The first two GB CVs were classics and good for their time. Especially the second one where you had a stage select with four castles to do in any order, each one completely different. No idea about the third one with Sonia so I'll find out.

Another thing I might need to try out is Kid Dracula for the Game Boy, since SOTN's super-boss Garamoth is the villain in that game. Kind of cool that SOTN was drawing from such obscure parts of the Konami catalog.

If it isn't obvious, I love emulating Game Boy games.
 
Siliconemelons

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Rajaah said:
Nope, no Mirror of Fate or any of the console 3D CVs (the N64 ones and PS4 ones). Not into 3D CV for whatever reason, just really like the 2D ones. Same thing happened with Contra.

Trying to keep the CV timeline straight is kinda hard since the games bounce around so much. Castlevania Legends (third Game Boy game) has you playing as Alucard's girlfriend (Sonia) and it was made the same time as SOTN so I might check that out. The first two GB CVs were classics and good for their time. Especially the second one where you had a stage select with four castles to do in any order, each one completely different. No idea about the third one with Sonia so I'll find out.

Another thing I might need to try out is Kid Dracula for the Game Boy, since SOTN's super-boss Garamoth is the villain in that game. Kind of cool that SOTN was drawing from such obscure parts of the Konami catalog.

If it isn't obvious, I love emulating Game Boy games.
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CV Legends (GameBoy - Sonia) Was the "First" in timeline CV game - it had her shacking up w/ Alucard thus explaining the Belmont's power and stuff... but it was kicked from cannon, as was CoTM. CV Lament of Innocence (I forgot Lament, it is also in the title style of Aria, Symphony and Harmony, all musical things) takes the place as the /first/ and origin story of the Belmonts - it closer aligns with Brham Stroker's Dracula origin - as "Dracula" comes from a super holy dude doing a 180 and cursing God so much he becomes an evil vampire.

The lore gets fuzzy because Lisa and the stuff in CV3, DracX / SoTN and the Trevor Anime all still happen. So it kind of, Dracula's war on God is Lament / Drac's origin, and the slaying of Lisa is when he starts his war on humans - CV3 is, I think- still the "oldest" CV game in timeline next to Lament. Lisa, Alucard and her death predate CV3 (duh) and are after Lament of Innocence.

IMO Fan Theory, Dracula's War on humans is over at the end of SOTN (And should have been at the end of the Trevor Anime series, as they both kinda accomplish the same thing, Alucard /or Lisa herself in the anime/ getting it through to Drac that she would not want him to curse/kill/war against humans)

Every game instance of Dracula coming back post SOTN is a summoning, not a 100 year cycle, as the 100 year cycle is kinda part of /his/ own power and curse he makes... so after SOTN he gives that part up and is good with staying dead... but people keep summoning him. The only thing that is dubious is the 1999 "war" that AoS is a result of. I also had a fan theory that you can tell the "Real" Dracula, i.e. Lisa's husband, as any Dracula that is depicted as the SoTN style (and in the Anime) visual vs. the black slick Bel-Lagosi style "generic" Dracula... for any game that had the means to do so in graphic power... As OOE and PoR's Drac is the "generic" style, and well after the established /look/ of the SoTN Dracula.

Nerd rant off...for now.

Also, Mirror of Fate was a 2.5D like the "3d/2.5d" remake of DracX for psp- although it was off of Lord of Shadows... also Lord of Shadows (not the DLC and not 2) is a super awesome game, at least the first 2/3 the way it is put together, the narration, the story and its presentation is AAA+++ I very much recommend Lord of Shadows.
 
Rajaah

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Siliconemelons said:
CV Legends (GameBoy - Sonia) Was the "First" in timeline CV game - it had her shacking up w/ Alucard thus explaining the Belmont's power and stuff... but it was kicked from cannon, as was CoTM. CV Lament of Innocence (I forgot Lament, it is also in the title style of Aria, Symphony and Harmony, all musical things) takes the place as the /first/ and origin story of the Belmonts - it closer aligns with Brham Stroker's Dracula origin - as "Dracula" comes from a super holy dude doing a 180 and cursing God so much he becomes an evil vampire.

The lore gets fuzzy because Lisa and the stuff in CV3, DracX / SoTN and the Trevor Anime all still happen. So it kind of, Dracula's war on God is Lament / Drac's origin, and the slaying of Lisa is when he starts his war on humans - CV3 is, I think- still the "oldest" CV game in timeline next to Lament. Lisa, Alucard and her death predate CV3 (duh) and are after Lament of Innocence.

IMO Fan Theory, Dracula's War on humans is over at the end of SOTN (And should have been at the end of the Trevor Anime series, as they both kinda accomplish the same thing, Alucard /or Lisa herself in the anime/ getting it through to Drac that she would not want him to curse/kill/war against humans)

Every game instance of Dracula coming back post SOTN is a summoning, not a 100 year cycle, as the 100 year cycle is kinda part of /his/ own power and curse he makes... so after SOTN he gives that part up and is good with staying dead... but people keep summoning him. The only thing that is dubious is the 1999 "war" that AoS is a result of. I also had a fan theory that you can tell the "Real" Dracula, i.e. Lisa's husband, as any Dracula that is depicted as the SoTN style (and in the Anime) visual vs. the black slick Bel-Lagosi style "generic" Dracula... for any game that had the means to do so in graphic power... As OOE and PoR's Drac is the "generic" style, and well after the established /look/ of the SoTN Dracula.

Nerd rant off...for now.

Also, Mirror of Fate was a 2.5D like the "3d/2.5d" remake of DracX for psp- although it was off of Lord of Shadows... also Lord of Shadows (not the DLC and not 2) is a super awesome game, at least the first 2/3 the way it is put together, the narration, the story and its presentation is AAA+++ I very much recommend Lord of Shadows.
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Alright but where does Kid Dracula fit into all this?

Just kidding, that was pretty interesting stuff. So CVL and CotM were canon-scrubbed...that explains why they both seem to exist on such an island.
 
Caliane

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Rajaah said:
Does this game have a speed booster type item like Super Metroid and Bloodstained do?

Could have sworn it did, but I'm not having much luck looking it up. Saw something about an item that boosts runspeed in dog form, which is at least something, but I remember there being a way to run really fast as Alucard.

Maybe I'm just confusing his superfast speed in the game's intro with an actual item he can get.
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backdash is fastest way to run in SOTN.


the three best SOTN style metroidvanias that I've played, (that aren't outright other castlevanias) are Bloodstained, Vigil:the longest night, and record of lodoss war:deedlit in wonderland.
we've talked about it in the metroidvania? thread? or indie?. idk, one of them. Bloodstained is of coure by IGA himself. hits the feels and quality of SOTN to like 85%. its very good, but notperfect. just not packed with as much content and secrets. its closest, but not quite there. vigil is very solid. deelit is a love letter to sotn, but short. very very short.
 
Rajaah

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Wait a minute, if Symphony immediately follows Rondo...how the hell does Maria age like 6 years between the two games?

Just a retcon like the show is doing, I guess?
 
Siliconemelons

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It’s a direct sequel as the plot is directly connected. There has passed, even if the prologue likes to kinda show it’s just like the next day lol but it’s not.

the anime retconns her age but it’s not really on plot , unless some priest later in the seasons turns out to be shaft and they go that way.
 
Rajaah

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Siliconemelons said:
It’s a direct sequel as the plot is directly connected. There has passed, even if the prologue likes to kinda show it’s just like the next day lol but it’s not.

the anime retconns her age but it’s not really on plot , unless some priest later in the seasons turns out to be shaft and they go that way.
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I see, so there's actually a six year time jump between SOTN's intro (Rondo's final battle) and the very next scene with Alucard heading for the castle.

Not surprised the anime retcons Maria's age so they can just have one story move right into the next. Symphony could follow immediately after Rondo if it weren't for the discrepancy of Maria's age.

I tend to think of Rondo and Symphony as the two halves of "Castlevania V" even if neither is called that. It's the final story of the main Castlevania storyline. Everything after that is either prequel, side-quel, or some rando reviving Dracula later in time. To me the main series is CV3->CV4(or 1)->CV2->Rondo/Symphony if one were to do a chronological run of it.
 
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