Sports writer kills himself, leaves behind website describing how and why

I don't think I'd ever off myself unless my quality of life were on the verge of deteriorating significantly. If it were, however, I'd absolutely do it.

My mother died of cancer. She had liver metastases when it was first detected and was told it would be terminal. Despite that, she underwent an extremely aggressive surgery and chemo which enabled her to live for another two years. She spent much of that time nauseous and in severe pain, unable to care for herself in the most basic ways. I was her primary caregiver during her last three weeks, and held her hand as she died.

It's not for me to judge whether that "extra" time was worth the suffering or not. However, I will say that in many ways it would have been easier on everyone if she had gone suddenly. Having been a witness to the process once, there is no way that I would ever allow my loved ones to go through it for me.

Cad_sl said:

Some dude killed himself, who cares? Plenty of live people to concern yourselves with. Carry on.

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I don't think the discussion is about the guy, but about what his death represents. Freedom of choice to end your own life; something that the majority of (those in power of) this nation is(are) decidedly against allowing people to do for themselves.

Death with Dignity, assisted suicide, and aims, challenges, and realities of hospice care is something that people should give at least a little bit of thought to. It's a little morbid maybe but important. It's like deciding your Will, deciding your DNR status, deciding who has your power of attorney should the worst happen to you.

Unfortunately this guy isn't any of that, so the conversation can't be about that and about him. Those topics are hard. This is just some mook engaging in the ultimate display of white privilege. It's the fucking dissertation that gets me. Way more than the suicide. What an absolute asshole.

Of course the guy was a sports writer. Ofcoursehe was.

"This is just some mook engaging in the ultimate display of white privilege."

Really?

From my (white, privileged) standpoint, we should have humane and relatively affordable suicide booths set up already. Well, and if your nation is going to kill people (and hey, I'm actually fine with the death penalty) then it should use similar methods.

We've know for a *long* damned time how to kill people in a manner that is painless and quick. Nor is at least applying that to the death penalty ridiculous plus I think it should be extended to every citizen. If you want to die, it shouldn't mean having to shoot yourself in the head.

Or not or whatever, this isn't a fight I really care about much.

Iannis_sl said:

Death with Dignity, assisted suicide, and aims, challenges, and realities of hospice care is something that people should give at least a little bit of thought to. It's a little morbid maybe but important. It's like deciding your Will, deciding your DNR status, deciding who has your power of attorney should the worst happen to you.

Unfortunately this guy isn't any of that, so the conversation can't be about that and about him. Those topics are hard. This is just some mook engaging in the ultimate display of white privilege. It's the fucking dissertation that gets me. Way more than the suicide. What an absolute asshole.

Of course the guy was a sports writer. Ofcoursehe was.

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How is this guy not any of that? He gave plenty of examples of his failing mind. Now maybe the level of failure didn't measure up to your standard of what constitutes "acceptable quality of life" but then it's not your life or your decision. And he specifically documented his life and death so others would have resource to turn to on a topic that is taboo due to some judeo-christian religious bs we are all taught growing up as a background. Why is just living so much mroe important then living well and dying well on your own terms?

not in Florida?

Captain Suave_sl said:

I don't think I'd ever off myself unless my quality of life were on the verge of deteriorating significantly. If it were, however, I'd absolutely do it.

My mother died of cancer. She had liver metastases when it was first detected and was told it would be terminal. Despite that, she underwent an extremely aggressive surgery and chemo which enabled her to live for another two years. She spent much of that time nauseous and in severe pain, unable to care for herself in the most basic ways. I was her primary caregiver during her last three weeks, and held her hand as she died.

It's not for me to judge whether that "extra" time was worth the suffering or not. However, I will say that in many ways it would have been easier on everyone if she had gone suddenly. Having been a witness to the process once, there is no way that I would ever allow my loved ones to go through it for me.

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second this, saw my grandmother deteriorate from cancer, chemo aggressive treatment sometimes just passing is a better bet, i was a pussy at 12 but i couldent face my grandmother in her final moments and now i regret that so much it kills me.

You saw your grandmother deteriorate from chemo, not cancer.

There sure is a lot of use for the word "Crazy" in this topic of discussion. He was far from being crazy. He knew what he was doing. I support what he did 100% and I thank him for being strong enough to make that kind of decision. As a society we value life above all other things to the detriment of life itself. The only life we should have a say in is our own. He could have waited until he was 70, but he felt that his contributions to society had come close to an end and thus he decided to go while on top.

I am 44 and I can honestly say I do not look forward to getting old. My neighbor who is mid 70's one day came out and told me something. She said " You always here about how good the Golden Age is. It is bullshit, getting old sucks". Honestly look how we treat the elderly in our society at this point. Social Security is getting hammered when it should be considered a treasured thing that is exempt from all laws and changes. Our elderly should want for nothing, but as it is our society ignores them or takes advantage of them because they are weak. If you have a strong family, you are a lucky person.

My wife works as an RN in a ICU unit. She sees how pathetic and cruel families can be to their own parents. They cannot accept them dying so they do everything possible to keep them alive just for one more day, despite the extreme pain they might be in or the fact that they might want to go. I told my wife that if ever there is a situation where I know longer serve a function in society beyond laying in a bed and there is only a slight chance of recovery, please let me go. I love her dearly, but I refuse to be a drain on her. I have always found it amazing that we have no problem euthanizing a dog or cat when they have reached a certain point, but we cannot be merciful to a human being.

In the end it is up to the person whether or not they want to leave this existence. As a society we think it selfish that they make that choice and yet we are just as selfish for criticizing it.

I was at an estate sale a few years ago in the city and it was alright but a little on the expensive side. There wasn't much for me but people were buying stuff and the service running the sale were wheeling and dealing a bit on prices even though it was the first day and the sale had just opened. I didn't see him right away but there was this old guy in the kitchen next to where people were checking out. He was sitting on a stool not saying anything. Someone would walk up to the cashier and be like, "you've got 30 on this lamp, would you take 15? How about 20?" Maybe the lady in charge came down, maybe she didn't. Someone brings a clock up, same shit. This time the old guy looks up, looks at the clock, a price is negotiated, and he goes right back to looking at nothing.

His wife had died and he was being put in to a nursing home. All of their belongings were being sold and he was sitting there in the kitchen as person after person entered his home, tromped about, and tried to make a buck off his tragedy. He had no say in anything that happened that day, what he got to keep or not keep, or how much he wanted for anything. That was the first time I actually felt like a ghoul. In the years I've been an antique dealer I've found myself front row for some pretty fucked up shit. That old guy sitting on that stool, alone, as everything in his life was being bartered for, is one that sticks with me. I don't fear death. I don't fear getting old either. I fear losing all control of my life. What happened to that old man willneverhappen to me. I will never be the guy sitting there, forced to sit and watch as his life is stripped away object by object before being shuttled off to the home. It will not happen. I will burn the whole goddamn thing to the ground with me still in it first.

Mahes_sl said:

There sure is a lot of use for the word "Crazy" in this topic of discussion. He was far from being crazy. He knew what he was doing. I support what he did 100% and I thank him for being strong enough to make that kind of decision. As a society we value life above all other things to the detriment of life itself. The only life we should have a say in is our own. He could have waited until he was 70, but he felt that his contributions to society had come close to an end and thus he decided to go while on top. .

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So under your logic we should kill anyone who is not making "contributions to society" but is not "strong enough" to make that decision for him or herself.

Nice.

I love how you continue to externalize these decisions as if it's not the person themselves deciding what to do with their own life. I suppose you have to frame it like this to justify your moral outrage or something /shrug

Just stop being dumb dude.

OneofOne_sl said:

I love how you continue to externalize these decisions as if it's not the person themselves deciding what to do with their own life. I suppose you have to frame it like this to justify your moral outrage or something /shrug.

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And you act like the person deciding isn't suffering from depression or other mental illness thus reducing his capacity to make such decisions.

Do we let four year old children make all their decisions for themselves? No, because they are at a much reduced capacity for decision making given their age. Same thing with depression, dementia, drunken binges and the like.

tad10_sl said:

And you act like the person deciding isn't suffering from depression or other mental illness thus reducing his capacity to make such decisions.

Do we let four year old children make all their decisions for themselves? No, because they are at a much reduced capacity for decision making given their age. Same thing with depression, dementia, drunken binges and the like.

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God, it's time to stop now. Here is the DSM IV about depression:

Specific symptoms, at least 5 of these 9, present nearly every day:
1. Depressed mood or irritable most of the day, nearly every day, as indicated by either subjective report
(e.g., feels sad or empty) or observation made by others (e.g., appears tearful).
2. Decreased interest or pleasure in most activities, most of each day
3. Significant weight change (5%) or change in appetite
4. Change in sleep: Insomnia or hypersomnia
5. Change in activity: Psychomotor agitation or retardation
6. Fatigue or loss of energy
7. Guilt/worthlessness: Feelings of worthlessness or excessive or inappropriate guilt
8. Concentration: diminished ability to think or concentrate, or more indecisiveness
9. Suicidality: Thoughts of death or suicide, or has suicide plan

You're telling me every person who thinks about committing suicide or decides to has 4 other symptoms? Don't even bother saying yes because the answer is no. Self-determination into suicide is possible without having depression.

Tuco_sl said:

Tad, would you be okay with the same procedure of legally assisted suicide in the US being done for those aren't terminally ill or even under any pain/de-abilitation?

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I'm flat out against suicide - assisted or otherwise, abortion and the death penalty (as noted on page 1). So no.

I am fine with DNRs, refusing treatment and purely palliative care. If you don't want the chemo, but want the morphine for pain until you die, that's fine.

As I've said, we as a society are way, way to casual with death in all its forms.

Weaponsfree_sl said:

Self-determination into suicide is possible without having depression.

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As I said before, all of you non-depressed people who are advocating suicide on this thread feel free to go kill yourself. *Crickets*

I'm going to go with 100% of people wanting to kill themselves are depressed to a greater or lesser extent. -_-


Edit: Okay I've repeated myself twice in two posts which means I've got nothing else to contribute to this thread - mea culpa for getting back in on page 3.