Star Wars: The Last Jedi (2017)

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Khane

Khane

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j00t said:
I keep seeing how pissed people are that VICE ADMIRAL holdo wasn't telling a newly demoted CAPTAIN poe the plan. She even reminds him that the last act of HER superior was to demote him. He wasn't even allowed on the bridge most of the time...

Do you guys really not understand how military works?
Click to expand...

She didn't say shit even after Poe and co went all mutiny and said "THIS IS WHAT WE ARE DOING TO SAVE EVERYONE WHILE YOU JUST SIT THERE WITH YOUR THUMB UP YOUR ASS!"

She just sat there and said nothing. And after she regained control, again nothing. This wasn't a case of "This is on a need to know basis and you don't need to know" and then Poe went quietly to his bunk. The entirety of those exchanges was done in a way that was only meant to keep the audience in the dark, because it was the only way Rian Johnson knew how to build any kind of suspense. It's terrible story telling. And her plan was fucking stupid too.

"OH my god it's brilliant! They'll definitely not be scanning for anything other than our main ship because reasons!"
 
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kegkilla

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j00t said:
I keep seeing how pissed people are that VICE ADMIRAL holdo wasn't telling a newly demoted CAPTAIN poe the plan. She even reminds him that the last act of HER superior was to demote him. He wasn't even allowed on the bridge most of the time...

Do you guys really not understand how military works?
Click to expand...
Yes I do. Leadership formulates a strategy, then disseminates that plan to the forces. Do you understand how the military works? Are you under the impression that soldiers are not given an understanding of their objective? When the allies stormed Normandy, do you think one day they were told, "just get in these boats and see what happens." ??
 
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Lanx

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Khane said:
She didn't say shit even after Poe and co went all mutiny and said "THIS IS WHAT WE ARE DOING TO SAVE EVERYONE WHILE YOU JUST SIT THERE WITH YOUR THUMB UP YOUR ASS!"

She just sat there and said nothing. And after she regained control, again nothing. This wasn't a case of "This is on a need to know basis and you don't need to know" and then Poe went quietly to his bunk. The entirety of those exchanges was done in a way that was only meant to keep the audience in the dark, because it was the only way Rian Johnson knew how to build any kind of suspense. It's terrible story telling. And her plan was fucking stupid too.

"OH my god it's brilliant! They'll definitely not be scanning for anything other than our main ship because reasons!"
Click to expand...
Actually, no.

Rian Johnson is showing you that bc of failure at middle management princess Leia, she let the first order arise from the ashes of the empire. Let's not forget, she's princess of broken rocks and evidently a horrible mother since she raised another fucking sith Lord(not really sith, but whatever).

So she continues to be a bumblin buffoon, in tfa, she continues to believe that space Jesus, her own flesh n blood brother will come out of hiding to save them all and devotes fleet wide resources to play where's Waldo.

Somehow the one and only true hero, Poe that has managed to destroy a planet killer and now a fleet killer, the only person with charisma ppl can get behind( otherwise how else are you able to convince ppl to mutiny???) Gets shelved and put on the back burner.

Now that Leia is FINALLY, not fucking shit up, by being in force coma, there's an even more incompetent bitch taking the reins.

He's showing you why the resistance sucks so bad, no will come to bail them out and they've been reduced to such a small number that they can all fit in the falcon.

Bitches ruin everything
 
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Tuco

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Chukzombi said:
i'm sure this is the hundredth time this was posted, but i am lazy.

there could have been a good battle with luke and kylo, but it was all a fucking troll job
Click to expand...

They need to cram the jokes in this clip into 3 minutes like they did with prometheus.
 
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Gavinmad

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Bit of a stretch to call the Resistance a military in the first place. They're about as organized as Antifa, and possibly even less competent.
 
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j00t

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kegkilla said:
Yes I do. Leadership formulates a strategy, then disseminates that plan to the forces. Do you understand how the military works? Are you under the impression that soldiers are not given an understanding of their objective? When the allies stormed Normandy, do you think one day they were told, "just get in these boats and see what happens." ??
Click to expand...

Okay, let's look at their situation... Holdo was doing... SOMETHING. People on the bridge clearly knew what was going on because no one was surprised when poe barged in on the bridge and figured it out. The bridge crew ALSO defended holdo when poe tried to remove her from command.

Poe is a pilot with no ship. Poe clearly has no tactical thinking skills or his super secret plan might have a better chance.

What would telling poe the plans have served OTHER than alleviating poe's worries? (and the audience's?)

Honestly I was bothered by what was happening because I was SUPPOSED to be bothered by it. Our point of view is poe's.

Soneone said it about 50 pages back, but poe needed to be distrustful in order to send Finn and rose to Canto bight. And we (and Finn, I'd guess) needed to see the casino and how NOBODY CARES about the resistance. They are making money regardless of who's in charge.

The new republic didn't really do anything to help the galaxy. That's why no one came to help at the end and that's why Luke had to make a legendary appearance. People follow legends.

Again it was a little manipulative from a story telling standpoint, but holdo wasn't acting out of character for a high ranking military officer to not tell their plans to the whole force. Remember, the only people who knew how they were being tracked were poe, Finn and rose. THEY were acting more selfishly than anyone else on the ship
 
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j00t

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Gavinmad said:
Bit of a stretch to call the Resistance a military in the first place. They're about as organized as Antifa, and possibly even less competent.
Click to expand...
And yet they all have military ranks. Hm.
 
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Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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j00t said:
I keep seeing how pissed people are that VICE ADMIRAL holdo wasn't telling a newly demoted CAPTAIN poe the plan. She even reminds him that the last act of HER superior was to demote him. He wasn't even allowed on the bridge most of the time...

Do you guys really not understand how military works?
Click to expand...
pretty sure there is no military chain of command or order in the rebels. i dont think a non military space thief would be trusted with the plans to destroy the death star or allowed to leave with that knowledge.
 
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kegkilla

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j00t said:
Okay, let's look at their situation... Holdo was doing... SOMETHING. People on the bridge clearly knew what was going on because no one was surprised when poe barged in on the bridge and figured it out. The bridge crew ALSO defended holdo when poe tried to remove her from command.

Poe is a pilot with no ship. Poe clearly has no tactical thinking skills or his super secret plan might have a better chance.

What would telling poe the plans have served OTHER than alleviating poe's worries? (and the audience's?)

Honestly I was bothered by what was happening because I was SUPPOSED to be bothered by it. Our point of view is poe's.

Soneone said it about 50 pages back, but poe needed to be distrustful in order to send Finn and rose to Canto bight. And we (and Finn, I'd guess) needed to see the casino and how NOBODY CARES about the resistance. They are making money regardless of who's in charge.

The new republic didn't really do anything to help the galaxy. That's why no one came to help at the end and that's why Luke had to make a legendary appearance. People follow legends.

Again it was a little manipulative from a story telling standpoint, but holdo wasn't acting out of character for a high ranking military officer to not tell their plans to the whole force. Remember, the only people who knew how they were being tracked were poe, Finn and rose. THEY were acting more selfishly than anyone else on the ship
Click to expand...
upload_2017-12-30_11-44-8.png
 
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j00t

j00t

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Chukzombi said:
pretty sure there is no military chain of command or order in the rebels. i dont think a non military space thief would be trusted with the plans to destroy the death star or allowed to leave with that knowledge.
Click to expand...
Yeah, there's clearly a bunch of inconsistencies with their ranking system. If there's no chain of command, why would ANYONE get demoted? On top of that, poe tries to relieve holdo of command. But if there's no chain of command...

It's goofy. Leia tells iden versio in the game that no one gives anyone any orders in the rebellion, but then she gets yelled by telling danger squad what to do. Shriv says, "last I checked I'm still in charge of danger squad" and iden apologizes.

So /shrug
 
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Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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j00t said:
Okay, let's look at their situation... Holdo was doing... SOMETHING. People on the bridge clearly knew what was going on because no one was surprised when poe barged in on the bridge and figured it out. The bridge crew ALSO defended holdo when poe tried to remove her from command.

Poe is a pilot with no ship. Poe clearly has no tactical thinking skills or his super secret plan might have a better chance.

What would telling poe the plans have served OTHER than alleviating poe's worries? (and the audience's?)

Honestly I was bothered by what was happening because I was SUPPOSED to be bothered by it. Our point of view is poe's.

Soneone said it about 50 pages back, but poe needed to be distrustful in order to send Finn and rose to Canto bight. And we (and Finn, I'd guess) needed to see the casino and how NOBODY CARES about the resistance. They are making money regardless of who's in charge.

The new republic didn't really do anything to help the galaxy. That's why no one came to help at the end and that's why Luke had to make a legendary appearance. People follow legends.

Again it was a little manipulative from a story telling standpoint, but holdo wasn't acting out of character for a high ranking military officer to not tell their plans to the whole force. Remember, the only people who knew how they were being tracked were poe, Finn and rose. THEY were acting more selfishly than anyone else on the ship
Click to expand...
considering that there are more people in a Lord Nagafen raid than in the rebellion. i think the pilots sway a little more clout than normal. even pilots are told their objectives. stop defending the indefensible. they have a hippie military structure. there is nothing orderly about it. if they had any structure it wouldnt be a fucking shock when the pink haired cunt was picked as second in command .
 
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j00t

j00t

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kegkilla said:
Korriban seems like the only appropriate destination for people who defend this filth.
Click to expand...

who said i was defending it? it wasn't a good movie. it wasn't terrible, but it wasn't good either. it had all kinds of pacing issues and the director actively tried to alienate the audience.

that being said... i don't know man... rian johnson was given the middle of a trilogy where people were all up in arms for being formulaic. i think he tried to make a couple of really poignant statements about the universe of star wars at large that i think are interesting. but i also think that disney wouldn't have agreed to any of those statements if they were as blatant as they needed to be to justify the weird story.
 
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Caliane

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last few posts brought back up the idiocy of "the resistance" from TFA. so I went to wookiepidea for a refresher on why the fuck "the resistance" is even a thing. aka, where the fuck is that actual Republic fleet?

Apparently, Mon Motha gets the credit for being the dumbest person in the universe. after the war, put forth "the military disarmament act" to eliminate all military presence in the galaxy, and rely only on legislation to govern. This removed all Rebel/Republic arms, but with no military, had no way to enforce Imperial worlds from rearming and forming the First order.
Leia thought it was stupid and privately funded the Resistance fleet.

Military Disarmament Act

Just a bafflingly stupid move. From a writing point of view, it obviously creates problems, thus more stories.. but god damn, how retarded does that make Mon Mothma?
Even outside the Imperial rearming, Starwars is a universe RIFE with slavery, pirates, privateers, gangs, etc. This universe absolutely needs a strong military to act as the British navy in Pirate waters vs pirate states, or the US naval protecting trade routes.

(ps. THAT is also a movie that could/should be made in the Starwars universe.. Just without han solo...star wars pirate movie.)

But also, should totally have some merchants in the next movie be like, "fuck the republic, and fuck the Resistance. where were you assholes when my ships were being torn apart by Hutt pirates, mandolorians, slavers? no where, with your peace bullshit. The Imperial naval stops slavery, it executes pirates, it protects my crews."
 
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j00t

j00t

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Caliane said:
last few posts brought back up the idiocy of "the resistance" from TFA. so I went to wookiepidea for a refresher on why the fuck "the resistance" is even a thing. aka, where the fuck is that actual Republic fleet?

Apparently, Mon Motha gets the credit for being the dumbest person in the universe. after the war, put forth "the military disarmament act" to eliminate all military presence in the galaxy, and rely only on legislation to govern. This removed all Rebel/Republic arms, but with no military, had no way to enforce Imperial worlds from rearming and forming the First order.
Leia thought it was stupid and privately funded the Resistance fleet.

Just a baffling stupid move. From a writing point of view, it obviously creates problems, thus more stories.. but god damn, how retarded does that make Mon Mothma?
Even outside the Imperial rearming, Starwars is a universe RIFE with slavery, pirates, privateers, gangs, etc. This universe absolutely needs a strong military to act as the British navy in Pirate waters vs pirate states, or the US naval protecting trade routes.

(ps. THAT is also a movie that could/should be made in the Starwars universe.. Just without han solo...star wars pirate movie.)

But also, should totally have some merchants in the next movie be like, "fuck the republic, and fuck the Resistance. where were you assholes when my ships were being torn apart by Hutt pirates, mandolorians, slavers? no where, with your peace bullshit. The Imperial naval stops slavery, it executes pirates, it protects my crews."
Click to expand...

ugh, is that for real? i just took it as no one believed the first order was real until they blew up the senate, at which point there was no one to direct the military and/or the powers left in charge were too afraid to stand up to the first order.
 
Gavinmad

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Maybe the new SW stuff is actually a slow burning red pill agenda based on showing how fucking incompetent women are as leaders.
 
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Aaron

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kegkilla said:
according to this official map from Disney, the casino planet Finn and chins visit is on the complete otherside of the galaxy from where the Resistance fleet is. I know travel times aren't really expanded on in Star Wars lore, but in Episode 2 Padme insists that Anakin goes to Geonosis to help Obi Wan because it would take "forever" for the Jedi to get there from Coruscant. so, the idea that Finn could go to Cantonica and back in a matter of hours doesn't hold up at all. just another plothole to throw onto the pile.

star-wars-galaxy-map.jpg
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Down there in the right hand corner, between Crait and D'Qar it says "Path of the Resistance Fleet". What path is that exactly? Is that meant to be the distance the fleet traveled during the duration of TLJ?? Cos that's about, what? 7-8% of the diameter of the galaxy. And the film is supposed to take place during a matter of a few days? Now, even if we assume that this is a tiny galaxy compared to The Milky Way, we're talking traversing dozens, (more likely hundreds, if not thousands) of lightyears in a few days... while NOT using hyperspace. Well, now I may be wrong about my assumptions above, bit if not, who the fuck needs hyperspace anyway? You could travel the width of the galaxy in the same time it takes to take a trip by boat from China to Europe, about a month. Fuck this shit!
 
Malakriss

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Disney didn't learn a thing from Marvel, didn't pre-plan out the triology and beyond, and didn't have anyone take a basic literature class to point out all of the shitty writing and fix it before it ever got filmed.

They could have gone with the same exact story points but given it to a Marvel movie writer and we might have gotten an 8 without all of the plot holes.
 
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