Taxes 2016

Blazin · Feb 22, 2017

this is a snipet of my actual 2016 1099 you can clearly see it states "wash sale loss disallowed" a person sees that and says ok you can't take that loss but you can but the mechanism for doing so is retarded. This is real life example, I am getting that $49k reduction against my gains but they are wash sales and they do apply. I apologize if I suck at explaining this I'm never comfortable explaining topics like this via a chat forum you'll have to let me know if you understand what I'm explaining.

Cad · Feb 22, 2017

You just keep saying the same thing over and over without explaining.

Do you have any IRS rulings or court decisions on this which support your interpretation?

Blazin · Feb 22, 2017

I already posted actual broker data and 1099 you are the one making an assertion that there is some part of the rule stating their must be future shares for the loss to apply to. What more do you want? I have real life examples showed you actual data showing they are wash sales.

If I'm repeating it's because you're ignoring the rule And adding more to it based on what would seem logical .

Something being a wash sale and your ability to recognize that loss are not mutually exclusive.

Blazin · Feb 22, 2017

To be clear again I end the year flat that means no holdings all cash. I make no trade in all of December, but there above is my 1099 with $49k in wash sale loss that by your interpretation shouldn't exist .

So not sure why you would ask for a court case or think it's my interpretation.

Cad · Feb 22, 2017

Blazin said:
To be clear again I end the year flat that means no holdings all cash. I make no trade in all of December, but there above is my 1099 with $49k in wash sale loss that by your interpretation shouldn't exist .

So not sure why you would ask for a court case or think it's my interpretation.

You didn't answer the question I posed: in the examples you're giving, did you have remaining shares after your sale or did you sell all shares?

Cad · Feb 22, 2017

Wash Sales and Worthless Stock -- The Motley Fool

Burning bridges
But -- and this is a very big "but" -- the wash-sale rules don't apply if you close out your entire position in the stock before the end of the year and then stay out of the stock for the required 30-day period before or after the date of the loss sale.

Either you're the only expert in the world that understands this or you're wrong.

Blazin · Feb 22, 2017

I am an expert who understands it my fucking 1099 is pasted above all positions sold no shares held. That quote is correct in that you avoid the PAIN of the disallowed loss, it says the exact thing I just told you no trades for 30 days BUT it is a wash sale and must follow wash sale reporting then you get to take your loss.

I understand it sounds like minutia but being able to recognize the loss if done right is correct saying that wash sale doesn't apply is wrong.

this is not me theory crafting.

Your disconnect is thinking that being able to recognize the loss means the rule didn't apply . It does apply and you can follow steps to recognize the loss. This is important because it is indeed possible to mess it up and not being able to recognize the loss and thinking it didn't apply can lead to that mistake.

Is that more clear?

Blazin · Feb 22, 2017

Just read the whole article you linked the author does understand the rules and is Stating the exact same thing I have repeatedly. The only mistake is the paragraph you quote. And he is simply misspeaking it does "apply" but you can recognize the loss. That is why my 1099 looks that way if you just took him at the way he worded it then my 1099 wouldn't show that "disallowed loss" that turns out is allowed.

It's not your fault to think me silly you just are thinking that disallowed loss means it's not allowed which seems reasonable but isn't true as the very article you linked shows.

This all started with your assertion that it is "clear". I'm done with the issue unless you directly address my 1099 disallowed loss with no held positions nor traded for 30 days at year end.

This back and forth started with you disagreeing that wash sales are an eye bleeding annoyance and then posted showing you don't understand how the rule affects the handeling of a transaction but only understand the net taxable result in one particular setup

Cad · Feb 22, 2017

Not really, but we can just agree to disagree, your 1099's mean literally nothing, as thats just the broker flagging any possible wash sale if multiple purchases have been made prior to selling, and your 1099's don't show whether you still had a position in that issue or not. Further, all the articles I can find which address the issue agree with my interpretation, and furthermore, even if we assume the wash sale rule did apply to a buy X, buy more X, sell all X scenario, it would make LITERALLY NO DIFFERENCE because the loss on the original purchase would be added to the cost of the second purchase which was also sold on the same day, which means your loss deduction would be exactly the same. If you're saying that your broker would flag that as a wash sale and you'd file the 8849 as if it were a wash sale just because your 1099 flagged it as such, thats fine. Me, I'd correct the 8849 and correctly report the cost basis and make it not a wash sale, since it isn't, and I'd be comfortable arguing why to the auditor.

But hey, you do what you want with this super complex issue bro. I hope you understand it more clearly than you're explaining it.

Cad · Feb 22, 2017

It's not an eye bleeding annoyance and you've done nothing to show it is except say over and over how complex it is and how many people misunderstand it and how you're a millionaire.

Thats not persuasive evidence of anything man.

Blazin · Feb 22, 2017

Great for you I find it an annoyance and don't like having to explain anything to auditors but if that is your idea of a good time the I guess you win, but you are wrong on how the IRS wants the reporting and discrepancies from your 1099 absolutely will be flagged for review.

So to sum up having disagree and think me wrong for disliking :

Copious record keeping to account for worthless 1099s
Having to adjust 1000s of transactions for a rule that was never meant to address these type of transactions
Having to respond to its reviews and audits clarifying

We both get the rule and only now I see you are simply hand waving how the broker is going to report it and how the IRS wants it reported and the work that creates

Edited out being cunty not looking for a fight

Blazin · Feb 22, 2017

Cad said:
It's not an eye bleeding annoyance and you've done nothing to show it is except say over and over how complex it is and how many people misunderstand it and how you're a millionaire.

Thats not persuasive evidence of anything man.

I need persuasive evidence to say I find it annoying?

Interacting with you appears unfruitful . I deleted within seconds stating my net worth but you reference it anyway just to act the dick. It's only relevant in that I'm not an Ametuer on this issue but I find it uncouth so I deleted.

Been here for 16 yrs but but I forget how cunty people will act even without provocation. I'm sorry I exaggerated my annoyance (my eyes didn't actually bleed) and my presentation of an IRS rule as complex that you deem simple.

I'll try again for your approval:
"I find wash sale reporting by my broker for transactions that I will be allowed to recognize as a loss due to no longer holding the security nor trading for thirty days to be cumbersome "

Edited post - argueing on the internet makes my eyes bleed and is too complex

Poster · Feb 23, 2017

Anyone have any idea how long it takes the IRS to take your additional taxes owed if you e-filed via turbotax? I owed about $7k to the feds and filed 2 weeks ago but they still haven't taken the money out of my account.

Picasso3 · Feb 23, 2017

I think Blazins dick is bigger

Blazin · Feb 23, 2017

Poster said:
Anyone have any idea how long it takes the IRS to take your additional taxes owed if you e-filed via turbotax? I owed about $7k to the feds and filed 2 weeks ago but they still haven't taken the money out of my account.

I believe it default to tax day as the payment date unless you change it.

Blazin · Feb 23, 2017

Picasso3 said:
I think Blazins dick is bigger

I sincerely apologize if the back and forth turned into dick measuring, I don't think that has any place in these sub forums and my only goal when posting here is to be helpful to a forum that I have enjoyed being part of.

To those reading let me summarize by saying that whenever you sell a stock at a loss (outside of a retirement account) it would be prudent to make sure you are not creating an unintended wash sale.

Picasso3 · Feb 23, 2017

Just messing around, all good.

Cad · Feb 23, 2017

Blazin said:
I sincerely apologize if the back and forth turned into dick measuring, I don't think that has any place in these sub forums and my only goal when posting here is to be helpful to a forum that I have enjoyed being part of.

Same and I'm not really trying to argue, I think we just failed to communicate and thats ok.

Picasso3 · Mar 1, 2017

I have got to start up a business or something and start pulling bullshit on taxes. What are the secrets, rich people?

a_skeleton_03 · Mar 1, 2017

Picasso3 said:
I have got to start up a business or something and start pulling bullshit on taxes. What are the secrets, rich people?

I wish it was that easy. I have a C corp just sitting there but can't figure out how to leverage it.

Taxes 2016

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