Terminator (2019)

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j00t

j00t

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oh, i know. i'm not saying that it was a low opening weekend because of any bad reasons. just compare that to today where if you don't have a $60m+ opening weekend it's an utter failure and no producer will touch a sequel.

in today's world T2 would never have been made
 
Goatface

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i remember when terminator came out, it didn't even play at either of the local theaters, had to wait till it was at the drive-in
 
Gavinmad

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I guarantee T2 would still get made today. Terminator was actually highly profitable for its budget, but as long as it wasn't an outright flop there's a solid chance T2 still would have been made. T2 was made because Arnold became a big action star, not because someone specifically thought Terminator deserved a sequel.
 
Malakriss

Malakriss

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Terminator the universe is a concept that could hop back and forth for sequels or chapters with unknown sequencing, yet they all fail with formulaic rehashing of the same material done badly. The TV series is the only entry past T2 that actually tried to explore and could have gone a lot further with another season.

T3,5,6 are all trying to remake T2. T4 was the odd ball that didn't quite go full future and still failed to add any real twists. Everything T4 showed was meaningless it was simply hey this movie is at point A and prior movies established we'd get to B so by the end it got to B. Forget all of these characters existed cause they'll never reference it again. Plus they canceled the TV series for that.

Should have made this a Netflix series instead of a trilogy cause at least they'd get three seasons out of it before it was canceled, I don't expect a theatrical run to green light two more.
 
Lithose

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Malakriss said:
Terminator the universe is a concept that could hop back and forth for sequels or chapters with unknown sequencing, yet they all fail with formulaic rehashing of the same material done badly. The TV series is the only entry past T2 that actually tried to explore and could have gone a lot further with another season.

T3,5,6 are all trying to remake T2. T4 was the odd ball that didn't quite go full future and still failed to add any real twists. Everything T4 showed was meaningless it was simply hey this movie is at point A and prior movies established we'd get to B so by the end it got to B. Forget all of these characters existed cause they'll never reference it again. Plus they canceled the TV series for that.

Should have made this a Netflix series instead of a trilogy cause at least they'd get three seasons out of it before it was canceled, I don't expect a theatrical run to green light two more.
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T4's being dogshit was heart breaking. Since I was a kid, I wanted a Terminator Future Wars movie. And its the only thing they haven't have tried 8 different times.

A Netflix/Amazon future wars series, with John Connor rising up and turning the tide by knowing the future would be fucking amazing. But it probably won't happen now. If it does happen, it will be some Mexican woman who can't save the U.S. due to border patrol having stopped her before the war started and thus the future will be female somewhere in south America, where the last "humans" are (Get it, because America gave up its humanity turning away the poor immigrants--oh so clever, give me an Emmy!)
 
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ohkcrlho

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T4 is a prequel, all prequels faill on an important matter, surprise factor. You already know Wtf is going to happen.
And I still think you should have some mystery, like, everyone wanted a future film like we saw in T1. But... I think it's still good to have that appeal to imagine and wonder how went down and how they fought and survived.

The same shit with Alien. The element of horror is that you don't know what the hell is that thing, where did it come from but sure it's a vicious fucker.
But no... Let's make the origin story and remove all that lol
 
Drinsic

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ohkcrlho said:
T4 is a prequel, all prequels faill on an important matter, surprise factor. You already know Wtf is going to happen.
And I still think you should have some mystery, like, everyone wanted a future film like we saw in T1. But... I think it's still good to have that appeal to imagine and wonder how went down and how they fought and survived.

The same shit with Alien. The element of horror is that you don't know what the hell is that thing, where did it come from but sure it's a vicious fucker.
But no... Let's make the origin story and remove all that lol
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T4 wasn't a prequel. It was a sequel that took into account the events of the first 3 films, Bale references them. It was supposed to be a new trilogy that didn't deal with time travel but rather the eventual defeat of the machines. The problem is that it was directed by a dipshit like McG.

There's nothing inherently wrong with a prequel. Prometheus could have and should have been awesome, but Scott sucks now and Lindelof is a fucking idiot. There was plenty of shit we didn't know about the engineers and that makes a compelling hook.
 
j00t

j00t

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prequels have a bad rep because of a couple high profile movies that are simply terrible movies. but like Drinsic said, a prequel in and of itself isn't a bad premise if it's done creatively. just because we know how something ends up doesn't mean the journey isn't worth exploring. i mean, we all knew the avengers were going to win, but infinity war was absolutely still worth watching.

memento is a perfect example of how knowing what happens FIRST gives how it ends a completely different context. the problem, generally, is that if you change the overall context of another movie you risk alienating people who enjoyed it. it's tricky, but you can do it.
 
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Homsar

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Drinsic said:
There's nothing inherently wrong with a prequel. Prometheus could have and should have been awesome, but Scott sucks now and Lindelof is a fucking idiot. There was plenty of shit we didn't know about the engineers and that makes a compelling hook.
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Yet he just made The Martian few years ago
 
Malakriss

Malakriss

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Homsar said:
Yet he just made The Martian few years ago
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Ridley was handed that from an obscenely well written book which already had the screenplay by Drew Goddard. Ridley can still direct or be a producer but much like Lucas he should be nowhere near the writing side of things. Meanwhile, Lindelof should be panhandling on a street corner.
 
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DickTrickle

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j00t said:
oh, i know. i'm not saying that it was a low opening weekend because of any bad reasons. just compare that to today where if you don't have a $60m+ opening weekend it's an utter failure and no producer will touch a sequel.

in today's world T2 would never have been made
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John wick got a sequel and it was only a modestly successful film. Domestic gross was only 43 million, barely more than Terminator 25 years ago. It was the 77th ranked film compared to terminator's 21st spot.

So, yeah, not everything has to be a monster hit for more to come from it.
 
TheNozz

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Rajaah said:
Really happy for more Terminator, can't wait. That said:

-With all the talk about "this is ignoring the other movies", it's only actually contradictory with one of them. This isn't Highlander where every movie contradicts all the others. Since Salvation functions as a prequel and Genisys functions as an alternate timeline where everybody lives happily ever after, the only movie that Dark Fate is really replacing is T3. So T3 is the one I'll probably be comparing it to directly. It's got a lot in common with T3, an over-the-top action spectacle. Difference is Sarah isn't dead and Arnold isn't the hero. Protecting John wasn't actually the objective in T3, protecting his girlfriend was. So this movie having a new damsel in distress fits there too. Speaking of...where the hell is John?
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Pretty sure Salvation is a direct followup to T3: the film explicitly states that as of 2003, Judgment Day had not yet occurred when T2 firmly establishes that Judgment Day originally takes place August 29, 1997. Salvation follows the "Judgment Day postponed due to the events of T2 timeline" that's established in T3. I assumed T3 takes place in 2003 but it may have been 2004

Oh and Salvation also goes out of the way to mention the nuclear fuel cells of the 800 series Terminators, something that was only established in T3.

Double edit: had to go back and watch again but when Marcus signs the consent form to donate his body for research, the header on the form reads "Cyberdyne Systems" which should no longer exist in the altered timeline (T3 establishes that Cyberdyne was bough out and folded into Cyber Research Systems). So it's possible that Salvation takes place in a wholly new timeline or someone on the Salvation staff didnt do their research into the canon

Also, Kate Brewster and the presence of T1's are carried from T3 into Salvation
 
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Slaanesh69

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TheNozz said:
Pretty sure Salvation is a direct followup to T3: the film explicitly states that as of 2003, Judgment Day had not yet occurred when T2 firmly establishes that Judgment Day originally takes place August 29, 1997. Salvation follows the "Judgment Day postponed due to the events of T2 timeline" that's established in T3. I assumed T3 takes place in 2003 but it may have been 2004

Oh and Salvation also goes out of the way to mention the nuclear fuel cells of the 800 series Terminators, something that was only established in T3.

Double edit: had to go back and watch again but when Marcus signs the consent form to donate his body for research, the header on the form reads "Cyberdyne Systems" which should no longer exist in the altered timeline (T3 establishes that Cyberdyne was bough out and folded into Cyber Research Systems). So it's possible that Salvation takes place in a wholly new timeline or someone on the Salvation staff didnt do their research into the canon

Also, Kate Brewster and the presence of T1's are carried from T3 into Salvation
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We need RLM's Science Guy's interpretation of the Terminator timeline to interpret all this.
 
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Brad2770

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The timeline was fractured when the original terminator and Kyle Reese were sent back. From then on, you have several different timelines all mixing and intermingling. At least that’s the thought I got from Terminator:SCC. I think the third faction in SCC was a build up to find out the there may be multiple Skynets fighting each other and maybe John Henry was the kingpin to pull it and hold it all together.
 
TheNozz

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Another theory I have about DF itself:

In the final trailer the new villain is confronting the heroes and says something to the effect of “why not give her to us?”

it’s most likely that “us” means the machines as a whole, but I’m thinking another possibility is that the new villain is a composite being: the endoskeleton and the liquid metal coating are technically two distinct beings that can separate and combine for different scenarios. It would explain why it takes so long for it to morph off the skeleton and onto the truck in the trailer. Probably it’s weak point too
 
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spronk

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wrong. its weak point is that it doesn't understand love or why trannies cry
 
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Nidhogg

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I'm surprised humanities last and final hope to avert judgment day is still a cis white male.
Edit: or is John Connor no longer the messiah? It's been a confusing ride.
 
Brad2770

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Nidhogg said:
I'm surprised humanities last and final hope to avert judgment day is still a cis white male.
Edit: or is John Connor no longer the messiah? It's been a confusing ride.
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As fractured as the timeline is, I think it’s time to resurrect a savior from the 80’s

D9488E12-5B3F-4889-8A18-DEDA5DB36E01.jpeg
 
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kaid

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Brad2770 said:
The timeline was fractured when the original terminator and Kyle Reese were sent back. From then on, you have several different timelines all mixing and intermingling. At least that’s the thought I got from Terminator:SCC. I think the third faction in SCC was a build up to find out the there may be multiple Skynets fighting each other and maybe John Henry was the kingpin to pull it and hold it all together.
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That was one good thing about the last terminator movie where it was pretty much acknowledged that causality was probably busted beyond repair and it was effectively a forever war where no matter what they did it was not really going to have a lasting effect due to reality basically having turned into a spaghetti.
 
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