the ecological fallacy and identity politics

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Agraza

Agraza

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Bring back public shaming and ridiculing of minorities and we'll get back to being a melting pot. In each exchange the good things stick around and the bad things wear down. We get to keep all the good food, alcohol, clothes, etc. without all the hangups about skin color, religion, nationality, etc. being indicators of work ethic or family values.

If your people's methods are so great, why are you leaving where they're the norm?
 
Sadre Spinegnawer

Sadre Spinegnawer

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Agraza said:
If your people's methods are so great, why are you leaving where they're the norm?
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One of two reasons: 1) those beliefs or values were not the norm or 2) a lot of this world is hurting in many, many ways. Sometimes due to underdevelopment, ethnic strife, war, you name it. The US is paradise in comparison.

Jesus what a weak argument that was Agraza
 
Palum

Palum

what Suineg set it to
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Sadre Spinegnawer said:
Yeah. What has education ever done for us, really?


edit: AG carrying on the good fight.
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The issue is that liberalism requires long term planning and cohesive social structure to work. There's now generations of people programmed to be subservient to government programs permanently and obtain more for themselves through advocating other people give it rather than personal advancement.

There is no simple way to educate people into individual liberty while simultaneously enslaving them to welfare. People are ultimately simple animals for all their complexity and are risk averse.

Doubly impossible when even teaching personal responsibility is considered hateful and bigoted. There is no way to simply "educate" out of this, it's going to take social change on a magnitude never seen without calamity first.
 
maskedmelon

maskedmelon

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ZyyzYzzy said:
To be a tard for the sake of being a tard, it is not strength that makes someone a seal and another not. It is determination and ability to ignore instincts and rudimentary urges.
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not a retarded point at all ^^ and I entirely agree, there are certainly other traits that play more importantly (perhaps much more) into becoming a special operator. that does not however negate the idea that if strength is at all important (even if it is the least important) to becoming a special operator, then a smaller percent of women will be able to qualify.

that of course doesn't mean that a disproportionate advantage in another area won't mitigate the physical disadvantage an average woman suffers. in fact, if women in general were to possess a higher degree of competency in some other area that is inversely correlated with effectively mitigates the strength disadvantage, then it it wouldn't matter at all.

The other thing thing about special operators is that they are not at all average. We are talking about individuals who are more than one standard deviation above the mean in general performance. when evaluating populations of different distributions with differing standard deviations, that becomes very relevant. that is really going in another direction though ^^


the point though is that one can generalize (effectively too) without faulty logic or false premises.
 
Mario Speedwagon

Mario Speedwagon

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Muurloen said:
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>objectivist
>Jew

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Pasteton

Pasteton

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Education system is something that can be remolded /reshaped and is our hope for a better future. Removing identity politics from its entrenched position is an important part of that and there are people fighting the good fight.

Eliminating diversity what does that even mean? Sorry this isnt Japan it's not gonna happen. Should we Just shoot every brown and yellow person? Diversity is here to stay. people being properly informed and knowledgeable of how to reign in the retards is the only hope we have.
 
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Mario Speedwagon

Mario Speedwagon

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Pasteton said:
Diversity is here to stay. people being properly informed and knowledgeable of how to reign in the retards is the only hope we have.
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Then you have no hope. You will never end identity politics with "education". Weird how identity politics comes to the forefront as diversity increases. Who could have predicted this?
 
maskedmelon

maskedmelon

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education can show a person what to think, but not how to think. an individual not given to thinking never will be. idiocy is undying in the virile loins of mediocrity.

diversity is readily quelled in conformity. every ambition is not equally praiseworthy. temper individualism with social intolerance and know peace. homogeny is harmony.
 
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Sadre Spinegnawer

Sadre Spinegnawer

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Palum said:
The issue is that liberalism requires long term planning and cohesive social structure to work. There's now generations of people programmed to be subservient to government programs permanently and obtain more for themselves through advocating other people give it rather than personal advancement.

There is no simple way to educate people into individual liberty while simultaneously enslaving them to welfare. People are ultimately simple animals for all their complexity and are risk averse.

Doubly impossible when even teaching personal responsibility is considered hateful and bigoted. There is no way to simply "educate" out of this, it's going to take social change on a magnitude never seen without calamity first.
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I disagree with you about what education / culture is capable of, but dude, that was well said. And I think your point is valid, and a real challenge to someone like me. In fact, I have to admit, I actually am far less sanguine about the consequences of *having* a robust social safety net than the costs of not having one. Of how bad the latter is, I think I have a strong case. But what you are arguing, is I have not thought hard enough about the consequences of having the former. I agree. But that is where, I would argue, the can-do spirit needs to kick in. America needs to get over this defeatism. We can solve any problem we want to. The issue ever is, do we want to solve it? As things stand regarding the topic here, nope.
 
Sadre Spinegnawer

Sadre Spinegnawer

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Mario Speedwagon said:
Then you have no hope. You will never end identity politics with "education". Weird how identity politics comes to the forefront as diversity increases. Who could have predicted this?
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I am going to strenuously object. You would be surprised. trends and fads come and go in education, both basic and higher. I work in the field, as it were, and I can vouch, it is the twilight of identity thinking in academia. The pendulum is swinging the other way. And if you want to say, who the hell is academia to dictate intellectual trends, academia sez: too bad, get a doctorate, loser. lol

edit: I did not mean this as personally aggrandizing. If a general says what is militarily astute or the norm, or a banker tells me how capital works, or a doctor tells me how my kidneys work, I am going to believe them. I am saying, this is what is happening in academia, that the pendulum is swinging, as ever. It is just how "education" works. It is a circuit that does try (at least in civilized countries) to always correct itself. So do not despair I guess is my message.
 
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