The Falcon and the Winter Soldier

Cybsled said:

They mean the show, not the character

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i thought we were discussing her role with SHIELD being canon.

Chukzombi said:

i thought we were discussing her role with SHIELD being canon.

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Why would you bring up her picture when Peggy was there in the flesh in that scene?

Chukzombi said:

Fort Meade? where the Tesseract was. i think her picture was also there in Winter Soldier.

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Fort Meade? Wasn't that base in Jersey?

Merrith said:

Fort Meade? Wasn't that base in Jersey?

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Camp Lehigh. Dunno where Chuk got the idea it was Meade, but then he also apparently missed the fact that Hayley Atwell is IN the damn movie.

Gavinmad said:

Why would you bring up her picture when Peggy was there in the flesh in that scene?

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because she was with SHIELD after WW2, thats why her picture was still up in Winter Soldier? after WW2 in Agent Carter, they made her a desk jockey and then after she busted a few cases they promoted her up the chain.

Gavinmad said:

Camp Lehigh. Dunno where Chuk got the idea it was Meade, but then he also apparently missed the fact that Hayley Atwell is IN the damn movie.

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oops yeah, Camp Lehigh, thats the place in WS.

Now I feel a need to watch Winter Soldier again, which will inevitably lead to GotG and a bunch of other MCU movies. thanks.

Sterling said:

Now I feel a need to watch Winter Soldier again, which will inevitably lead to GotG and a bunch of other MCU movies. thanks.

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i watched Winter Soldier 2 weeks ago and i wanted to watch it again the next week. i watched it over a dozen times on cable. probably 2 dozen.

Chukzombi said:

i watched Winter Soldier 2 weeks ago and i wanted to watch it again the next week. i watched it over a dozen times on cable. probably 2 dozen.

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GotG is my favorite MCU movie, but Winter Soldier is probably the one I've seen the most times.

Sterling said:

GotG is my favorite MCU movie, but Winter Soldier is probably the one I've seen the most times.

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there is an awful lot of stuff that happens in that movie, tons of interesting dialogue, its full of detail. just the government plot to kill everyone their algo deems a threat in the future blows your mind. i still dont know how Dr Strange was on their radar back then. because the guy he performed surgery on went to Tibet and got a mystery cure and that Strange drove like shit? those two things made him a candidate for assassination?

Chukzombi said:

because she was with SHIELD after WW2, thats why her picture was still up in Winter Soldier? after WW2 in Agent Carter, they made her a desk jockey and then after she busted a few cases they promoted her up the chain.

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SHIELD formed after WW2, but not instantly. She joined British Intelligence, then latched onto the US Intelligence service. But post WW2, she got mired in her desk jockey job and office politics giving her less choice missions. Later on, SHIELD is formed and involves Howard Stark, Peggy Carter, etc. It's also when guys like Zola and other HYDRA agents infiltrated SHIELD from its inception.

Cybsled said:

They even mention it, but life during the snap would have been better for some. Which makes sense. Let’s say you’re a business and your main competitor gets decimated by the snap - now you have a virtual monopoly. Or the snap hurts an enemy and let’s you seize a victory in a war (either real or political).

Easy to see that angle

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Valderen said:

Half the population being gone means there was a lot of opportunity for the people that were left like better jobs, better housing, etc.

It's not hard to imagine that for a lot of people life during the snap was better, they improved their lot in life...and post snap takes away a lot of what they might have had during those 5 years.

So yeah it's easy to understand their point of view.

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I mean, this is the reasoning in the show--but this isn't how it works. Lets say your competing business got snapped--sure, you'd 'dominate' the market, but the market would be half its original size. In addition, inevitably key resources (Humans) from your business would be gone--if not your business, then your supply chain, which leaves a lot of room for growth in opposing businesses.

The only real opportunities which would come up is the labor required in developed countries to return to their way of life, which would encourage some immigration from developing-->developed (Especially since the developed nations would suffer far, far, far less due to their automation). But that would be a relatively tiny portion of the global population left. The show is trying to portray that somehow economic opportunities increase as the population decreases, but that's the opposite of reality--more people create more capital/wealth to exploit. If half the people were gone, the earth would enter into a severe global depression for decades, or longer--that would make life absolutely miserable, unless the snap was targeted at the least productive members of society. (But since its random? Yeah--life would go to shit)

THis is why most large business are very pro-'open borders'. (They only see the economic picture...They fail to correctly asses the difficulty in large systems when communication baselines are different--IE cultural/language issues)

Chukzombi said:

i watched Winter Soldier 2 weeks ago and i wanted to watch it again the next week. i watched it over a dozen times on cable. probably 2 dozen.

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I love SJ in that film. She gives me the ability to do push ups without using my arms.

Falxy-US said:

Two more days!

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Until what? What did I miss?

Lithose said:

If half the people were gone, the earth would enter into a severe global depression for decades, or longer--that would make life absolutely miserable, unless the snap was targeted at the least productive members of society. (But since its random? Yeah--life would go to shit)

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While I think I agree with most of what you're saying, but probably ignoring it in the end.. I think Patriotism/Nationalism is kinda their main point than glossing over the actual economic impacts. More than likely bankrolling on the kind of post-9/11 phenomena where everyone became immediately patriotic and a sort of one'ness to some extent, which iirc is kinda how the whole flag smasher plot line is trying to explain that the world came together during the blip; realistic probably not at all or maybe only through their scope.. I lived in a military town, so my view is a little bit different w/ how the Base Gates were.. damn near looked like a zombie apoc was coming. Funny enough I watched a QnA with a guy who had been in prison for the last 21 years(incarcerated 1998, released, I guess 2019 doing the math).. and one of the questions asked was how was his experience in the prison during 9/11 and answered something along the lines of the prison going into a long lockdown for a few months but everyone was drawing flags and hanging them up.. and a lot of hate/gang/group segregation shit stopped for a bit.

Eitherway, my brain is turned off for this show.. makes it a bit more enjoyable since the action is good and the banter has been relatively fun. I got the Zemo I wanted.

Something I find funny is that the writer, and I think someone else had been talking up a big cameo come next episode.. and pretty much no one is talking about it because Paul Bettany pretty much burned everyone, that no one is risking any excitement at even trying to guess it.

gauze said:

More than likely bankrolling on the kind of post-9/11 phenomena where everyone became immediately patriotic and a sort of one'ness to some extent, which iirc is kinda how the whole flag smasher plot line is trying to explain that the world came together during the blip; realistic probably not at all or maybe only through their scope

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Nothing unites people faster than a common threat everyone can agree on, but the blip wasn't like that. The blip wasn't really a known threat outside the small circle that knew what caused it - a bunch of shit basically vanished, so presumably it would be more like a Rapture-type event where you have vast swathes of the world not knowing what the fuck happened, not knowing who to blame or how to explain. When that happens, people tend to make their own explanations, which leads to people placing blame on various things.

I think short term it was probably along the lines of everyone realizing everyone just got impacted big. I do agree that immediate action would be sort of a level set and information share among countries, but once the shock wore off, I think it would basically just become another "this is the new normal, same as the old normal".

Cybsled said:

Nothing unites people faster than a common threat everyone can agree on, but the blip wasn't like that. The blip wasn't really a known threat outside the small circle that knew what caused it - a bunch of shit basically vanished, so presumably it would be more like a Rapture-type event where you have vast swathes of the world not knowing what the fuck happened, not knowing who to blame or how to explain. When that happens, people tend to make their own explanations, which leads to people placing blame on various things.

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Well, it's not that secret. There were giant space ships hanging over New York and such in Infinity War, even before they launched an Invasion at Wakanda, a literal minute or so before the blib. Make the link to the 2012 Alien invasion of Avengers 1, and it's not much of a stretch that these extra-planetary hostiles are the cause, even if/before the surviving Avengers, etc.. put the story of what happened out there.