Vanguard - I don't give a fuck if it's dead, It's still brown as fuck (Download link in 1st post)
- Thread starter TheYanger
- Start date
Hey Eli, well if you are here than I guess that means SOE is aware of the EMU project.... Anyway I don't know if you worked on VG at all but I kinda feel like the release of COW and how much crap it broke and pissed off the players is what finally drove SOE to sunset it. Any accuracy to that? Were there many folks over at SOE that even liked VG? Cause it seems like VG was the red-headed step child in SOE's line up.
It's still bullshit that VG can run, with a REQUIRED sub for what, 2 years, with no devs/updates? And stay alive. Yet they make it f2p, give it a shop, put in the all access plan, release a new raid and are like "lol bye".
Faux
Lord Nagafen Raider
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In my unqualified opinion, this is pretty accurate. It was a combination of the lag that introduced in that fateful patch that was never fixed, the phase out of the racial starter areas, the new best buff system, the new equipment scheme of CoW, then CoW itself that started driving the die hards to quit. Plus it seemed like every change broke something else since the code was apparently a mess. I guess SOE finally got tired of dealing with it.
Bruman
Golden Squire
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The reasons aren't near that cryptic. Smed's even said why. VG had a tiny population. They tried their best to give it attention. It was ran in the negative for years, taking money from other projects to try and get it to be profitable. After enough years of failing, it was given the axe. They would've just let it run with no updates, but their account log in system is shared across all their updates, so it's not like they could truly leave it alone and running. Most businesses would've shut it down long before now. Same as EQMac.
Korrupt
Blackwing Lair Raider
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Most people coming from EQ like me also came to raid. Actually my entire guild came and Vanguard took 2+ years to release raid content. Then when they did it was bugged for weeks with 2-10 second lag. At the height of all of the issues they put Sillius in charge who all we ever got with Vanguard was broken promises and bugged content.
Tearofsoul
Ancient MMO noob
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Faux
Lord Nagafen Raider
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Wasn't APW released in Oct/Nov of 2007, making it about 8-9 months after release? It doesn't make your point any less valid though, especially since swamp armor wasn't even completable when people were reaching 50. Having to wait another 6 months after that sucked, especially with the lag you mentioned.
Korrupt
Blackwing Lair Raider
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I think it was the last actual one that I enjoyed. Taking time to do the celestine wardship armor quests, camping dungeons, and just the open world aspect was so nice.
Szeth
Trakanon Raider
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This is why I want so badly for a Vanguard emu to become reality. I only ever played up to lvl 20 or so - long, long after the game was on it's deathbed and I had a fucking BLAST. I imagine you could level solely through dungeon/group quests with a few buddies and the entire time have it feel like you're accomplishing more than moving your exp bar. Also the classes were fun as fuck.
Daidraco
Golden Baronet of the Realm
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I worked on VG at Sigil. What finally caused SOE to sunset it was simply low population. If a game isn't making money, there's no reason to keep it. SOE is not a charity. We're a business. It makes ZERO sense to intentionally operate a game at a loss.
I always thought VG and EQMac were simply loss leaders. I would assume as much for EQ but I think I was reading not too long ago that EQ has more pop than EQ2? Dunno but if EQNext ever gets made perhaps.
it is jsut frustrating time right now as an avid MMO gamer. EQ is decrepit, EQ2 is aged and EQNext is still gestating meanwhile WoW is basically doing a full reset and there does not appear to be much on the horizon to anticipate, at least for me.
it is jsut frustrating time right now as an avid MMO gamer. EQ is decrepit, EQ2 is aged and EQNext is still gestating meanwhile WoW is basically doing a full reset and there does not appear to be much on the horizon to anticipate, at least for me.
Bruman
Golden Squire
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I'd say the opposite. There's tons to pick from, and due to WoW's success, there's a lot of options out there. GW2 is no-sub and looks great, and is lots of fun for a while. FFXIV fits that bill as well - and is even more great if you're a big FF nerd. Wildstar just launched and a lot of people like it. There's also TESO, but we'll just not talk about him. SWTOR is still trucking along with a so-so FTP model (but seriously just sub), but still fun if you love Star Wars. LOTRO still puts out content updates if you love to explore Middle Earth (just don't go there for a gear grind or grouping). And of course, WoW is still trucking along with just a metric fuck-ton of shit to do at level cap (raiding, dungeons, mount farming, rep farming, pet farming, pet battles, some farm thing, achievement hunting, some brawler's guild thing, and I'm sure more) - and WoW does a "full reset" with every expansion, and sometimes just with patches. It's same-ole, same-ole. Rift is still cranking along. Then there's a metric ton of other no-sub/FTP MMOs to check out and try too.
The times are just different, in that there isn't that ONE BIG MMO to look forward to, because everyone is doing it now. MMOs have a shorter shelf life too because there are other options (which I think is overall a good thing, who wants to play ONE single game for years? Sure it sounds neat, but bleh).
Ok I am well aware that if a game isn't making any money, the company running the game will cancel it. My question was why did SOE negelct and fail to advertise VG so much that it ended up running at a loss causing SOE to cut it? I mean in 2009, SOE stuck VG in maintence mode for like almost 2 years with no updates, etc. You really think paying customers are going to stick around for a game that is stagnant? Just seems to me SOE didnt really want to be bothered with VG from the begining.
I understand you probably can't answer this question entirely as you are not one of the guys that makes the decisions on where SOE puts it's resources. It just boggles my mind any company would purchase a half made project, then piss it into the ground. Don't get me wrong, had SOE not even done that, VG would have never been. But I can't help but feel if SOE put a little more into it, they wouldnt be sunsetting the game in 6 days. But perhaps the game was way too broken code wise that it would have cost SOE way too much to fix it, IDK, i just was really curious about the general feeling SOE has toward VG over the years from the time they bought it until now.
Edit: I also wonder if VG would have made enough money to stay alive had it remained a Sub based game only and never went F2P.
Not to keep beating a dead horse here but again it seems to me that it was more than just money that made SOE sunset it instead of putting it back in maintenence mode and lowering the sub. I mean I find it hard to believe VG made more money in the 2 years it was in maintenence mode than it does now. If it did then its because it was a sub game and SOE had no problem charging people to play a game that was getting no updates.
Several players even asked SOE to just put it back in maintainence mode but were refused becuase "thats not good customer service." LOL SOE had no problem doing that before. Oh well I guess its all moot. Whats done it done, will just have to wait til the EMU goes live at this point.
Noodleface
A Mod Real Quick
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They already said it's not gonna happen. Mostly because the UR2 engine costs royalties and so since SOE still owns the IP, they would be responsible for those royalities even if they made the game open source. Which raises another theory. I wonder if VG had been designed in another engine, one that didnt require the payment of royalties, would it be sunsetting?