What are Action-MMORPGs lacking ? Or not lacking ?

has anyone done a true first person combat mmorpg? emphasis being on the rpg part. ultimately its where i feel the action combat is going. companies are to scared to take the leap so they implement a half measure to test the waters.

No because first person RPG combat sucks in every game that has ever tried it.

All MMOs are lacking the same thing, their user experience is streamlined and optimized like they are single player games, and consequently they lack any kind of long term content and motivation. The base game comes out, your beat it (level to cap and get purples) like a single player game, and when an expansion/content patch come out you do the same with that. The months in between you play other games. That and the delusion that MMO pvp is endless motivation - current gen MMO pvp is a tiered item grind, and that doesnt offer endless motivation.

So the draw to play every day is gone because your goals are strictly laid out and achievable within a short time. To fix this, MMOs need to go back to having long term things to do that occupy players even without a recent addition. Epic quests, deep crafting, side games that well integrated into the MMO (Housing and the like), slow item acquisition, and so on.

Personally I also think that alts are considered content these days and that's a bad thing. Because it creates a "been there, done that, not doing that shit a second/third time" feeling which contributes to leaving for greener pastures. If you had more different things to do on your one character instead of doing the same stuff on 4 of them that feeling wouldnt come up or not be pushed into your face that much at least.

bixxby_sl said:

Being a wow clone with slightly more involved combat has been the bane of every action mmo so far.

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I don't find GW2 to be much of a WoW clone. I would say in answer to the question that GW2's combat lacks group interdependence and coordination of skills.

Group interdependence I'd agree with. But you can coordinate for a MUCH better efficiency if your whole group knows what everyone is doing. Most content in GW2 is either too easy or too dodge-dependent for that too matter much though. The Aetherblade retreat dungeon from summer is a good example of culling out the facerollers.

Dmitry_sl said:

I don't find GW2 to be much of a WoW clone. I would say in answer to the question that GW2's combat lacks group interdependence and coordination of skills.

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GW2 isn't near the only action rpg on the market. Also GW2 sucked dick because it has no character progression or reason to play it as an rpg after you hit cap. It's socialism the game and socialism isn't fun.

I don't know if you would consider Neverwinter 'action combat' or slightly upjumped WoW combat. I find the combat fun and refreshingly different enough, however. It definitely suffers from 'hang out and wait in queue' syndrome though, unless you are a tank or healer. Though that is the same story with every game that has tanks, healers and queues. Which I guess makes it standard MMO combat instead of action-y. Ah, well.

Neverwinter definitely lacks class/role variety; they could use another tank or healer class (cavalier paladin, swordmage, warlord, runepriest cleric, 4th Ed DnD has a couple cool takes) instead of where they are going with another DPS (scourge warlock). If they released a new tank or healer class, and judging by the popularity of the ranger debut, Neverwinter dungeon running would undergo a renaissance.

The problem I see is that the MMO model is based purely on grinding and action-oriented combat (in the real sense, not dressed-up WoW shit) doesn't lend itself well to that model when you're talking about a PvE environment. Fights either need to be more meaningful and different; or AI needs scale so vastly that it can mirror the behaviour of actual, somewhat intelligent beings (e.g. us). AA combat on mindless NPCs gets annoying much faster than tab-targeting the same mobs; but if you could get a real FPS MMO with intelligent creatures it would be THE BEES KNEES.

tldr; break the grinding model or make better shit for us to kill.

I need a game where I can hack limbs off or do different damage depending on where I hit someone.

Mr Creed_sl said:

Personally I also think that alts are considered content these days and that's a bad thing. Because it creates a "been there, done that, not doing that shit a second/third time" feeling which contributes to leaving for greener pastures. If you had more different things to do on your one character instead of doing the same stuff on 4 of them that feeling wouldnt come up or not be pushed into your face that much at least.

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It would certainly be nice to have more real content. However, in reality the constraints for content are time and money. It boils down to whether you prefer to burn through a set amount of content slowly on one character or fast on several. And given that choice I personally prefer the latter.

Asherah_sl said:

It would certainly be nice to have more real content. However, in reality the constraints for content are time and money. It boils down to whether you prefer to burn through a set amount of content slowly on one character or fast on several. And given that choice I personally prefer the latter.

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The thing is that many people actually dont want to burn through it a second (third/fourth...) time, they just do it because what else is there? Just look at any MMO ever and how much bypassing of repetition is put in. Because people might level that alt but they're not happy about and it and letting the company know. Company conclusion is "make alting easier" instead of "make content last longer or make more of it". Obviously because the company solution is easier but it isnt better.

Cooperation and consequences. Games are still using the make health bar go up, make health bar go down model for raids. The "holy trinity" is boring for a variety of reasons. Now imagine an FPS space game. Instead of shooting aliens on some alien planet, you and your guild are a crew members on a capital ship. The people sitting on the bridge at the helm chairs are flying the thing, and the folks sitting at the gunnery stations get to shoot the close in rapid fire shit to take out fighters and torpedoes. Down in the belly of the ship, the torpedoes are launched, and the big main guns are fired. In engineering, power is being redirected to vital systems as required, and when the ship starts to take damage, you actually have to hop in a pressure suit and go close doors so the entire ship doesn't vent into space or allow marines into the ship to try and capture it. But oh shit, if enemy marines do get in, people have to hop up, grab a gun and repel boarders. And you know what, fuck those guys, let's go hop into a shuttle, board their ship, kill their crew, and take their entire ship. Or just blow it up, whatever. That is what I am hoping the future of gaming looks like.

Arakkis_sl said:

Cooperation and consequences. Games are still using the make health bar go up, make health bar go down model for raids. The "holy trinity" is boring for a variety of reasons. Now imagine an FPS space game. Instead of shooting aliens on some alien planet, you and your guild are a crew members on a capital ship. The people sitting on the bridge at the helm chairs are flying the thing, and the folks sitting at the gunnery stations get to shoot the close in rapid fire shit to take out fighters and torpedoes. Down in the belly of the ship, the torpedoes are launched, and the big main guns are fired. In engineering, power is being redirected to vital systems as required, and when the ship starts to take damage, you actually have to hop in a pressure suit and go close doors so the entire ship doesn't vent into space or allow marines into the ship to try and capture it. But oh shit, if enemy marines do get in, people have to hop up, grab a gun and repel boarders. And you know what, fuck those guys, let's go hop into a shuttle, board their ship, kill their crew, and take their entire ship. Or just blow it up, whatever. That is what I am hoping the future of gaming looks like.

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You probably needthisto work to see your hopes come true.

I'm going to say I love action MMO's, and haven't really left DCUO since launch. Skill is involved, I can beat people in PVP in green gear, when they are in purple gear, if they have low skill, or aren't paying attention. The issue is, in DCUO, skill is greater than gear. So a good player can beat encounters he shouldn't be able to on paper. So if you are in a good league, you have people quitting, because they can beat everything without the gear. Over the years, I've heard players ask why they need better gear at all.

There's got to be a balance between gear and player skill level in an action game.