Wheel of Time
- Thread starter hodj
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Guest, it's time once again for the massively important and exciting FoH Asshat Tournament!
Go here and give us your nominations!Who's been the biggest Asshat in the last year? Give us your worst ones!
Sterling
El Presidente
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Yeah, at least for these early parts, i don't really see how they can do it later on though, the 2 characters have very divergent paths and both are very important.
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Lumi
Vyemm Raider
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I mean I never once thought about it since I don't really care that much. However, that might make a little bit of sense for colored robed but how the fuck do you keep all white clothing completely spotless 24/7? Not possible now matter how hard you try really.
pharmakos
soʞɐɯɹɐɥd
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First season adaptation syndrome. I'm sure they follow online chatter, I bet they make a stand to try to make season 2 a closer adaptation.
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Sterling
El Presidente
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I mean they could probably just do things at random and it would be a closer adaptation at this point.
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Hateyou
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Furry
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If this was in our world this might be one of the dumbest statements I've ever read, but I mean in the context of the show and the world they're building, you're probably not wrong.
Hateyou
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Of course it’s in context wtf! It was out of nowhere in context of this story from the book we’re discussing.
Furry
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I can just imagine random marriage day. You, marry.... ... ... ... YOU! and then boos or cheers from the gallery.
Hateyou
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They actually could have done that and been fine with all the Indian people they cast.
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Furry
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I thought indian people had a marriage market. Definitely not marrying pajeets without a substantial fee involved.
Caliane
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The cloths thing is really bad related to the 1 month later. Zero effort was put into that. they all look EXACTLY the same, after 1 month on the road running from a fade, minotaurs, avoiding white cloaks, etc.. no beards, no dirty/greasy hair, no dirt on their cloths, etc..
The questioner scenes really just highlight how poor the writing is. Every aspect of them, makes no sense.
he thinks egwain is a channeler, because she had a male companion and saw her twice... shes not wearing color robes. He drops his knife and crys like a little girl, when perrin wolfs out... instead of stabbing the darkfriend. like what? leaves the tent to let them talk. MAYBE he was easedropping... but they didn't SHOW that, like any competent show would have.
it confirms the hands thing, not required but a crutch for most. And that he knew about the inability to lie. which.. why the fuck wasn't he using that then?
Powerlevels. what capability do the white cloaks have, to taken on Aei Sadai head on? Why are they openly asking like this in the first place? if, Egwain WAS one, would that party of what 10 White cloaks, had any chance versus her, a warder, and 50 gypsys? The open interrogation make some sense when it was a full army of White cloaks, and an injured Moraine.
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Hateyou
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The white cloaks don’t really have any ability to do anything to Aes Sedai. The only thing preventing an Aes Sedai from destroying them is the three oathes that don’t allow them to use power as a weapon unless in defense of their life, so I guess technically in the show the white cloaks could capture them, tell them their life will not be in danger, then chop their hands off. Then since hands are apparently needed in this version, they can then say ok now it’s in danger and light them on fire lol?
A dark friend Aes Sedai could just rip them apart as they aren’t bound by the oathes. So the ones they persecute are good cause they don’t defend themselves, and the ones that could kill them are the actual dark friends they would want to persecute.
Caliane
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I suppose I have to ask, how any of that plays out in the books. Like I said, tactically, in the show, none of makes any sense. They know enough about Aes Sedai, that they should be able to ID one, and ask the right questions... But, also, that they can't win that fight...
They REALLY needed to show us HOW that guy got his 7 rings. hey sure, sneak attacks. wait for them to sleep. talk nice, quietly surround and grab her hands. sure. But what was saw was the opposite of that. Especially since they aren't even pretending. Even those tactics would largely not work, if the Aes Sadai know white cloaks hunt them.
remind me on the oaths. "can't use it as a weapon", or "can't intentionally kill?" Shad had talked about creative magic use in the series. While the show has shown little to none of it. Shield, utility and weapon can often be pretty nebulous... a reflective shield. teleporting an opponent away. teleporting an opponents arm.. and just their arm. teleporting them 500ft into the sky. illusory terrain, visions. mind control. Would a jedi mind trick break the oaths? avoids conflict.. but fucks with someones mind? is mind magic even a thing in this?
presumably theres a million and one, ways to use defensive magic to create impassible terrain, mud, or outright restraining. without being show exactly how the magic works, or what it can or can't do.
They REALLY needed to show us HOW that guy got his 7 rings. hey sure, sneak attacks. wait for them to sleep. talk nice, quietly surround and grab her hands. sure. But what was saw was the opposite of that. Especially since they aren't even pretending. Even those tactics would largely not work, if the Aes Sadai know white cloaks hunt them.
remind me on the oaths. "can't use it as a weapon", or "can't intentionally kill?" Shad had talked about creative magic use in the series. While the show has shown little to none of it. Shield, utility and weapon can often be pretty nebulous... a reflective shield. teleporting an opponent away. teleporting an opponents arm.. and just their arm. teleporting them 500ft into the sky. illusory terrain, visions. mind control. Would a jedi mind trick break the oaths? avoids conflict.. but fucks with someones mind? is mind magic even a thing in this?
presumably theres a million and one, ways to use defensive magic to create impassible terrain, mud, or outright restraining. without being show exactly how the magic works, or what it can or can't do.
Kuro
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Mind control weaves are a thing, but forbidden/forgotten for the most part, they come back into play as the Forsaken wake up.
A lot of fuckery is done with Teleportation later in the books, but it's another forgotten weave at the start. For most of the books, fast travel is only available via risky artifacts.
Magic's effectiveness really ramps up after the true Dragon is revealed. A lot of forgotten weaves come back because they're "talents" (stuff random channelers just know how to do naturally, like Nynaeve's super-saiyan-healing) that then get taught to others when the various channeling groups start interacting/coming together.
Oaths:
1) Speak no word that is not true.
2) Make no weapon with which one man may kill another.
3) Never use the one power as a weapon except against Darkfriends and Shadowspawn, or in last extreme defense of her life, her warder's life, or the life of a fellow aes sedai.
The One Power uses an elemental system where most of the elements are everywhere in varying amounts, but it's easier to do big flashy things in an element if there's a lot of it around. You can create fire from the basic amount of fire element that's hanging around, but it's a lot easier to just control an existing bonfire. The weaves aren't like Mana, they don't run out. Their limiter is mostly that they're complicated and most channelers aren't skilled enough to perform/maintain multiple weaves at once, and that it's physically and mentally exhausting to channel, so eventually casters wear out. Complicated weaves also require intense concentration, which makes it more likely you'll miss something like a dude firing an arrow at you or sneaking up on you, which is where the Warders come in handy.
A lot of fuckery is done with Teleportation later in the books, but it's another forgotten weave at the start. For most of the books, fast travel is only available via risky artifacts.
Magic's effectiveness really ramps up after the true Dragon is revealed. A lot of forgotten weaves come back because they're "talents" (stuff random channelers just know how to do naturally, like Nynaeve's super-saiyan-healing) that then get taught to others when the various channeling groups start interacting/coming together.
Oaths:
1) Speak no word that is not true.
2) Make no weapon with which one man may kill another.
3) Never use the one power as a weapon except against Darkfriends and Shadowspawn, or in last extreme defense of her life, her warder's life, or the life of a fellow aes sedai.
The One Power uses an elemental system where most of the elements are everywhere in varying amounts, but it's easier to do big flashy things in an element if there's a lot of it around. You can create fire from the basic amount of fire element that's hanging around, but it's a lot easier to just control an existing bonfire. The weaves aren't like Mana, they don't run out. Their limiter is mostly that they're complicated and most channelers aren't skilled enough to perform/maintain multiple weaves at once, and that it's physically and mentally exhausting to channel, so eventually casters wear out. Complicated weaves also require intense concentration, which makes it more likely you'll miss something like a dude firing an arrow at you or sneaking up on you, which is where the Warders come in handy.
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Caliane
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ok. yeah. Moraines use did seem fairly elemental. but, things like the shields, and quieting or whatever it was called, etc.. not particularly so.
but still, there should be a ton of things you could do with elemental magic in a forest to hide yourself, or defend.
A lie is a weapon, so that makes sense. now I'm wondering about other forms of misdirection.. would leaving a false trail... be a weapon or lie?
but still, there should be a ton of things you could do with elemental magic in a forest to hide yourself, or defend.
A lie is a weapon, so that makes sense. now I'm wondering about other forms of misdirection.. would leaving a false trail... be a weapon or lie?
Kuro
Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
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Spirit is the "fifth element" and is used for wonky magics.
The Aes Sedai rules-lawyer their way around the oaths pretty regularly, since they're only bound by the words of the oath, not the intent. The oaths are a relatively new thing in the setting, forced upon them by a King who distrusted them.
Hateyou
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An example of an Aes Sedai “lie” would be someone asking where they are headed, and their ultimate goal is Tar Valon. This would red flag them to white cloaks. So when someone asks where they are headed they say “Caemlyn, I have a sister there I am going to visit. I haven’t seen her in years.” So the person asking now has a place and a plausible reason and they send them in their way.
Afterwards someone will say “wtf I thought we were going to Tar Valon, you just lied!” And the Aes Sedai would say “No I didn’t, after we go to Tar Valon I am heading to Caemlyn to meet with a fellow Aes Sedai (a sister). I just left Tar Valon out of the conversation because i made Caemlyn my end goal within this conversation, we are technically heading there at some point.”
Most people who have no experience with Aes Sedai have no idea they can do things like that to get around the oath and take things at face value. Some older people with a lot of Aes Sedai experience know this, so they ask their questions differently, more directly, and ask more follow ups. There are instances in the book where people make them swear oaths or make statements so as there is no other meanings of the words being spoken.
Afterwards someone will say “wtf I thought we were going to Tar Valon, you just lied!” And the Aes Sedai would say “No I didn’t, after we go to Tar Valon I am heading to Caemlyn to meet with a fellow Aes Sedai (a sister). I just left Tar Valon out of the conversation because i made Caemlyn my end goal within this conversation, we are technically heading there at some point.”
Most people who have no experience with Aes Sedai have no idea they can do things like that to get around the oath and take things at face value. Some older people with a lot of Aes Sedai experience know this, so they ask their questions differently, more directly, and ask more follow ups. There are instances in the book where people make them swear oaths or make statements so as there is no other meanings of the words being spoken.
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