World of Warcraft: Current Year

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Khane

Khane

Got something right about marriage
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mkopec said:
LOL why lock one fucking set piece behind some bullshit like that, thanks obama.

And I aint grinding for that shit, lol. Fuck that, im only here to pass some time. Figured I would roll up a warrior and fuck around tanking. BTW this game is easy mode now. With the hirlooms I have my warrior is one shotting everything in trisfall. There is not really any challenge. Last week I got a hunter leveled up to 75is or so and same thing, like 3 bow shots and everything dies, wtf did they do to this game?
Click to expand...

The game is 15 years old. They tried to turn leveling back into a slower, more dangerous experience a few patches ago. It was absolutely terrible and nobody liked it.

Classic is one thing. It makes sense since there are only 60 levels, and it's engaging because it's a brand new world again (though one we've already played through). Forcing people to slog through 120 levels where you aren't getting any new skills for 10-20 levels at a time is not a good experience. In fact it fucking sucks.
 
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mkopec

mkopec

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Im not saying slower, they could just up the exp rate, but why get rid of the fucking challenge? I mean its like really really easy now. Was OG wow really that hard to begin with?
 
Khane

Khane

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Because, as I said, slogging through 120 levels of content that you've seen countless times before is not fun. Especially when you are literally not getting ANY new skills for 10-20 levels at a time.

In classic WoW you were getting new spells, or upgrading existing spells every 2 levels. In current WoW you may not even get some of your main abilities until level 80+ (Balance druids do not get their silence until level 80).

This is why a lot of people have called for a level squish in retail WoW. Leveling is boring and tedious and because of all the changes over the years it doesn't work well at all if you aren't mowing through everything. It's hard to deal with dangerous mobs when you literally don't have any tools to deal with them... because you won't get those abilities until that expansion is a distant memory in current leveling terms.
 
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TJT

TJT

Mr. Poopybutthole
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mkopec said:
Im not saying slower, they could just up the exp rate, but why get rid of the fucking challenge? I mean its like really really easy now. Was OG wow really that hard to begin with?
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There was no one decision that got them there. There were thousands of tiny ones ya know?

I think the weirdest thing to me was watching that Classic/BFA first 10 levels comparison that was posted here the other day. Compared to OG Everquest WOW told you everything you needed to know. Spawn as undead, heres a quest dude he gives you some info, start killing some stuff for exp, carry forward. Find the Undercity and such. I remember creating a character in EverQuest, a human in Freeport and it was night and storming and I couldn't see shit. All I had in my inventory was a rusty short sword and a note that said turn this to the guildmaster of the warrior guild. Good luck finding that btw! lol.

But in BFA, when you create an undead the first thing that happens is you get an NPC to help you because apparently the old way was too hardcore. But don't worry your NPC merc dude has your back and mows shit down for you and takes you by the hand from point to point until you finish your first quest.

It's hard to imagine the reasoning for feeling that the old WOW starting point was too hardcore and alienated players because they couldn't walk out of the spawn point to the glowing exclamation point and figure shit out from there. So much so they had to provide you an NPC nanny to do it all for you.

Khane Khane is totally correct about the other issues with leveling though. 35 levels of having 1 ability sucks dick.
 
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BoozeCube

BoozeCube

The Wokest
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TJT said:
There was no one decision that got them there. There were thousands of tiny ones ya know?

I think the weirdest thing to me was watching that Classic/BFA first 10 levels comparison that was posted here the other day. Compared to OG Everquest WOW told you everything you needed to know. Spawn as undead, heres a quest dude he gives you some info, start killing some stuff for exp, carry forward. Find the Undercity and such. I remember creating a character in EverQuest, a human in Freeport and it was night and storming and I couldn't see shit. All I had in my inventory was a rusty short sword and a note that said turn this to the guildmaster of the warrior guild. Good luck finding that btw! lol.

But in BFA, when you create an undead the first thing that happens is you get an NPC to help you because apparently the old way was too hardcore. But don't worry your NPC merc dude has your back and mows shit down for you and takes you by the hand from point to point until you finish your first quest.

It's hard to imagine the reasoning for feeling that the old WOW starting point was too hardcore and alienated players because they couldn't walk out of the spawn point to the glowing exclamation point and figure shit out from there. So much so they had to provide you an NPC nanny to do it all for you.

Khane Khane is totally correct about the other issues with leveling though. 35 levels of having 1 ability sucks dick.
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It probably has to do with this.

Blizzard: 70% in WOW don't pass level 10

I remember reading long ago how most players quit WoW very early on. This is saying 70% never made it past level 10. So maybe they thought that hand holding people would help? It probably just made more people quit. The truth is the MMORPG Genre isn't for everyone and it shouldn't be. It's a certain niche of game.

Here I found this interesting it's a link to the stats on the current private server. Look at the massive cut off as people level up.

Light's Hope

Of course now Blizzard just sells people boost so they can milk an extra $60 bucks out of people impulse buy style before they quit 1 week later out of disgust being overwhelmed by the level of stupid the game has become.

Seriously think about it if you had no knowledge of WoW and came in completely new. You roll up a level one and try and grind but as Khane Khane pointed out the leveling in the current game sucks and for a long time you are very limited with skills. So you buy a level boost congratulations you just bypassed 13 years worth of the game you are now in the current expansion the story isn't going to keep you hooked you will WTF about the lore even more than we do as a new person.

Now you have to learn systems on systems, current spec, loot spec, token rolls, queue system, BG system, what are addons, what is a DPS meter, professions, reputation to unlock one of the allied races that looks cool? Well I hope you want to go back to an old expansion to unlock that shit faggot. - Maybe you queue up for a role to join some instance as you are clicking your skills and looking around. You get into the first dungeon and are kicked because people have no patience for you. You are sharded into an zone with 2 other people nobody talks or interacts with you and now you go back to playing LOL or Fortnight or whatever the kids play these days.
 
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mkopec

mkopec

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Lol at first I thought that undead merc was actually a player trolling me.
 
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TJT

TJT

Mr. Poopybutthole
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BoozeCube said:
It probably has to do with this.

Blizzard: 70% in WOW don't pass level 10

I remember reading long ago how most players quit WoW very early on. This is saying 70% never made it past level 10. So maybe they thought that hand holding people would help? It probably just made more people quit. The truth is the MMORPG Genre isn't for everyone and it shouldn't be. It's a certain niche of game.

Here I found this interesting it's a link to the stats on the current private server. Look at the massive cut off as people level up.

Light's Hope

Of course now Blizzard just sells people boost so they can milk an extra $60 bucks out of people impulse buy style before they quit 1 week later out of disgust being overwhelmed by the level of stupid the game has become.

Seriously think about it if you had no knowledge of WoW and came in completely new. You roll up a level one and try and grind but as Khane Khane pointed out the leveling in the current game sucks and for a long time you are very limited with skills. So you buy a level boost congratulations you just bypassed 13 years worth of the game you are now in the current expansion the story isn't going to keep you hooked you will WTF about the lore even more than we do as a new person.

Now you have to learn systems on systems, current spec, loot spec, token rolls, queue system, BG system, what are addons, what is a DPS meter, professions, reputation to unlock one of the allied races that looks cool? Well I hope you want to go back to an old expansion to unlock that shit faggot. - Maybe you queue up for a role to join some instance as you are clicking your skills and looking around. You get into the first dungeon and are kicked because people have no patience for you. You are sharded into an zone with 2 other people nobody talks or interacts with you and now you go back to playing LOL or Fortnight or whatever the kids play these days.
Click to expand...

Good post. Despite not really playing MMO's hardcore for years MMO design remains some of the most fascinating game design there is. Because its one of the few models where you want layered complexity. All for the grand design of forcing player interaction. It totally is a niche genre because on its face it should both overwhelm you and compel you to want more.

Like Tradeskills. I know there's a lot of love and hate with them but that's the point. Don't want to craft shit? Then don't. Someone else will though. But Bliz even fucked those up with tradeskills becoming a joke and being one of the few enchanters that had 100% of enchants due to diligently hunting them down is no longer a badge of honor its just use the mats and AFK combine then you have it all.

Another thing that EQ got right. EQ's tradeskills were worthless for a long time but they eventually had them making really good shit. The Coldain Prayer Shawl questline is probably one of my favorite designs in that way. Anyone could do it but it took a long time and a lot of diligence to level up tradeskills, hunt down ingredients and recipes and slowly work up your skills to get it. Again, it was a badge of honor if you actually got the Runed Prayer Shawl. It also gave players that didn't have time or desire to poopsock an item they could work towards without actually raiding and shit for. That's great for an MMO. WOW got it right with Stormherald and stuff later but I think it wasn't as impactful.
 
mkopec

mkopec

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At the end of the day games like this just get too bloated down with shit over the years. Its bigly apparent with WOW. Not only that, but they go and fuck with redesigning actual classes every exp pack and hard resets on everything it seems players have to relearn everything. Why fuck with classes other than obvious balance passes? Shit like getting rid of the skill trees, removing player agency. I mean I get it, those trees were really HARD and people could not figure it out (google best arms spec..etc.. and give free respecs)

This is why games like these really need a concise design roadmap and leadership at the top level. Granted Blizz probably lost all those that made the original wow along the way so that does not help either.

But at the end of the day wow was never really a hard game, maybe hard to master at the top levels of raiding and min maxing, but for most people im sure it was not hard, just a time commitment.

I hope they get this shit ironed out now that classic is there and maybe they realize how far they have strayed from the original formula that made this game magic in the beginning and up through wotlk.
 
Fyff

Fyff

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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I don't get why they don't just have everyone start at 100 or 110 or something. I guess it's from selling boosts or whatever. With the add on that shit goes by so fast that even for new players it's useless. You don't get any story or learn any mechanics. It's literally just a time waster. Leveling in WoW to me is akin to playing one of those shitty phone games where you mindlessly press a button and get a reward
 
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Fyff

Fyff

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Tells you what the most efficient quests are to pick up, points you where to go and what to do when there.
 
mkopec

mkopec

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Ahh ok. I think I have that one, go it off of twitch, I just never used it, just used the in game quest thing. Should I be using that?
 
xzi

xzi

Mouthbreather
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It's a full fledged guide and even gives you an arrow pointing you exactly where to go, when to hearth, when to fly, when to afk etc.

If you can't level up with that rather quickly then you're probably retarded
 
mkopec

mkopec

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I dont think you need addons to level up fast, hit lv 15 and click one button. You get like 1.5 levels every instance you do. I went from 1-75ish in a few nights with the huntard I rolled up. Now trying warrior.
 
xzi

xzi

Mouthbreather
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you don't, but it's optimized by a dude who has aspergers and about 30 max level warriors, so AAP is 100% suggested
 
Fyff

Fyff

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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mkopec said:
I dont think you need addons to level up fast, hit lv 15 and click one button. You get like 1.5 levels every instance you do. I went from 1-75ish in a few nights with the huntard I rolled up. Now trying warrior.
Click to expand...
Queues will get you there but AAP will do it a lot faster.
 
Kiki

Kiki

Log Wizard
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I'm sure it might be faster, but I'm lazy, fuck running around doing shit. I can sit in Org, instaque as a tank/healer, and get a level per dungeon in like 15 min. I did BRD the other day, took the screw vehicle right to the boss it needed. 1 level in 4 minutes. Bam, instaque again.

For sure I would use it in classic tho.
 
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