Daidraco
Avatar of War Slayer
- 10,054
- 10,379
World of Warcraft: Current Year
- Thread starter hodj
- Start date
-
Guest, it's time once again for the massively important and exciting FoH Asshat Tournament!
Go here and give us your nominations!Who's been the biggest Asshat in the last year? Give us your worst ones!
- 5,563
- 12,702
We didn't even rescue Jaina, she used us to help herself. She ported out and I was like...wtf? Well, fuck you too.
At least Baine's rescue seemed legit and he was thankful. Thrall better be going full warchief when we find him, tired of seeing heroes strung up like hams.
At least Baine's rescue seemed legit and he was thankful. Thrall better be going full warchief when we find him, tired of seeing heroes strung up like hams.
So which one of you lurkers is too shy to ask for a guild invite? Dunno if the name is gonna work bro.
- 4
Precisely. How many Corrutped Ashbringers or Might of Menethils were there in Vanilla vs in WoW classic and Naxx has only been out what a month lol? Naxx was literally the guild killer between the difficulty and all the scrubs realizing they were fucked when raid sizes were reduced to 25...
Running a 5 man dungeon as fast as you could was pretty standard fare there bro.... Not sure how you're concluding that's the same thing as stacking tons of consumables and world buffs to clear 40 man raids in 30 minutes...
nu_11
Avatar of War Slayer
- 3,312
- 21,983
a c i d.f l y
ಠ_ಠ
- 20,062
- 99,466
TBC was around the corner, number of players, player attrition, and AQ was still being cleared in 45 minutes without stacked buffs. Stupid question. Next.
- 17,713
- 8,754
Oh, so by the handful of guilds in naxx gear then.
Besides, my mate fifteen years ago could run 100m in ten seconds. There's no evidence of that anywhere, but you'll just have to take my word on it
Considering my guild with stacked warriors and hard core min maxers would take 45 minutes at least to clear aq without world buffs, then I'm calling bs
But bs about vanilla is your specialty
- 1
- 1
Merrith
Golden Baronet of the Realm
- 18,417
- 7,127
The whole Vanilla v. Classic debate is silly. 1.12 from the start it hasn't even been the same game. Also with all of the strats and optimization people have figured out (both at the end of Vanilla and over the years), the fact that all the guilds have had months to prep for everything that they knew was coming ahead of time you can't compare it to what even top guilds did or might have known at the end of Vanilla.
The world buff stuff is pretty crazy, I remember us doing the Ony head shit for our first Loatheb kill, but when that shit died in a grand total of 4 serious pulls, I don't think we ever prioritized worrying about that anymore. The amount of prep these guilds put into getting every edge is impressive, even compared to the amount of mats, pots, etc we farmed back in the day for it.
The world buff stuff is pretty crazy, I remember us doing the Ony head shit for our first Loatheb kill, but when that shit died in a grand total of 4 serious pulls, I don't think we ever prioritized worrying about that anymore. The amount of prep these guilds put into getting every edge is impressive, even compared to the amount of mats, pots, etc we farmed back in the day for it.
- 17,713
- 8,754
The pinch is these clowns are arguing that they were doing everything today's hard-core guilds are doing, and knew just as much about the game, mechanics,, etc as we know today
Which is laughable, especially when you consider that new things are being discovered/understood even today in classic.
Example:
the hardcoded 32 buff cap limit that means players risk losing valuable world buffs if they go over the cap. This came as a surprise to people in MC because private servers didn't have that hardcoded cap.
The devs then had to explain that this was part of the vanilla engine, and although some things counting as buffs could be re-coded to not be buffs, the 32 limit wasn't going to get increased (which is why some guilds ban HOTs).
If this was known about during vanilla then:
A) it clearly isn't mentioned anywhere in places like thottbot/wowhead, because my understanding is thottbot comments helped guide/steer private server development/behaviour.
B) HOT cancelling was never a thing in vanilla (which again reinforces that the 2020 wbuff meta is not the same as a guild that has got BOSS to 5%, getting ZG/Ony to get it to 0.
Likewise for things like "Devilsaur Mafia's", I remember a few rogues farming leathers and finding someone with the recipe to craft devilsaur around the time we were going into MC. But did every single rogue? No. Did every single fury warrior? No
Likewise, did every rogue/fury/hunter farm truestrike shoulders/dal'rends from UBRS?
Did every UBRS group know to zone in/out to check for Jed Runewatcher so casters could get briarwood reed?
When briarwood reed dropped, did every group know that "damage and healing" items are best prioritised to casters and not healers?
etc etc
It's like dropping someone off on a new planet and saying their objective is to go from Point A to Point B in the fastest time possible. They have no idea where they are, what they're doing, where to find supplies etc - sure they can find their way to B. And over time, more people who attempt the route will optimise it and get quicker.
But the idea, that someone doing it fifteen years before someone else can be just as efficient, knowledgeable etc is a farce and anyone who argues otherwise clearly has an inferiority complex
Last edited:
- 1
- 1
Merrith
Golden Baronet of the Realm
- 18,417
- 7,127
Not sure about the hardcoded BUFF limit, but people knew there was a hardcoded DEBUFF limit. A couple weeks into BWL, our raid leader either saw/read somewhere or stumbled onto the fact that they had a hardcoded debuff limit of 8, thus you could bring 8+ priests and literally Mind Vision whoever got Burning Adrenaline from Vael to roll off the debuff. Eventually they increased the debuff limit to 16, so it wasn't practical to try the same trick anymore (although there was still some ways to do it with bandaging, flasks of petrification, etc).
The dal'rends farm was a thing for some, but not that widespread, obviously...same with the devilsaur leather stuff.
It's funny you bring up the Briarwood reed, as my brother played a mage and used to force me on my hunter to zone in and out with track humanoids on to see if Runewatcher was up.
All this said...your point stands, none of this stuff was THAT widespread knowledge. There was also the guy in LBRS that if mind controlled you could use to hand out some really big fire resist buff (very useful in MC and other spots). The point some people seem to be missing is just the scale of the knowledge and how much they have optimized as you put it.
Chris
Potato del Grande
- 19,436
- -10,733
You think Hunters in Vanilla didn't roll on Dal'Rends? WTF!?
The buff/debuff limit was known in Vanilla, some classes were encouraged not to use their debuffs (eg Serpent Sting from Hunters) if there were lots of Warlocks in the raid. Yeah we never hit the buff limit because nobody had time to farm every Felwood flower and Winterspring E'ko or whatever the fuck, the tanks would sometimes.
We knew this stuff and did whatever was time effective, the difference now is that all the autists have guilded together and are doing things which are not time effective for epeen.
- 17,713
- 8,754
That is not what he is talking about, moron. Displaying your elite knowledge of game mechanics yet again, not.
- 1
Daidraco
Avatar of War Slayer
- 10,054
- 10,379
Merrith
Golden Baronet of the Realm
- 18,417
- 7,127
You directing that towards me, or Chris? Because I hadn't even seen his earlier post about what he was talking about, merely commenting that there was something similar to what you were discussing with the buff limit with debuff on players, but that I did not know if people knew about/exploited the player hardcoded buff limit.
Chris
Potato del Grande
- 19,436
- -10,733
Nobody knew about that in Vanilla, it's a private server strategy formed by living in your mother's husband's basement for 15 years.
Like me, you are imagining doing exactly that back in the day. If an 18 year old virgin basement dweller like me could do it in 2005, then a 30-40 year old virgin basement dweller doing it in 2020 would have nothing to show for their failed lives.
- 1
Merrith
Golden Baronet of the Realm
- 18,417
- 7,127
The point is not many knew about those things...even in our own guild, it wasn't like the majority of the casters knew about the briarwood reed. Even if you told them, the majority wouldn't have done anything about it. For a lot of progression guilds back then, just getting a consistent 40 man raid team to log in 3-5 nights a week was a struggle.
That just isn't true with the Classic guilds. You have plenty with 40+ fully dedicated, completely optimized out players, who have known all this stuff from the start. It's just different.
