Arkk's Weight Lifting / Fitness Thread

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Ossoi

Ossoi

Potato del Grande
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So as promised here are some comparison photos after the end of my 24 week 'bulk' program which started on October 18th

First side pic was 6 August 166lbs (most recent side photo I had prior to starting the program in October), final pic was 9 April @ 175lbs

First front pic was 21 October 158lbs, final pic was 9 April @ 175lbs

DXA scan on 4th October put me at 12.8% body fat: 19.69lbs body fat, 134.73lbs lean mass. (excluding my head/brain)

Please don't moan about the photos - I've taken multiple photos in and around the same spot of the gym toilets using the tiles as reference. It's impossible to get the photos from today to align perfectly with the photos from last year, I can only assume it's because I got a new phone in October. Earlier this week I did take the old phone to the gym to see if that would help but it wasn't charged lol.

Start weight 18th October: 162lbs
21st October: 158lbs
Today: 174lbs

Are people like Gravel Gravel standing by comments like "5 pounds of muscle and 15 pounds of fat" and "you're also suggesting that you somehow put on more than 5 pounds of muscle in 6 months. Unless you're a brand new lifter (we both know you aren't) or on a bike, you've somehow defied the physical limitations of humans"

Admittedly I'm 3lbs lighter than the last time I posted pictures when you made those comments. The last 2 weeks I dropped calories a bit, was on 1900 rest and 2500 training since last week, so not really that big a drop





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Gravel

Gravel

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I won't make a comment either way. I'll just congratulate you on making progress.

What kind of lifting program are you doing? You seem to have put all the weight on your arms/shoulders. You may need to drop them for a while and bring your chest and traps/lats up.

Edit: Also curious on your height? I feel like I've asked before, and I think you said 5'9 or 5'10, but I don't want to assume.
 
Ossoi

Ossoi

Potato del Grande
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Gravel said:
I won't make a comment either way. I'll just congratulate you on making progress.

What kind of lifting program are you doing? You seem to have put all the weight on your arms/shoulders. You may need to drop them for a while and bring your chest and traps/lats up.

Edit: Also curious on your height? I feel like I've asked before, and I think you said 5'9 or 5'10, but I don't want to assume.
Click to expand...

I'm 5'11.

Had the second DXA earlier this morning. Body fat was up 4.3lbs, lean mass was up 9.39lbs. Both were done on an empty stomach, looking back at the MFP logs from before the first I was eating 80-180g carbs vs 150g on rest and 300g on training days currently, so I probably am carrying 1-2lbs of extra water weight

According to the DXA lean mass increased:

left arm: 1.6lbs
right arm: 1.78lbs
Trunk: 3.4lbs
left leg: 1.45lbs
right leg: 1.06lbs

I've had a groin injury since Christmas and haven't really trained legs. My program was a 5 day split:

Upper Strength
Lower Strength
Back Shoulders hypertrophy
Chest arms hypertrophy
Lower hypertrophy

So yeah, I've just been rotating the 3 non leg workouts lol. And yes my trainer said a month ago that my chest was lagging.

I'm pretty happy with the amount of lean mass gained, even minus the 1-2lbs possible water weight is still over 1lb a month and that's having to find the right calorie amount in the first part of the program, losing my appetite a lot and struggling to eat enough near the end and the groin injury.
 
ZyyzYzzy

ZyyzYzzy

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Tested my maxes this week.

OHP - 180
Deadlift - 425
Bench - 265
Squat - 350

Happy where I am with them all, plus met my goal of the three big total being over 1000.

Itlan Itlan for 531 BBB, I am going to do the cookie cutter one in Wedler's book. 5x10 same main lift (40%, first cycle, ramping up 10% each cycle, up to 60% for third). Other than that I am just going to do what is in the book for accessory, pull-ups, hanging leg raises, dumbbell rows, leg curls.

Curious what you did for assistance work. Everything I've been reading is pretty much all over the place on it even for the BBB program.
 
Tuco

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Ossoi said:
Just found this article linked on Facebook and funnily enough it describes your situation perfectly

How to Help a Client Who Wants to Gain Weight

"
Let’s say the client is a genetically average-looking guy in his 20s or early 30s who, you estimate, has body fat of 15 to 20 percent. Your first question:

“Do you want to gain weight? Or do you want the illusion of looking bigger?”

More often than not, it’s the latter. If you’ve ever helped a client like this through a transformation, you’ve probably seen that even after losing 10 to 20 pounds, he appears bigger and more muscular.

So if that’s his goal, he’s better served by a fat-loss program that includes a calorie deficit.

Now, if the client isn’t sure, or is dead-set on gaining weight, you need to help him understand the basic science of body composition. As Dr. Gilbert Forbes explained in this study back in 2000, the majority of weight a lean person gains will be muscle, while a person with obesity will add more fat.

In other words, the more fat you start with, the more you’ll gain. (It’s the opposite for weight loss; a lean person will lose a higher percentage of muscle.)

Nobody can predict exactly what will happen for any specific client, but you have to make sure he understands that any weight he gains will include some percentage of fat.

I can usually convince a client like this to eat at maintenance or a slight deficit for the first four to eight weeks of training, with the goal of “priming” his body to gain a higher percentage of lean mass over the next few months.

Here’s how I sell the benefits of a priming phase:

  • If the client is a complete beginner, or hasn’t been on a structured plan before, he’ll probably gain some muscle and lose some fat simultaneously.
  • Even if he doesn’t gain much muscle, he’s still building a solid base for future gains.
  • I can pretty much guarantee he’ll like his leaner appearance, and encourage him to take “before” pictures so he’ll be able to see how much progress he’s made when he takes “after” photos a few weeks later.
Click to expand...
What if my goal is to get stronger? Nice progress btw.
 
Ossoi

Ossoi

Potato del Grande
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Tuco said:
What if my goal is to get stronger? Nice progress btw.
Click to expand...

You're relatively untrained and have been doing stupid shit like db only workouts.

Your strength can only go up, regardless of calorie deficit or surplus.

If you want to get stronger and fatter by all means continue on your current path

If you want to get stronger and leaner then alter your diet. You can always increase calories when strength stalls
 
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Itlan

Itlan

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ZyyzYzzy said:
Tested my maxes this week.

OHP - 180
Deadlift - 425
Bench - 265
Squat - 350

Happy where I am with them all, plus met my goal of the three big total being over 1000.

Itlan Itlan for 531 BBB, I am going to do the cookie cutter one in Wedler's book. 5x10 same main lift (40%, first cycle, ramping up 10% each cycle, up to 60% for third). Other than that I am just going to do what is in the book for accessory, pull-ups, hanging leg raises, dumbbell rows, leg curls.

Curious what you did for assistance work. Everything I've been reading is pretty much all over the place on it even for the BBB program.
Click to expand...
How long did you run it? And what were your maxes before hand? I personally wouldn't do 5x10 same lift just because I think doing opposite days is preferable for two main reasons - grooving technique twice a week instead of one huge day, and giving your joints a little bit of a rest.

Accessory work? Uhm, I did some back work pretty much every day, very little isolation leg work. I don't remember what I did for upper body honestly, but I don't remember doing a lot of iso work on chest and shoulders. I was usually pretty beat up from the primary and secondary work. My work capacity on Kizen has improved 10x over 5/3/1, probably due to the drop in intensity.

As for your OHP, it is strong but I think it's in line with all your other lifts tbh. The problem with OHP is people typically ignore it and that's why it lags so far behind bench (and squat/DL obviously).

Your numbers are better aligned than mine honestly - 405/275/495. I may rework my current program to bench-squat-bench-DL. My DL is clearly pulling away and I think letting it accumulate the weekly fatigue while benching fresh may help in improving it. Or I'm just doomed because my upper body is genetically stupid.

Either way, keep at it. Once you've exhausted yourself (mentally and physically, it generally happens at the same time when your CNS starts to rebel) I'd definitely take it easy and jump on a hypertrophy program or something with lower intensity.
 
ZyyzYzzy

ZyyzYzzy

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Itlan said:
How long did you run it? And what were your maxes before hand? I personally wouldn't do 5x10 same lift just because I think doing opposite days is preferable for two main reasons - grooving technique twice a week instead of one huge day, and giving your joints a little bit of a rest.

Accessory work? Uhm, I did some back work pretty much every day, very little isolation leg work. I don't remember what I did for upper body honestly, but I don't remember doing a lot of iso work on chest and shoulders. I was usually pretty beat up from the primary and secondary work. My work capacity on Kizen has improved 10x over 5/3/1, probably due to the drop in intensity.

As for your OHP, it is strong but I think it's in line with all your other lifts tbh. The problem with OHP is people typically ignore it and that's why it lags so far behind bench (and squat/DL obviously).

Your numbers are better aligned than mine honestly - 405/275/495. I may rework my current program to bench-squat-bench-DL. My DL is clearly pulling away and I think letting it accumulate the weekly fatigue while benching fresh may help in improving it. Or I'm just doomed because my upper body is genetically stupid.

Either way, keep at it. Once you've exhausted yourself (mentally and physically, it generally happens at the same time when your CNS starts to rebel) I'd definitely take it easy and jump on a hypertrophy program or something with lower intensity.
Click to expand...
I ran Starting Strength for about 5 months. No clue on maxes before hand, but before so started going to the gym again after 4 years, my maxes were about 200 ohp, 300 bench, 405 squat, 475 dl.

Thanks for the advice. I'll probably do OHP531 with Bench5x10, DL531 with Squat5x10 and the reverses too.

For accessory I was thinking pull-ups on OHP day, hanging leg raises and face-pulls on DL day, dumbbell rows on Bench day, and side-bends and a hamstring exercise on squat days.

Biggest thing for me on OHP and Bench were really working on form and doing what was best for me (long ass arms). For bench this meant having my heel off the ground (I know) to allow me to get really tight and have a better arch without my butt raising up.
 
Itlan

Itlan

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Heels up isn't a big deal imo. As long as your ass remains on the bench, I personally have no problems with it. The benefit of long arms though is a better deadlift position, so it's a solid tradeoff. Plus you have more potential for tricep growth than I do for example (short/average arms, which is I why I pull sumo).

Accessories should really blast things you otherwise neglect or need to bring up, imo. I try to do some form of facepull every day to prevent hunchback. I hit upper body every day (back/biceps on S/DL day, chest/shoulder/tris on pushing days) because my lower body is more advanced. My thighs measure at 26 inches and my arms are maybe 15 inches. So really I'd just hammer whatever you find to be a weakness or imbalanced.
 
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ZyyzYzzy

ZyyzYzzy

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Got to the gym and decided to just do 5x10 of the same 531 exercise; OHP today. My rationale is when I am more fatigued, I will be forced to focus on form more for that exercise. 40% of my working max bench today would have been 100lbs, which I felt like I would have just half assed through after OHP.
 
Khane

Khane

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5x10 of a main lift and skipping another main lift entirely? Sounds like you have a different 5/3/1 book than I do!
 
Itlan

Itlan

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Khane said:
5x10 of a main lift and skipping another main lift entirely? Sounds like you have a different 5/3/1 book than I do!
Click to expand...
?

I read it as he did his 5/3/1 work for OHP, then did the 5x10 secondary work for OHP instead of doing bench. Which is exactly how BBB works.

?
 
Khane

Khane

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Yea I realized that after I re-read it. Originally I was thinking he just did 5x10 on OHP in a 3 day template and just skipped his other main lift for the day entirely.
 
Lendarios

Lendarios

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ZyyzYzzy said:
My rationale is when I am more fatigued, I will be forced to focus on form more for that exercise.
Click to expand...

It doesn't work like that. When you are tired you break the form not because you want to, but because you have to. Forcing you to work tired, does not makes or forces you to have better form.
 
ZyyzYzzy

ZyyzYzzy

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Lendarios said:
It doesn't work like that. When you are tired you break the form not because you want to, but because you have to. Forcing you to work tired, does not makes or forces you to have better form.
Click to expand...
40% of working max, it isn't tiring, or wasn't for OHP or DLs, but I know you can't read.
 
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