Baldur's Gate 3 by Larian Games

j00t · Aug 22, 2023

Burns said:
The boss fight with Ethel was kinda difficult on Tactician at level 5. I restarted twice. The first time because I couldn't save the hostage in time, and the second time due to rolls just fucking me and killing my party. The win was a close shave too; my MC was dying and the three others were under 20% life with no spells left. Also got the bug where you cant select a reward, when you let her go, because my MC was busy making death rolls. Luckily, I saved right before making the killing blow, to throw a healing pot first.

for Ethel, I was able to figure out which was the real one while another double was up, so I cast silence on her. Once I finished up all the doubles she literally just stood there. The first round she threw an acid bulb at me while my melee's (me as a vengeance pally and karlach) closed in on her. The second round she just stood there, unwilling to risk the opportunity attack from a pally and a barb so she could get out of the silence, so instead she just chose to melee. It went poorly for her.

The downside is that since she couldn't talk, she never started a dialogue with me to let her leave, meaning she never offered me her hair. However, the upside is that mayrina was left completely alone. She lit her cage on fire, of course, but I was easily able to put the fire out and then burn Ethel down without any kind of issue at lvl 4.

Cinge · Aug 22, 2023

Burns said:
The boss fight with Ethel was kinda difficult on Tactician at level 5. I restarted twice. The first time because I couldn't save the hostage in time, and the second time due to rolls just fucking me and killing my party. The win was a close shave too; my MC was dying and the three others were under 20% life with no spells left. Also got the bug where you cant select a reward, when you let her go, because my MC was busy making death rolls. Luckily, I saved right before making the killing blow, to throw a healing pot first.

Not sure how many tried but on Ethel : You can throw a bottle of water at the rope/cage holding the hostage above the cavern, to put out the fire. Then where is no timer or rush.

TJT · Aug 22, 2023

sleevedraw said:
Auntie Ethel didn't give me as many problems as a lot of the internet seemed to have (Balanced, again, not Tac.) Beat her at Level 5. Characters with extra attack actions e.g. Zerker Karlach, especially if she has Tavern Brawler and can throw)/Thief Asterion allow you to drop the illusions pretty easily. Worst part is surviving the turn 1 onslaught, but once you bring the doubles down, she's not too bad.

Bard Performance ability check while you're attempting to read the book is hilarious; you lower the saving throw requirements by...reciting limericks while reading it, which pisses it off/breaks its focus while it's trying to influence you.

You can also troll the Magic Mirror in the same way, although it is not amused when you do so.

I had Laezel and Karlach drink speed potions then run right to her. Sussar greatsword prevented her from doing anything on Tactician at Level 5. I had my Bard shadowheart hit her with an arrow and my PC warlock use his ray eldritch blast to get rid of 2 copies and identify the real one. Ended the next turn when she was prone and silenced.

ronne · Aug 22, 2023

Cybsled said:
Finally beat the game after 115 hours - did a good play through.

Ending option spoiler

I sided with Emperor and Karlach volunteered to go Mindflayer and do the gems herself. It seems to be the only option for her that prevents her going back to hell or dying in the end, unless someone knows a secret one. Mindflayer barbarian is OP as fuck lol

However, it took me 90 hours to realize I was nerfing my character by having a weapon on. I took my quarterstaff off and discovered my fists did like 3x the damage lol. Was a great game, will definitely try an evil or dark urge run eventually. Also for the final stinger scene, spoiler on the true identity of a character...

It seems to highly suggest Withers was Ao all along - I guess it makes sense since he was constantly talking about balance and refused to disclose who he was lol

Also, got this achievement - surprised more didn't get it

View attachment 487617

Ending stuff: Yea I couldn't come up with any way for Karlach to survive besides her going full mind flayer. I eventually settled on her and Wyll riding off in to hell together which I guess is fine? Karlarch story in general just feels entirely unfinished - the hellforge tiefling guy does his couple fixes and talks about needing an infernal forge cause mortal tools suck, then in act3 he's literally working AT AN INFERNAL FORGE and nothing comes of it at all. There's no further usse for infernal iron, no more talk of tinkering with Karlach or anything, it just dead ends entirely with him being a lame merchant next to an extremely lore-relevant building that doesn't actually do anything

I freed Orpheus cause I was basically all-in on Lae at that point cause she's actually far more interesting than your character is. It's pretty dumb though - the emperor just instantly joins the mother brain lmao and fights against you cause that seems totally reasonable?

j00t · Aug 22, 2023

Voyce said:
fact that you can be a sorcerer, not a bard, but a pure caster who’s main stat is also the best dialogue check stat is some potent synergy

I have two irl games going concurrently. I one of them I'm a storm sorc 9/tempest cleric 2. this past week we were fighting this giant chimera where I cast chain lightning and as I used destructive wrath to max the damage (8d10) the DM goes, your about to max the damage since I failed my save, so I'm going to use a legendary resistance so ill just take 40. I said, actually the way destructive wrath works is that I can choose when to use it, so if your going to save, I'm not going to use it. He laughed and was like that's fine, at least I avoided your 6th level spell.

So I quickened a firebolt that he let me reflavor as doing lightning bolt way back at level 1. I roll to hit, natural 20. At character level 11, that now does 3d10 lightning damage, doubled. So I looked at it for a moment, gathered my dice, then looked at my dm, and said "NOW I'll use destructive wrath, so the chimera takes 60 lightning damage." It was great, between chain lightning being resisted for half damage and the jolt crit, I did 102 damage to a single target, which felt pretty hilarious that the majority of that damage was from a cantrip.

Anyway .. what was I talking about?

Oh right, CHA. We have another game going where I'm playing a swashbuckler rogue 7/hexblade warlock 2. Hexblade use cha for weapon attacks, and I took expertise in persuasion... I've never played cha characters in our games and let me tell you how hilarious it is talking circles around our problems. Swashbucklers at lvl 9 get penache, which is basically a persuasion-based charm with no downsides and I CANNOT wait

Burns · Aug 22, 2023

Cinge said:
Not sure how many tried but on Ethel : You can throw a bottle of water at the rope/cage holding the hostage above the cavern, to put out the fire. Then where is no timer or rush.

On my second and third attempts I just snuck over to the lever and let her down before the fight started.

For the fight itself, I didn't even think about silence at that time, since there had been so few caster fights up to that point. I could have pickpocked one of those anti-magic flowers, from the Underdark, into her inventory too and trivialized the fight. Maybe I'll do that next time.

Kaines · Aug 22, 2023

j00t said:
all casters can use either a component pouch or a focus (wand, staff, orb, etc). if you're using a focus then it negates any component that doesn't have a specifically mentioned gold cost (revivify requires diamonds worth 300gp, which is then consumed by the spell). most combat spells don't require material components with a gold cost, and that's all i used him for. i did give him proficiency in cartography though, which was great. i told the party i was mapping out where we had been and then when they inevitably asked to look at the map i showed them some toddler's finger paintings.

I want the payoff for this story. What was the group's reaction????

j00t · Aug 22, 2023

Kaines said:
I want the payoff for this story. What was the group's reaction????

Uproarious laughter. Another party member was a Yuan-ti named Juan Ti, so, I mean everyone was just having a good time

Cybsled · Aug 22, 2023

ronne said:
Ending stuff: Yea I couldn't come up with any way for Karlach to survive besides her going full mind flayer. I eventually settled on her and Wyll riding off in to hell together which I guess is fine? Karlarch story in general just feels entirely unfinished - the hellforge tiefling guy does his couple fixes and talks about needing an infernal forge cause mortal tools suck, then in act3 he's literally working AT AN INFERNAL FORGE and nothing comes of it at all. There's no further usse for infernal iron, no more talk of tinkering with Karlach or anything, it just dead ends entirely with him being a lame merchant next to an extremely lore-relevant building that doesn't actually do anything

I freed Orpheus cause I was basically all-in on Lae at that point cause she's actually far more interesting than your character is. It's pretty dumb though - the emperor just instantly joins the mother brain lmao and fights against you cause that seems totally reasonable?

My understanding is Karlach was a relatively last minute addition to the game, which may be why she doesn’t get nearly the same level of content the others get. They basically just have her piggyback off of an encounter most players do anyways as her final bit (unless you count the choice she can make pre-final boss)

It’s pretty clear Shadowheart and Asterion got the most attention from the devs (and players) - they both have personal dungeons in a manner of speaking, they quip a lot more when wandering around the open world, and they both have 2 completely different changes to their characters based on choices that get made

Oblio · Aug 22, 2023

Fight · Aug 22, 2023

Finished. My first playthrough clocked in at 76 hours.

The game is just massive. I think there was probably 30-40% of the game that I just missed. I am going to take a break, but I am looking forward to a very different party composition playthrough choices. I primarily used PC Warlock, Laezel Battle Master, Karlaach Berserker, Astarion Thief (used 70% of the time), & Gail Evoker (used 30% of the time). Also dabbled with the Druids, and Shadow Heart Trickery Domain. Didn't get a chance to touch Monk, Bard, Paladin, Ranger, & Sorcerer.

1. Told the Emperor to get fucked, released the Githyanki Prince.
2. I turned into a Mind Flayer, fought alongside the Githyanki Prince and killed The Emperor, his Red Dragon, and all the Mindflayers. I had the Zevlor Tieflings, the town guard, Dragons Fire, Yurgir, Nightsong Aylin, and Isobel to help in the final battle.
3. Killed the Netherbrain, the crown crumbled to pieces.
4. Me and my party were pronounced the Savior's of Baldur's Gate. Halsin, Minthara, & Jaheira were all dead in my playthrough. I never encountered Minsc.
5. I plunged a knife into my chest, as to not have to live as a Mindflayer.
6. Laezel and the Prince jumped on dragons and went to fuck up the Lich Queen. They promised to hail me as the Githyanki savior for all the ages.
7. Karlaach combusted.
8. Wyll headed off to the countryside to kill demons and his dad remained the Duke of the city.
9. Shadowheart just complained that she almost drowned.
10. Astarion & Gail were sad when me and Karlaach died, but didn't have much else to say.
11. Withers dunked on the 3 gods of death.

Despite what Swen Vinke has said, I'd love for a few DLC expansions. They could continue to flesh out the city of Baldur's Gate, take us out to the country side for more adventures, or maybe even a trek to Icewind Dale.

Few other notes/opinions:

Battle Master Fighters are just the best. They get the best gear, they do the most damage, they are the most survivable. I really enjoyed Beserker's as well, but the Battle Master was just a bit better in the end with all the extra attacks that they get.
The Caster classes are all OP and implemented from their DND roots really well. There is a lot of depth there with each of them and more spells than you can probably try in a single playthrough. All in all, I think they are extremely powerful and require some real thought to maximize.
Rogues suck. They are tedious from a game mechanic standpoint (traps & locks), and tedious from a combat standpoint. I probably wasted 5 hours of my playthrough trying to maneuver the stupid Rogue around battlefields, just so he could miss with his one shot or pluck an enemy for 25 damage. Fuck off Rogues, you are awful.
The game challenge is tuned pretty well until your party hits level 11. After that, you can face roll to victories.
Itemization is a bit weird, but refreshing. You really have to read what the item does and whether you want it or not. It is not just +gooder stats upgrades being thrown at you as you progress. Sometimes you might have to respec your build with Withers in order to get the most out of your items.

This game is an achievement. The story, the characters, the dialogue, the voice acting quality, none of the excellence ever dips. The amount of different ways you can solve challenges and the different possible outcomes are astonishing. I have heard the number 17,000 variations on endings being thrown out there and yeah feels very plausible.

It's a 10/10.

Cybsled · Aug 22, 2023

Regarding the Shadowheart comment in your ending

In my game where I fully romanced her, she mentions it is a good thing she learned to swim, since you banged after your skinny dipping session and the post banging discussion lets you tell her she needs more “swimming practice sessions”, so I presume that altered the dialogue

... · Aug 22, 2023

Fight said:
Rogues suck. They are tedious from a game mechanic standpoint (traps & locks), and tedious from a combat standpoint. I probably wasted 5 hours of my playthrough trying to maneuver the stupid Rogue around battlefields, just so he could miss with his one shot or pluck an enemy for 25 damage. Fuck off Rogues, you are awful.

i do think 5th editions decision to make backstab once a turn is liquid gay and is directly responsible for this situation. the 3.5/pathfinder rogue was king blender in melee with dual wielding and such. and haste actually let you 'do more backstabs'. bah! and older editions let you backstab with basically anything so you'd have more options from an itemization standpoint (if you have the proff anyway).

On my play through, I'm a rogue assassin main character, i got medium armor and wore (act 1 underground armor) armor most of the game, then replaced it with (house of hope armor). dude has so much AC i basically ignore all threat and just zoom around with dog buddy smashing people. hilariously i still use the silencing dagger because it just chumps so many people. if i know i'm fighting a dumb animal or something i'll use a sleightly better weapon but it's not super relevant on a rogue...and high level is lousy with casting foes, so silence it is.

Rogue certainly doesn't benifit from buffs, or items as much as the battlemaster and absolutely can't do damage like one of them can in a pinch. i did start quite a few fights though, having picked off straglers before combat started , and that was nice. that being said i'm certainly not goin to play one again heh.

TJT · Aug 22, 2023

Pathfinder Sneak Attack with higher level feats (like no range attack limitations) was like straight up firing cruise missiles. Absolutely blew up anything. Arcane Archer being especially egregious.

TJT · Aug 22, 2023

... said:
i do think 5th editions decision to make backstab once a turn is liquid gay and is directly responsible for this situation. the 3.5/pathfinder rogue was king blender in melee with dual wielding and such. and haste actually let you 'do more backstabs'. bah! and older editions let you backstab with basically anything so you'd have more options from an itemization standpoint (if you have the proff anyway).

On my play through, I'm a rogue assassin main character, i got medium armor and wore (act 1 underground armor) armor most of the game, then replaced it with (house of hope armor). dude has so much AC i basically ignore all threat and just zoom around with dog buddy smashing people. hilariously i still use the silencing dagger because it just chumps so many people. if i know i'm fighting a dumb animal or something i'll use a sleightly better weapon but it's not super relevant on a rogue...and high level is lousy with casting foes, so silence it is.

Rogue certainly doesn't benifit from buffs, or items as much as the battlemaster and absolutely can't do damage like one of them can in a pinch. i did start quite a few fights though, having picked off straglers before combat started , and that was nice. that being said i'm certainly not goin to play one again heh.

Yeah the double bonus feats actions per turn on Thief seem to make it objectively the best rogue subclass.

bigmark268 · Aug 22, 2023

... said:
Man 5th edition is gaaaay

Yeh I kinda agree. I'm big 4e guy myself.

j00t · Aug 22, 2023

TJT said:
Yeah the double bonus feats actions per turn on Thief seem to make it objectively the best rogue subclass.

it straight up breaks the game. if you multiclass a monk thief you can get like 8 attacks per round. rogues in bg3 also got the shaft because they are supposed to be able to sneak attack when they make opportunity attacks, so it's common for rogues to pick up sentinel. my swashbuckler (favorite rogue subclass) irl is running around with a 15' range magic whip, and while it's absolutely not rules as written or probably even intended, my DM specifically told me that i was allowed to use booming blade with a whip. i play him as some combination of scorpion and trevor belmont from the castlevania anime just swinging around a meteor hammer. with a 15' melee range he's just obliterating fools. the whip does 1d6 slashing, 1d6 necrotic +charisma, sneak attack is 5d6, and then booming blade is 2d8 thunder, and then another 3d8 thunder if the target moves. and then with sentinel and such a large melee range, there's a pretty big chance of doing all that again on not my turn (minus booming blade, it'll be a while till i pick up warcaster).

rogues are really good in 5e, just not so great in bg3

edit: once i get lvl 9 swashbuckler, i'm PROBABLY going to put a bunch of levels in warlock so i can start adding eldritch smites to all that damage as well.

... · Aug 22, 2023

j00t said:
it straight up breaks the game. if you multiclass a monk thief you can get like 8 attacks per round. rogues in bg3 also got the shaft because they are supposed to be able to sneak attack when they make opportunity attacks, so it's common for rogues to pick up sentinel. my swashbuckler (favorite rogue subclass) irl is running around with a 15' range magic whip, and while it's absolutely not rules as written or probably even intended, my DM specifically told me that i was allowed to use booming blade with a whip. i play him as some combination of scorpion and trevor belmont from the castlevania anime just swinging around a meteor hammer. with a 15' melee range he's just obliterating fools. the whip does 1d6 slashing, 1d6 necrotic +charisma, sneak attack is 5d6, and then booming blade is 2d8 thunder, and then another 3d8 thunder if the target moves. and then with sentinel and such a large melee range, there's a pretty big chance of doing all that again on not my turn (minus booming blade, it'll be a while till i pick up warcaster).

rogues are really good in 5e, just not so great in bg3

You can opportunity attack with sneak attack in bg3....but then when your turn comes all you can do is jam your thumb in your ass because you backstabbed already this round.

What's wild is fighter healing. I had haste on laezel And my team was in a bad way. I used fighter bonus action button and threw like 9, 40 healing potions at the party.

j00t · Aug 22, 2023

... said:
You can opportunity attack with sneak attack in bg3....but then when your turn comes all you can do is jam your thumb in your ass because you backstabbed already this round.

What's wild is fighter healing. I had haste on laezel And my team was in a bad way. I used fighter bonus action button and threw like 9, 40 healing potions at the party.

that's what i mean. in 5e you are supposed to be able to sneak attack once on your turn, and then once more as a reaction. it doesn't matter WHEN the reaction happens, it won't interfere with the limit on sneak attacks, so if you somehow end up making an opportunity attack on your turn, you would still get 1 sneak attack on your turn, and then the 1 sneak attack as a reaction.

... · Aug 22, 2023

j00t said:
that's what i mean. in 5e you are supposed to be able to sneak attack once on your turn, and then once more as a reaction. it doesn't matter WHEN the reaction happens, it won't interfere with the limit on sneak attacks, so if you somehow end up making an opportunity attack on your turn, you would still get 1 sneak attack on your turn, and then the 1 sneak attack as a reaction.

Yea see that would make rogues almost not gay

Baldur's Gate 3 by Larian Games

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