Battletech

Sludig

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I would disagree. In what way are they inefficient. No where near say a medium laser due to 1ton:25. But for the most part LRM's are 8 or more dmg/ton. AC's come in under that, other laser weapons tend to follow around there or below. SRM's are certainly king dmg/ton over the LRM and of course quite popular. But a bit harsher on heat too. The issue with saying ok medium laser boat it is.....

1: Most mechs don't fit more than 4 laser slots, except for laser boats like the grasshopper. In some other mechwarrior games where you had very loose restrictions that indeed was the best thing was loading up on a shit ton of weaker but "efficient" weapons. In MWO you tend to see this too a little bit.

2: While a couple added with leftover to most builds is great for a little boosted damage, when you start boating them, you really have to start thinking about 2-3 heatsinks weight as part of the weight of those weapons because otherwise you are running a 2 turn alpha to overheat.

Especially with skills, LRM's are just the most versatile. No or next to no penalty for firing close, or out of line of sight. You say only good for knockdown, and that's great, and not just for salvage. Called LRM barrages are great for blowing shoulders and legs in one -2 turns taking an enemy out of the fight or crippling them. Because of the multiple hits, I have a lot better time getting ammo explosions. (Likewise I'm getting so many headshots spamming 6x MG's at things on top of the destroying components like crazy) Once they are down they are yours with a called shot whether that is to capture or just finish killing via a CT shot. They are more reliable in that while yes you always get a couple misses, you even at low hit % are getting damage in, vs say an autocannon and you are rolling a big gamble. Yeah you might get 2 40% hits, but likewise, might get jacked missing 2 85%'s.

My build is a tossup between 3 short rangers and lrm or 2lrm 2 bruisers. I dont even use sensor lock almost ever anymore except to allow lrm fire, usually I shoot at up to 3 evasion like normal, anything higher and find other targets or reserve until you can punch it once to take that away. (Usually even if you can't melee, many mechs have low unsteady thresholds so just a couple volleys from srm/lrm and they are unsteady losing their evasion and ripe for the taking.

Where LRM's suck, as well as many weapons, I think is when you don't specialize. I see a lot of folk mixing fairly high laser builds with a token ac or ppc, or couple lrms. Like most games when min/max comes into play, specialists usually have the advantage. Throwing a few stability damage from multiple mechs isn't efficient. However in practice, I don't see a focused on damage build all that more effective. LRM and SRM will more predictably perform vs flashy PPC/big AC/etc can be so sporadic, and usually very high heat to gain.....? Needing more face time with enemies? The -1 to hit from ppc? Mine also run with max front armor, so I'm not really losing much in durability. Take a lrm 15 instead of a 20 isn't so bad of a tradeoff.

I actually am sick of LRM's, think they are boring, etc. But like you'll read on other forums, they are pretty much a must have tool if not outright better in any way. Even if it's much more exciting the one round you get a dual AC/20 assault to multitarget double headshot 2 mechs. It's just a bigger gamble with those weapons.
 
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Sludig

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I mean, here's the thing about SR weapons... They are no fucking joke either. I know, I get it, I do. But there's something special about being in someone's face, meleeing them and seeing 4 SR lasers go off immediately causing another 80 points of damage. That's on top of the 75? 80? That you've already caused them by meleeing them.

I mean, the only reason I think that they didn't cause the SRM's to go off was because it would become stupid powerful.
Try it with machineguns, the 5 less dmg is far outweighed by the crits and head seeking as well as often I'm meleeing also trying to lose some heat so you dont have the SMLAS offsetting a big heat loss. (Rush with SRM's, knockdown/beat the fuck up, then melee/machine gun it to death/incapacitated, bam low heat for the next srm salvo into melee after the first.)
 

goishen

Macho Ma'am
3,600
14,693
Try it with machineguns, the 5 less dmg is far outweighed by the crits and head seeking as well as often I'm meleeing also trying to lose some heat so you dont have the SMLAS offsetting a big heat loss. (Rush with SRM's, knockdown/beat the fuck up, then melee/machine gun it to death/incapacitated, bam low heat for the next srm salvo into melee after the first.)


I still like SRM's man. SRM's can knock anybody (or at least make them unstable) on their ass with an alpha strike.
 
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Sludig

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I still like SRM's man. SRM's can knock anybody (or at least make them unstable) on their ass with an alpha strike.
I didnt say anything about SRM's. I said replace the small lasers with machine guns...
 

goishen

Macho Ma'am
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Agreed, I do have a prejudice against MG's, but I think that's mainly rooted in the fact that big giant robots are shooting at each other with laser weaponry. I find them just laughable, with no real explanation as to why.
 
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Sludig

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Agreed, I do have a prejudice against MG's, but I think that's mainly rooted in the fact that big giant robots are shooting at each other with laser weaponry. I find them just laughable, with no real explanation as to why.
They are silly especially if you put them in perspective of present day MG's. Just gotta try to imagine them as .50cals with the advantage of sci fi propellant and metals technology. And even then in other mech games, they arn't generally for going after healthy mechs, it's again all about just ripping them apart once the heavy armor is gone. (If we want to get technical I would question why mirror surface over the armor wouldnt be a good idea to help vs lasers for a while, other silly things like that.

SRM and MG do pair well though, and I'm not 100% sure, but I feel like I've gotten knockdowns just from destroying components with MG's, or certainly blowing off arm/torso after the srm gets them right at the edge of falling and opened up the armor.

I would like to see them maybe make SRM2's considered a light weapon, or some other direct stability damage small weapon.
 
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Pyratec

Golden Knight of the Realm
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Seems incredibly excessive. LRMs are really inefficient for damage even with +dmg mods on them because the hit locations are so random. LRMs are for knockdowns, either for getting full salvage via wounds or getting free called shots against prone opponents. I also don't like running without full frontal armor, even on an LRM platform, because they do take fire from time to time and getting your LRM+ racks blown off is shitty as hell, both in terms of losing the weapon and losing firepower for the rest of the mission.

I think the ideal lance setup is short range tanky mech, long range sniper mech with sensor lock, and two LRM boats. sniper can play sensor bitch for your LRMs when there's no LOS for direct shots, which should be most of the time if you aren't a fan of getting your face blown off.

I disagree with your ideal lance buildout. When you run 5 skull missions and have to kill 8+ assault mechs even one fully tanky king crab will get whittled down. I've been running one full on tank King Crab, two Atlas with jump jets who help out with the damage by evasion tanking (can get 4 evasion chevrons on a jump from an atlas with the right pilot in it) and then the highlander I linked above. The highlander basically fills the stability bar on anything not entrenched in one round and then my other mechs do called shots on the poor bastard on the ground. I've found it pretty effective so far.

As to the armor on the LRM boat, it only gets hit if I'm being careless. Easy enough to keep him out of range/sight of any enemies. It also still has 80-85% armor, it can still take a couple hits if something goes wrong.
 

Chysamere

FF14 Free Company Master
<WoW Guild Officer>
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I agree. I'm running two tanky up close with 2xAC/20's and SRM's, a sniper/lrm highlander using a gauss rifle, and a lrm highlander.

If you multi shot with breaching shot you can hit up to 3 different targets with 1 weapon each and each will get the benefit of breaching shot, it's super nice.
 
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Sludig

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I agree. I'm running two tanky up close with 2xAC/20's and SRM's, a sniper/lrm highlander using a gauss rifle, and a lrm highlander.

If you multi shot with breaching shot you can hit up to 3 different targets with 1 weapon each and each will get the benefit of breaching shot, it's super nice.
That's a little crazy and makes me sad I don't have breaching. Finally starting to run into more instances of 50% reduction via braced or enemy pilots with bulwark etc. The early part of the game, you annihilated stuff even with cover or the rare 50% cover, so pretty much every pilot ended up focused on tactics 1/2 and piloting 1 as far as abilities I focused on. Guess a few extra pilots I'm bringing up will experiment with it. (I really just figured it was easier to straight kill or knockdown things esp via precision shots rather than get only ONE weapon past armor figured would add up to less than all of them at 50%)
 

Varia Vespasa

Vyemm Raider
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fark. Tried updating my drivers and my video card seems to have bricked itself. Yay. And Battletech crashes when I try to start it which may or may not have something to do with the dead card. On my onboard graphics now, but cant play much with that, especially not on the pretty settings.
 
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Gavinmad

Mr. Poopybutthole
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I don't actually try and tank both enemy lances with a single king crab, she's just there to draw fire when it needs drawing. For maps without any kind of ridge or hill to hide behind i can see how two close up mechs would be stronger than running double LRM boats, otherwise I like being able to knock down two mechs a turn from outside LOS.
 

Sludig

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With latest game and driver update, I havnt crashed on game launch, but I had been having that problem. Hope you get a good resolution for your card.

Had my first really bad 3 star map. Basically gavins nightmare double heavy/assault lance. The computer was also a bit smarter than usual. Blackjack was multishotting 3 targets to drop my evasion, and they were suprisingly extra stubborn about chasing my k2cata that was spending every round knocked down, then jump jetting as far as possible then bracing. All the way to border edge throwing utter max range LRM's at it.
 

Sludig

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I still havn't gotten a full jagermech btw. How is the fitment on it? Should I be sad at having 0? I usually hate them thematically but in this game they look fairly sweet with lrm boxes on their cannon arms.
 

Gavinmad

Mr. Poopybutthole
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I still havn't gotten a full jagermech btw. How is the fitment on it? Should I be sad at having 0? I usually hate them thematically but in this game they look fairly sweet with lrm boxes on their cannon arms.

The Jager, particularly the JM6-S, is kinda middling in the scope of single lance games like this one because it's a direct LOS fire support mech (that was also designed to fulfill an anti-air role which doesn't exist in this game). It doesn't generate as much stability damage as an LRM boat and doesn't have unlimited shots like a PPC. The main thing it would be good at is multishotting to strip evasion off multiple enemy mechs but you should be focus firing 1-2 mechs down at a time.
 
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khorum

Murder Apologist
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I still havn't gotten a full jagermech btw. How is the fitment on it? Should I be sad at having 0? I usually hate them thematically but in this game they look fairly sweet with lrm boxes on their cannon arms.
2 AC mounts on each arm. I got mine rocking 2x ac5+++ and 2x ac2+++ and a ballistiic TLS++.

It doesn't have the knockdown power of my LRM boat, but it reliably destroys legs EVERY TIME.
 
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khorum

Murder Apologist
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fark. Tried updating my drivers and my video card seems to have bricked itself. Yay. And Battletech crashes when I try to start it which may or may not have something to do with the dead card. On my onboard graphics now, but cant play much with that, especially not on the pretty settings.
WTF... sniff your case for an ozone fire...if so there maybe a popped capacitor on the videocard's pcb which would be an easy RMA.

dont bother playing on the intel GPU lol.
 
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Fadaar

That guy
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Gonna be real hard to top this salvage for a single mission

637090_screenshots_20180506121000_1.jpg
 
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Varia Vespasa

Vyemm Raider
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WTF... sniff your case for an ozone fire...if so there maybe a popped capacitor on the videocard's pcb which would be an easy RMA.

dont bother playing on the intel GPU lol.
RMA?

Not sure if I could tell ozone or not given that my power supply blew recently and sorta cornered that market! :p

But no worries, after my supply blew I got a bigger one in prep for a better video card so I said fuckit and went and bought one just now. :)
 
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Sludig

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WTF all day I'm getting crazy high NOT called shot headshots, both against me and for me. Like 5-6 in the last game alone being big head hits not just machine gun spray. Funny when the devs are like oh headshots are those rare things youll be going ohhhhhh when it happens so rare... bs. My guys all have super high guts too but they are dying to the crits even if some structure left.