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Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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I've never been on the other side of an interview, how do you judge whether work is interesting or not? My current job as a test engineer has a fair amount of drudgery, especially now since we're in heavy testing for release. But the times I get to work on the testing system, which is mostly written in Python, is quite fun. Especially coming from a perl background, learning Python has been a pleasant surprise.

I understand your points, they have some merits. I guess I just push back against this because I see it as a bad form of creep. I never want the expectation that you spend 10-20 hours outside of work to become the standard. Sure, those 10-20 hours will definitely help that candidate, but side projects shouldn't be a binary elimination criteria.
What's important is whether the candidate finds it interesting or not and whether that can be used to determine whether they'll find the work at their potential job interesting.
 

moontayle

Golden Squire
4,302
165
Don't be ridiculous. Water doesn't go anywhere, and 2/3rds of the planet is covered with it. Now the cost of water might change (especially if dumbass oil companies continue polluting groundwater), and it might not make sense to live in the fucking desert anymore, but thats hardly the end of civilization.
Not saying it is but history shows us thatshit goes downwhen there's a resource people want to exploit. Also:

Over 70% of our Earth's surface is covered by water ( we should really call our planet "Ocean" instead of "Earth"). Although water is seemingly abundant, the real issue is the amount of fresh water available.

  • 97.5% of all water on Earth is salt water, leaving only 2.5% as fresh water
  • Nearly 70% of that fresh water is frozen in the icecaps of Antarctica and Greenland; most of the remainder is present as soil moisture, or lies in deep underground aquifers as groundwater not accessible to human use.
  • Only ~1% of the world's fresh water is accessible for direct human uses. This is the water found in lakes, rivers, reservoirs and those underground sources that are shallow enough to be tapped at an affordable cost. Only this amount is regularly renewed by rain and snowfall, and is therefore available on a sustainable basis.
From:Human Appropriation of the World's Fresh Water Supply


That's from 2006 and I can't imagine that those above facts have changed any. In fact,this placehas water scarcity as the #1 global risk to society. #8 on likelihood of occuring though, but it's still something people need to keep in mind.
 

chaos

Buzzfeed Editor
17,324
4,839
Why is it that we haven't figured out cost-effective desalinization at this point? Fucking science, get on the ball.
 

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
<Gold Donor>
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It's hard =(

Can saltwater quench our growing thirst? | Ensia

Desalination is one of those problems that reducing energy cost would drastically help.

Dr. Philip Davies is also researching a process that would spend even more energy, but would convert the leftover brine into a substance that absorbs CO2.
GA

Dr Philip Davies
 

AladainAF

Best Rabbit
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Lady I work in the tech sector, I see the manpower shortages ERRY DAY. I see sub-par candidates getting hired on just to fill a seat because there just aren't enough technically qualified people. I'm picking up the slack of one RIGHT NOW.

I see literally a couple of dozen companies posting every day on twitter that they can't find the right people, that infosec is severely undermanned, that they can't find programmers, shit is a cancer.
Going back to this discussion, thought I'd drop this here...Pink Slips at Disney. But First, Training Foreign Replacements.

Article_sl said:
Instead, about 250 Disney employees were told in late October that they would be laid off. Many of their jobs were transferred to immigrants on temporary visasfor highly skilled technical workers, who were brought in by an outsourcing firmbased in India. Over the next three months, some Disney employees were required totrain their replacements to do the jobs they had lost.

Last year, Southern California Edison began 540 technology layoffswhile hiring two Indian outsourcing firmsfor much of the work. Three Americans who had lost jobs told Senate lawmakers that many of those being laid off had toteach immigrants to perform their functions.

Fossil, a fashion watchmaker, said it would lay off more than 100 technology employees in Texas this year, transferring the work to Infosys. The company is planning"knowledge sharing" between the laid-off employees and about 25 new Infosys workers, including immigrants, who will take jobs in Dallas. Fossil is outsourcing tech services "to be more current and nimble" and "reduce costs when possible," it said in a statement.

Among 350 tech workers laid off in 2013 after a merger at Northeast Utilities, an East Coast power company,many had trained H-1B immigrants to do their jobs, several of those workers reported confidentially to lawmakers. They said that as part of their severance packages, they had to sign agreements not to criticize the company publicly.
 

Hachima

Molten Core Raider
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Going back to this discussion, thought I'd drop this here...Pink Slips at Disney. But First, Training Foreign Replacements.
The news reporting on this is pretty bad..

H1B Data 2015

I only see a couple project managers that would fall into the october timeframe. Whatever these 250 were, weren't being replaced by H1B in Orlando by HCL. Maybe a bunch of helpdesk type people were outsourced, but that's different than jobs being transferred to H1B. It sounds more like a vocal PM may was been replaced by a H1B...

Senator Calls for DHS Investigation of H-1B Visa Program After Reports of Disney Layoffs : snopes.com
The former Disney employee worked in project management and software development. His r?sum? lists a top-level skill certification and command of seven operating systems, 15 program languages and more than two dozen other applications and media.
Well if that's his actual resume he is sending out, that's usually trash can material for me. If you are spouting off that many programming languages and technologies and programs, how can I honestly believe you are a master at all of these and you aren't going to waste my time when the position I'm trying to fill only really uses 2 or 3 of the ones listed? A good resume needs to be catered to the position. Sure you may have touched them all at some point in your career but just list what you have been most recently involved in and could actually pass an interview if I asked you about said language/technology. Anyway, somewhat beside the real point.

The PM that replaced him looks like they are getting 91k salary. Maybe a bit lower than average for the listed experience (PM III), but not terrible.

Most likely a big crew of help desk type people were laid off. A small percent(maybe 5%) of those are the ones on the H1Bs and the rest are probably working from another country This then let Disney move more resources into more local higher tech skilled jobs (us workers).The media makes it sound like they changed to 250 H1Bs which doesn't sound like the case though.Not to say the H1B system doesn't need to be looked into. The 30-40k salary H1B jobs HCL has listed seem questionable. For the specific Disney case, it doesn't stand out as an abuse of the system though.The ~100 H1Bs that Disney directly applied for has have a median salary of 115k.
The same for Northeast Utilities.. They show 5 total H1B...

From my experience interviewing for software development jobs...I'm not surprised at the need for skilled workers. There were so many cases of just.... uhhg no... One of the people I did choose for my team was on an H1B and as the manager hiring this was completely transparent to me. I didn't even know until much later after he was hired. HR just hands me a stack of resumes and I interviewed them.

These articles don't seem like they match the full picture of the job titles of who were replaced and how many/who was actually replaced by H1B. It sounds more like mixing outsourcing lesser skilled tech jobs (help desk type stuff ) with higher skilled H1B (70k+ type salary jobs) into the same bucket and considering them the same thing.
 

AladainAF

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Interesting, but most likely correct. People forget, the entire point of H1-B is to bring people in for work that americans are not available.

When you look at the H1-B list from Hachima's list, most of them are basic corporate level positions (i.e. Network Administrator I, Programmer Analyst I, etc). There is absolutely no way there are not Americans to fill those positions. Absolutely not. No chance. This is another reason why "Immigration Reform" is being fought for so hard by corporate interests.
 

Hachima

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What if they said H1B are only for people with Masters degrees from approved institutions...But that may make the problem even worse since a large percentage of grads from STEM oriented programs in the US are foreigners.
 

AladainAF

Best Rabbit
<Gold Donor>
12,941
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MOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOAR.

Catalina Marketing IT jobs being outsourced - FOX 13 News

About 50 Catalina IT workers will be replaced by employees from Mindtree, one of the largest outsourcing firms used by companies in the U.S. , according to sources familiar with the matter. Employees affected by the layoffs told FOX 13 they're being asked to train their foreign replacements.

Catalina Marketing wouldn't answer any questions. The company sent a statement from a California-based PR firm saying the decision to transition some operations to Mindtree was part of their "ongoing focus on enhancing Catalina's unique business competencies, building new capabilities, and focusing on core business strategies."

Some of the company's employees told FOX 13 they're simply being replaced by less expensive workers.

"Employees are expected to personally train their Indian replacements, reverse roles and watch their replacement work," said one IT worker who spoke on the condition of anonymity, fearing retaliation by the company. "Once management is satisfied with the transition, the American worker is laid off."
 

AladainAF

Best Rabbit
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Bump for mooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooar.

Qualcomm Lays Off 4,500 While Lobbying For More H-1bs | The Daily Caller

Another tech giant that says it must import foreign workers because there aren't enough skilled American workers in the industry is laying off thousands of workers.

Qualcomm - a major producer of smartphone chips - announced last week it's eliminating 15 percent of its workforce or about 4,500 employees, just weeks after fellow tech giant Microsoft announced a massive round of layoffs.

Both companies are top beneficiaries of the H-1b visa program, which backers say allows companies to temporarily hire foreign workers for jobs they can't find qualified Americans workers to fill.
 

Agraza

Registered Hutt
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My only issue with it is that they're using it to cut pay, and they're specifically supposed to NOT do that. The program should be reformed. It was not intended as a way to broadly cut wages and benefits.
 

Lendarios

Trump's Staff
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It is an issue, but when people are more concern with the illegals is hard to get them to pay attention to the legals that are doing the same work for less.
 

Pancreas

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I work as a land surveyor. The situation I face is interesting but probably applicable to other fields. I am 32 years old and about to sit for my professional licensure exam. So that makes me about three years younger than the average age for those who sit.

I went to school and earned a BS in Surveying Engineering Technology. I was a non-traditional student and finished my 4 year program when I was 28. The requirements in my state list a 4 year degree with 4 years of experience, 3 of which show responsible charge as the preferred path towards licensure. A 2 year degree with 6 years of experience is also a possibility. After that you need like 14 years of experience, which is essentially just telling people to go to school.

So becoming licensed is not a get rich quick scheme by any means.

The problem with this, is that no one is entering the field anymore. The profession is literally dying off. Each year the number of surveyors who die or retire exceeds the number of new licenses. There was this magical hope back when they increased the education requirements for Professional Licensure that they would see a glut of freshly minted surveyors taking the tests at ages 26-28. But that really hasn't panned out. Also, the profession is 99.9999% white men. Demographics like that really hurt an industry's ability to maintain fresh blood.

So that puts me in a very good place in terms of available work in front of me. Four of the local surveyors are retiring in the very near future. However, I suddenly need to figure out how I can fill that void. Surveys in my region can require a lot of involved analysis and research to do correctly, so there is a variable amount of effort in those areas. Field work (the actual location or marking of boundaries) is extremely easy to predict in terms of time required based on the technique used. I keep bouncing around ideas to speed up field work and reduce time outside of the office to try and minimize total project time, but then I realize this is adding to the first problem/opportunity of not enough surveyors.

When I started working for a surveyor he needed a kid on his field crew. Now most practitioners are solo operations or big engineering firms. Tech eliminated the multi-person field crew, and thereby squashed one of the traditional routes into the profession. The low man on the field crew totem pole.

So this iterative process of finding newer cheaper faster ways of doing things creates competition and results in work getting done faster with fewer people, is a lot like climbing a scaffold using a single ladder. Everyone climbs up the ladder and gets to the first level, then someone figures out a way to get to the next level by pulling up the ladder up from the ground. Everyone scoots up quick to the next level, but some stay behind, others fall off, and a bunch of people that may have climbed up to the first level just walk by. This keeps going until you are left with a handful of people performing the work that used to take hundreds, with no easily reproducible path to follow. Then when those people go away, you are left looking for someone who can do 100 things well and no time to train anyone.

I see a lot of professions experiencing similar issues and then I see the giant shadow of automation looming on horizon. Automation has been eating positions and eventually professions that become too costly to maintain with personnel. I doubt there is any way to fight it. Maybe this is just the natural progression of such things, but I feel that automation is increasing rapidly in terms of capabilities and shrinking rapidly in terms of cost. At some point it will simply be cheaper to automate even brand new positions or tasks that had previously never been needed.

*crazy lumie mumbling*
And then the automation process itself will become automated. I guess at that point we'll all be dead or in government Fema camps so it wont matter... But, having more people than ever with shrinking opportunities seems like a recipe for some really terrible working conditions. The technical skills that require years of training will be filled by machines and the cheapest, dirtiest, deadliest tasks will be carried out by masses of starving people too desperate to do anything else. Oh wait...

I guess the biggest thing I have decided upon is to set my own standard of happiness. I don't want a large house or a 6 figure salary. I want to live where people don't fuck with me and take care of my own needs. (Food, power ect.) Self sufficiency helps sidestep a lot of the bullshit and makes me feel good at the end of the day. I am not going nuts worrying about it, like if the end of the world happens a basement full of beans wont amount to... well... But I do eat well and sleep well, and that seems worth quite a bit these days.
 

AladainAF

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Thanks for the insight Pancreas, but a simple solution to that problem is to simply pay more and remove barriers to entry. Part of why a lot of people do oil rig work isn't because they want to do the work, it's because they can work with little experience for 70k a year.

I guess the biggest thing I have decided upon is to set my own standard of happiness. I don't want a large house or a 6 figure salary. I want to live where people don't fuck with me and take care of my own needs. (Food, power ect.) Self sufficiency helps sidestep a lot of the bullshit and makes me feel good at the end of the day. I am not going nuts worrying about it, like if the end of the world happens a basement full of beans wont amount to... well... But I do eat well and sleep well, and that seems worth quite a bit these days.
I really share this, and of course being married my wife and I share this together. We want to do well and certainly don't mind our salaries (for now), but most of all we would trade all of that just to get 50 acres in the middle of no where, don't fuck with me or my family, and let us take care of our own needs. Most definitely, one of the most fulfilling feelings in life once you get there. We're already working on it, but it does take money to get there. That's just a fact of life.

BTW: Wife and I are very well off and still very often eat pinto beans and cornbread. It's still good shit, rich or poor.
smile.png
Add some pork hock, onion, and garlic in the beans let them heat on low on the crockpot for 30 hours, and gawd bless best beans ever. One thing we've both figured out is no matter how much money you make, nothing brings personal happiness than (as you said) self-sufficiency and truly enjoying the simple things in life.
 

Palum

what Suineg set it to
27,503
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Haha all you dumb citizens and legal immigrants... And illegal immigrants. Wait, what?
 

Agraza

Registered Hutt
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yea, wtf dude. not like we have americans that need jobs and have college debt to pay off.