Assuming this is true those burger flippers still pay it right back into the economy in a more efficient way.
Company Raises It's Minimum Wage to $70,000 and All Hell Breaks Loose
- Thread starter Shonuff
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Khane
Got something right about marriage
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That is true. The working class drives the economy, not the .01%ers. There are only so many cars/dinners/toilet paper you need to buy as a human being and being a multi millionaire doesn't change that fact.
Mist
REEEEeyore
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Mist
REEEEeyore
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Because when you're rich its very easy to convince yourself that everyone beneath you is worthless. This is how western society got stuck with feudalism for 1000 years.
It's like people don't realize that history has been down this road before. Slaves/serfs/wage slaves aren't good consumers, they don't drive market growth.
Besides, 'what they're worth' is actually pretty far from 'what they're paid.' The whole point of capitalism is to extract more value from the worker than you pay them. The difference between is profit.
Cad
scientia potentia est
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Shonuff
Mr. Poopybutthole
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For the most part, I concur, unless the industry pays like shit. When I was a District Manager in the auto industry, I barely knocked back 80k a year, while in other industries, they were knocking back 250k a year with less responsibility. Hell, Toyota reps were rumored to make 200k+, but they were considered an outlier. Anyway, I got them to pay for my graduate degree and got out. Your Employer is trying to get the most out of you, you get the most you can out of them, build a resume, maybe get them to pay for school and go get something better. When they held my pay a little low, I used to tell them in my performance evaluations that they might want to bump my pay, because they allowed me to build a hell of a resume with the varying assignments and increasing job responsibilities.
People that tend to do well are the ones that know what they are worth, and demand it. When I started out working minimum wage, I didn't plan on staying there too long.
I just don't see how working at McDonald's or Wal Mart is a winning lifetime strategy. Why anyone would work in those places longer than a year or two, I don't know.
Like everyone else, you struggle for the first few years, earn your way up, and get out. Why would you want to be in a position where you are competing with teenagers for part time positions?
Cad
scientia potentia est
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Mist tends to think people have intrinsic value, that they "should be provided for" regardless of what they are able to get for themselves, and that people who do make it in life only do so via corruption, racism, and good ole boy referrals. To these folks, the idea that you or I actually earn our money is a non-sequitur. OF COURSE we didn't earn our money, or everyone else would be doing it too.
Khane
Got something right about marriage
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And this is why Libertarian politicians want to do away with collective bargaining and dissolve unions.
Shonuff
Mr. Poopybutthole
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I worked probably 20 hours a day, six days a week for about 15 years to get to where I am. I'm Black, no one has given me anything, and people still try to take my shit and my credentials because of it on a daily basis.
I have zero empathy for millenials who walk in the door and expect they are going to make more than I do. More than once, these guys have asked for 25% more than I draw, with a company car, cell phone, etc. The whole thing about I have intrinsic value, so I'm owed is bullshit. They can't hold down jobs making minimum wage, because they don't bother to show up to work (or show up on time). And they sit there texting on the phone all day, rather than work.
Like Dad told me, no one owes you anything in this life.
Maybe I sound like an old guy, but my Granddad used to preach to me about work ethic. He used to come home smiling after working 16 hour days in the steel factory. He ended up being a Foreman, and that was back when there were no other Black Foremen at his company at that time. He told me if you hustle harder, you can move up.
Cad
scientia potentia est
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But Lyrical, how will Mist pay off her $250k in loans for her liberal arts education on minimum wage? Are you victim blaming her for getting an education with the predatory lending systems we have today? It's probably because she's female, you misogynist shitlord
Khane
Got something right about marriage
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Guys, there have always been people who felt entitled to more than they were. There were always people who took advantage of whatever system it was they were a part of. There were always lazy people who are beyond help. And there always will be. And there will always be hard working people who can't make ends meet no matter how hard they try because they aren't as smart or as lucky as some of us. And there will always be people willing to take advantage of them because they are desperate. I don't much care for either side of that coin and I, like many of you here, have little compassion for those who don't try with one big caveat... they've had the opportunity to do so.
The bigger the income gap gets, the harder it becomes to earn a decent wage and the more desperate people become just to hold a job and make money the more the system sucks the life out of the class of people that actually stimulate the economy. I am not very altruistic, in fact I don't know if there is an ounce of altruism in me. But I do know that when the working class can't even afford to live the entirety of the economy suffers, markets crash, and middle class gets squeezed out of existence. There is actual historical precedence for all of that happening and the reason minimum wage exists at all in the first place is because as Standard Oil and US Steel grew more and more profitable Carnegie and Rockefeller wanted more and more out of their workers. I don't blame them, or any business owner for that matter, for losing sight of the fact that their own ambition and competitiveness (always pushing to see if they could keep doing better) was causing them to become inhumane to every one of the people who worked for them. Many of us tend to always challenge ourselves to keep doing better. However, U.S. Steel at the height of its "power" had a staggering death rate... something like 1 in 12 workers would fucking die. And none of the executives cared, they kept pushing their workers to work longer hours and be more productive. And the people who worked for these companies couldn't do anything because they had no other options. And that, in large part, helped lead to this country's greatest economic downturn ever. And there are striking similarities in our economy right now and many experts believe, for good reason, we're in for another disastrous downfall. A lot of that has to do with the bullshit "American Dream" being forced down people's throats.
It's easy to say "pull yourself up, work hard, and you'll make it" but for every one Lyrical in this country there are 20 people who try and just can't or worse, never even get the opportunity. They want to work, they want to live a decent life, they want to earn their way. Most humans do because most humans want to feel worth something and validated. They want to feel accepted as a worthy human being by their peers. They aren't happy when they feel worthless.
Maybe some people want more than they deserve, but the current minimum wage is practically indentured servitude. And as an upper class citizen I'd gladly pay more in taxes and add a few extra cents for every cup of coffee I buy to feel like our economy is a bit more stable and insulated from disaster than it has been since 2000. I don't want to see my investments disappear or my property value plummet every 7 fucking years because we were too blind to see that even with markets at an all time high only the wealthy are benefiting and everyone else feels the ropes tightening so they cut spending.
Khane
Got something right about marriage
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Ya know you can be hyperbolic about this all you want but there are a TON of moronic parents out there who push their kids so hard to get a college education that they essentially force them into crippling debt. A lot of people have lost sight of the fact that not every kid is cut out for higher education and there is nothing wrong with learning a trade. Instead you get a lot of these "you can do whatever you want" feel gooders fooling their kids into making terrible life decisions. What the hell does a 16 year old know about what they want to do for the rest of their lives? They need adults to help steer them in a good direction.
I agree with the sentiment that our country is getting soft and that there is a crazy sense of entitlement in youth today. Parents need to cut the shit and start being more realistic with themselves and their children about their abilities and how the world works. But some of these kids stand no chance because of the nonsense they've had their heads filled with since birth.
Shonuff
Mr. Poopybutthole
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That's exactly what I was thinking. I just don't get the victim mentality that some are showing in this thread. Don't be a victim, go get what you want.
Vaclav
Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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I'm guessing you weren't raised poor and super rural, right? Sure in big cities and coasts it's not so bad, but some of those small ass towns that are 2 hrs from civilization if you're poor and god help you the one real employer locally goes away - there's often zero options and if you've not been planning for a long time moving for a new job would be a challenging proposition.
That's one of many realities that exist on a daily basis - sometimes managing the best for your area is still absolute shit.
Fifey
Trakanon Raider
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At my work we hired some 40 year old person to be the car washer, they are fucking useless. They have been there for 7 months now and still can't preform their job duties. When I was hired at 18 to wash cars, I only lasted six months until I got promoted out of it.
Like others have said, it's not supposed to be a career.
Like others have said, it's not supposed to be a career.
Fifey
Trakanon Raider
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Posted while I was posting but that's why if you have no options, you either move out of that city or join the military and get your government handouts. No one forces you to stay.
Shonuff
Mr. Poopybutthole
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And I'll use my Grandfather as an example. He worked a shit job, but at least he worked his way up in the environment he had for him. I remember as a kid, asking my Grandma how he was smiling after he just worked a 16 hour day. He would tell me he was just happy to provide for his family. He was the type that busted ass and whistled while he worked.
So much of that is lost on millenials. It's like one of my Estimators right now, he's raised his hand and wants to be a Manager. Remember apprenticeship? That's gone now. When your apprentice is sitting there texting and on Facebook, when does he have time to learn? Millenials want the pay, but don't want to reach out and take the brass ring.
Khane
Got something right about marriage
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Not everyone is cut out for career work. These are exactly what they are meant to be... jobs. And if you have a job, and perform it, you should be able to live without needing government assistance.
Some people can't move, they have no means to do so. It's much easier said than done. I agree with you guys that there are people who are just lazy and can't be helped. But you guys are acting like everyone has the same opportunities as you, or any other successful person has, and that's just not reality.Fifey_sl said: