DOTA 2

Pyros

<Silver Donator>
11,313
2,420
Only thing that annoys me about Ayesee is his computer/internet is complete shit and it will ALWAYS stutter at some point during the game(regardless of action or not) and I know this one isn't a twitch shit because it still stutters when I watch the vod in the same place. Looks like when I was FRAPSing with 4gb files only on winxp, it'd do that shit once a 4gb file was done and it needed to start a new one. Regardless, it's annoying as fuck. Also I should say, that's when he streams from his home, cause sometimes he streams from somewhere else and it's just fine.

Other than that don't really care much, I listen to casters for the noise more so than actual insight. It does make me cringe when they say stupid shit, but they pretty much all do at some point.
 

Penance

Silver Baronet of the Realm
7,821
11,616
False. MKB does not prevent miss chance up hills.

I've never heard "Creep blocking" called "Creep walking." The safelane almost never creep blocks. The long lane can block if it wants. Mid does minimal blocking. The reason being, you don't necessarily want the creep at your tower so quickly, making your level 1 damage last hitting difficult, and pushing the lane out early. You want the creep either just outside tower range, or well within tower range after a creep pull where no allied creep will come back out to push the lane.

A better way to explain is with positions. There are 5 positions in dota:

Position 1: Hard Carry
Position 2: Mid
Position 3: Offlane
Position 4: Roaming Support/Jungler
Position 5: Babysitter

Even in pubs with a 2-1-2 setup, you want to fill these positions. This is why it is fucking infuriating when you have a QoP, a Weaver, and a FV (QoP as position 2, Weaver as Position 3, and FV as position 1) and someone picks Clinkz. Not every hero can fill every position. Positions 1 and 5 will always lane together, and Position 5 can roam with 4 any time there is a break. Position 4 is also in charge of pulling the lane (if in the jungle, because in a 2-1-2 position 4 will be hardlaning with position 3) and harassing the enemy mid when the opportunity presents itself.

And now a brief note about trilanes and why they work and why they don't:

In a typical 2-1-2 setup vs. a 2-1-2 setup, you stand an even chance of winning any of those lanes. You might win 1 of them, you might win 2, you might win none. The trilane trades the CHANCE that you will win 2 given lanes for the GUARANTEE (when executed properly) that you win 1. Trilanes are very effective when the two supports (on Positions 4 and 5) know what they are doing and the Position 1 can last hit with 90% efficiency (4 CS a minute minimum). If you look at your creep kills at 30 minutes and you only have 90 in a trilane, you've shot your team in the foot by dedicating a lot of resources for piss poor farm.

The reason trilanes don't wory often in pubs is because 1) inefficiency in playstyle of the pilot of Position 1, 2) inability of either or both of Positions 4 and 5 to understand they need to be hidden and out of the lane (pulling, zoning the enemy heroes, warding, rune-whoring, creep blocking, stacking, and ganking) as much as possible but close enough to save/harass/kill the enemy offlaner(s), 3) poor picking/drafting into heroes that do not belong in a trilane or do not synergize well, and finally 4) positions 4 and 5 think they need farm to function.

2-1-2 will teach a lot of good fundamentals and it's a good idea to stick to this idea unless you are a 4 or 5 stack. The reason why you should never try this as a 3 stack is because it means that you are assigning some guy you don't know to hardlane (or safelane in the case of the much more exciting offensive trilane) against a minimum of 2 people. You don't know that guy. Assume he does not know how to solo offlane. This is also good advice against instalocking some jungling hero. You don't know that the benefit of you jungling (and in pubs, it's minimal) will outweigh someone being down an ally in his lane.

Anyway--

no, MKB does not prevent misses uphill.

For fun, here is an abbreviated list of great heroes and for what positions:

Position 1: Faceless Void, Anti-mage, Specter
Position 2: QoP, Puck, Shadowfiend (nyx in Pubs plays position 2)
Position 3: Weaver, Lone Druid, Nature's Prophet (if you're good with treants), Bounty Hunter, Windrunner
Position 4: Literally any support with a disable. Lina, Shadow Demon, Leshrac, Rubick, Veno etc. Nyx in pro games is played as a position 4 typically, and somewhat rarely as position 1.
Position 5: A support that also needs a good disable or a good skillset. Lion, Ancient Apparition, Rubick, SD, etc.

A lot of softer carries can be played as position 1. Juggernaut, Naga, etc. when your team can compliment their play. Some heroes have some flexibility. 4 and 5 positions have a lot of overlap. AA can be played mid or position 4 or 5 (more likely 5). QoP can offlane, Clinkz can too. You'll also note that SF is a carry but is most often played position 2--and a pick like this means there is less pressure on position 1 to farm as hard or be as hard of a carry (Kunkka or tiny are picked as position 1s if the mid is a stronger DPS presence, or if the offlaner is LD or Weaver).
Good advice. Yea, I didn't know how the numbering system worked, when describing positions. I always thought MKB worked on uphill because on a pro game I heard a caster say he's got a MKB now, their siege will improve because of it or something.
 

Weaponsfree_sl

shitlord
342
1
Good advice. Yea, I didn't know how the numbering system worked, when describing positions. I always thought MKB worked on uphill because on a pro game I heard a caster say he's got a MKB now, their siege will improve because of it or something.
Yeah a bunch of casters have done it. Most recently Ayesee did it yesterday when he was talking about Weaver. It makes me want to get into casting cause they have such poor knowledge.
 

lanludar

Silver Squire
191
2
The one thing I got confused with is the legacy RTS (is it really legacy?) stuff where you can select other minions and shit. That threw me off until I realized what was up.
Playing any of the heroes who need micro of other units is fairly hard. I have been trying to learn it lately with Lone Druid but you really need to learn how to get control groups set up you are comfortable with. If you want to learn LD, Chen or Enchantress definitely do it in bot games first.
 

Dandain

Trakanon Raider
2,092
917
I just watched Purge play Broodmother. That ability set is crazy interesting. Kind of a good reason to promote Dota2 over LoL.
The skill sets in dota are massively more interesting and varied than anything in league. Sona and karthus ult are both childsplay compared to the stuns and disables that exist in dota. Combine them with on use active items and the variety and creativity of dota just dwarfs league.
 

Prime_sl

shitlord
71
0
Thing about Tobi is he kind've understands that he doesn't know that much. Ayesee tries to analyze and it just fails half the time. And he will go on with some analysis while something important is going on. In the Navi/Fnatic game tree almost rooted someone bot and he was going on about it while everyone tpd home and it was a huge engagement top. He focuses too much on talking and not enough of showing the actual action.
 

Prime_sl

shitlord
71
0
Int carry/support. His ultimate nukes the enemy based on how much life they have lost. Level 3 ulti will pretty much kill a hero who has ~40% hp left.

Given good farm he can be a super good hero. Has a spamable heal/nuke and he gains mana/health regen when he kills things. He's not that good though as he has too small of a mana pool to really spam his spells without items but he also doesn't have too good of a lane presence to really solo mid.
 

Kithani

Blackwing Lair Raider
1,386
1,793
Level 3 ulti will pretty much kill a hero who has ~40% hp left.
Lol, but as I just found out... will not do shit against the new Huskar. GG
biggrin.png
 

Sutekh

Blackwing Lair Raider
7,489
107
I'm just looking around on heroes. What's the skinny on Necrolyte?
THIS IS WHAT YOU DO RITE YOU FUCKIN PICK HIM AND THEN YOU FUCKIN GO MID AND ONLY BUY A RADIANCE IT FUCKS PUBS HARD AND YOU WILL BE A GOD IN FUCKING DOTA A FUCKING GOOOODDDDDDDD


No really though, he's really strong with his Q, it's spamable and doesn a shit load of damage/healing. Sadist (his e passive) allows you to stay in lane for basically unlimited amount of time because every last hit you get gives you massvie regen. He's a good starting hero as he's pretty durable and all of his spells have a relatively short CD plus he puts an even stronger emphasis on last hitting (as opposed to other heroes that follow his role).
 

Nutron_sl

shitlord
712
0
THIS IS WHAT YOU DO RITE YOU FUCKIN PICK HIM AND THEN YOU FUCKIN GO MID AND ONLY BUY A RADIANCE IT FUCKS PUBS HARD AND YOU WILL BE A GOD IN FUCKING DOTA A FUCKING GOOOODDDDDDDD


No really though, he's really strong with his Q, it's spamable and doesn a shit load of damage/healing. Sadist (his e passive) allows you to stay in lane for basically unlimited amount of time because every last hit you get gives you massvie regen. He's a good starting hero as he's pretty durable and all of his spells have a relatively short CD plus he puts an even stronger emphasis on last hitting (as opposed to other heroes that follow his role).
Here we go again.