EQ Never

Mr Creed

Mr Creed

Too old for this shit
2,394
287
Treesong_sl said:
If shifts in NPC dynamics/factions can be easily returned to previous states then it will have failed imo. That is what happened in GW2.
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This is spot on.

We dont have true AI in gaming so it has to be scripted. But if it all goes back to status quo every hour its entirely pointless to write lots of elaborate scripts. The events in the world should feel like GoT and not Scooby Doo. If GW2 had longer-lasting event chains it would be more interesting to PVE to unlock certain things (still lacking rewards but eh). For the same reason whatever they do in EQN has to have some lasting effects (preferably even permanent unless intentionally worked against by players).
 
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DMK_sl

shitlord
1,600
0
What killed GW 2 for me was the feeling of no item progression even while leveling. I used to be undecided about Item progression. Now I know for sure I want item progression in all MMO's.
 
Laura

Laura

Lord Nagafen Raider
582
109
StoryBricks...
God damn it, not another unnecessary crap that sounds "cool" on paper and will fail when the game's released.
 
Siliconemelons

Siliconemelons

Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
12,710
19,375
Honestly StroyBricks would build a better ElderScrolls game, but its application to MMO land has to be done precisely and thoughtfully - either side of the fence you sit on - Modern WoW vs Classic EQ a lot of what both sides wants depends on playing with other people- the level of this interaction changes - yes but still...

If every single NPC can be pissed off etc your going to segment players, okay here is a big bad dragon- but 1 of every 5 people cant go kill it because they are trying to swoon a hottie with a dragon fetish- or your best friend is a Drakkin and that's his grandmother..

It can be a slippery slope- but we will see what sony puts out... the best thing to happen in EQN news was that they scrapped the thing and started over a while ago.
 
Baghwan

Baghwan

Lord Nagafen Raider
78
3
I haven't played PlanetSide 2 or DC:UO at all, how does their cash shop compare with say EQ2 which leaves you with a gutted character unless you're on the subscription gold account, but at least after that there is no real bought competitive advantage from the shop.
 
bixxby

bixxby

Molten Core Raider
2,750
47
DC:UO's cash shop is pretty good. Any costumes/weapon skins unlock for your whole account. I think silver accounts have a money cap though, I haven't ever really booted it up when I wasn't on the $20 thing sony does.
 
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Nobody_sl

shitlord
80
0
Baghwan_sl said:
I haven't played PlanetSide 2 or DC:UO at all, how does their cash shop compare with say EQ2 which leaves you with a gutted character unless you're on the subscription gold account, but at least after that there is no real bought competitive advantage from the shop.
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PS2's cash shop is superb. You don't need to spend a single cent. All weapons are side-grades at best, no pay-to-win straight upgrades. Everything that actually "advances" your character has to be earned through certs. You can buy cert and XP boosts with cash, or you get a XP bonus when you're a paid subscriber, but even then it's pretty minimal. All things considered it's extremely unobtrusive.
 
Rod-138

Rod-138

Trakanon Raider
1,226
982
I wish there were a way for me to invest in E-dyes in this universe now. That's going in the cash shop, I'd bet my cat's left nut.
 
tad10

tad10

Elisha Dushku
5,534
601
Laura_sl said:
StoryBricks...
God damn it, not another unnecessary crap that sounds "cool" on paper and will fail when the game's released.
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Yeah because who wants AI in an MMO?
rolleyes.png
 
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etchazz

Trakanon Raider
2,707
1,056
tad10;253416 said:
SWG-style crafted loot with NPCs dropping different quality materials would work pretty well. Then would't matter if any particular NPC died.

no. i don't want to play a game where my only reward is a fucking rock or piece of metal or cloth that has to then be given to someone else in order to turn it into something useful. that is beyond gay.
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tad10

tad10

Elisha Dushku
5,534
601
etchazz_sl said:
tad10_sl said:
SWG-style crafted loot with NPCs dropping different quality materials would work pretty well. Then would't matter if any particular NPC died.
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no. i don't want to play a game where my only reward is a fucking rock or piece of metal or cloth that has to then be given to someone else in order to turn it into something useful. that is beyond gay.
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I feel the same way about Diablo style random loot. Which brings us back to the problem that if you're not actually changing the world (e.g. NPC permadeath) then that too is gay.

Ah well

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Laura

Laura

Lord Nagafen Raider
582
109
tad10_sl said:
Yeah because who wants AI in an MMO?
rolleyes.png
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How is StoryBricks an AI?
If you mean StoryBricks is a mixture of the Faction system (being KOS, indiffierent, Allie...etc) and Questing... then that mix sounds horrible.

Keep AI and Faction system separate from each other, Remove scripted-questing completely out of my game and I will be happy.

You remind me of the GW2 fanboys and all that hype about how GW2 is going to change questing. I never liked the "Dynamic Events" when they were talking about it 2 years before release and I didn't like it after the game's release either.
 
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Lemmiwinks_sl

shitlord
533
6
To me, storybricks seems like a cute name for elaborate scripting. Sounds neat, but Ill have my judgement strictly reserved on it until I see it put in action, over the long term. A neat 5 minute video wouldnt accurately represent the system they describe.

Its nothing special if, in the bandit case Tad10 mentioned, that the bandits get driven off, and keep coming back. For 2 years in-game. And the NPCs keep asking for players help, for two years.
 
Soygen

Soygen

The Dirty Dozen For the Price of One
<Nazi Janitors>
28,571
45,198
I think the most important aspect of StoryBricks is the ease at which it will help facilitate new content; and making constant new content in MMO's is one of the bigger obstacles.
 
tad10

tad10

Elisha Dushku
5,534
601
Laura_sl said:
How is StoryBricks an AI?
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Because that's what it is, it's a scripting system for AI. Did you not watch any of the videos, listen to the podcast or read anything about it before posting?

Storybricks does the following:
-Provides a lot of pre-set behavior for NPCS (e.g. Guards will protect a town without you having to script anything)
-Allows you to build specific behavior and motiviations for a Particular NPC (Guard Tolus is in love with a chick, wants flowers)
-Allows NPCs to remember past events and encounters and adjust behavior accordingly (You beat the crap out of Tolus a while back and he had to flee).
-Allows NPCs to adjust behavior based on past events and encounters (Tolus now always travels with another Guard).

Basically you don't know what you're talking about. That said, etchazz (and a couple of others - Iannis? not going to check) have brought up the key issue - if you have a true dynamic world what happens to static loot? Some people - arguably a majority of the people - aren't going to be happy with NPCs dropping "Wrought Ore +gooder" that they have to take to get crafted; they want "Long Sword +gooder" that they can equip immediately.

I have no clue if SOE/SB has a solution to that issue.
 
tad10

tad10

Elisha Dushku
5,534
601
Soygen_sl said:
I think the most important aspect of StoryBricks is the ease at which it will help facilitate new content; and making constant new content in MMO's is one of the bigger obstacles.
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That's what Smed's been saying (without mentioning SB) - I'll look for the quote, but basically I think we can count on player made content filtered through SOE's Cash Shop with players using an SB dev kit.

Lemmiwinks_sl said:
Its nothing special if, in the bandit case Tad10 mentioned, that the bandits get driven off, and keep coming back. For 2 years in-game. And the NPCs keep asking for players help, for two years.
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But that's not how the example was described in the podcast: the guy was pretty specific: beat the shit out of the bandits and they will stop attacking that village and look for loot elsewhere (this is the remember past events and change behavior accordingly part of SB).

And yes, of course, you are absolutely correct to reserve judgment as the implementation could suck ballz - in which case it's time to embrace bridge or knitting as a hobby.
 
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Bellringer_sl

shitlord
387
0
Who gives two flying fucks about story or storypricks or whatever? I remember nearly 100% of the quests I did in EQ. Why? Because there were so few. Turning in Orc Belts, Militia Helms, and Warrior Epic. Thats about it. The questing to level system was done by wow, and it'll never be fun in another mmo...ever. Who played EQ for the story? Who gives a shit? DRAGONS AND GODS AND FAGGOTS OH MY!!! Give me a fucking break.

Why was EQ important to you all? Did you not have an emotional connection to your character? Did you not have an emotional connection to the zones that you leveled/raided in? When you think back to your time in EQ, what did you remember? Do you remember the story, or the people, zones, and your character (gear and all).

Figure out the why and you will understand what is needed for that to happen again.


EDIT: I guess farming keys counts as quests too...technically.
 
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Bellringer_sl

shitlord
387
0
I did not imply that there needs to be a complete recreation of EQ1. Or were you stating that you don't think players need to have a connection to their character and the world to make an MMO long lasting?
 
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