EQ Never

etchazz_sl said:

but this is exactly what's going to happen. it's going to be "okay, i want to be the dps, so one of you has to be the healer, and someone else has to be the CC, etc..." it's one of those things that sounds great, but is poorly implemented.

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We don't really know for sure and im sure they are and will hear our concerns with that gameplay style.

I'm sure everything I'm about to say has been rehashed ad nauseam, but initial impressions:

The world looks very cool, and I got excited to see the wizard spires amidst the overgrowth. I like the atmosphere and it doesn't seem as cartoony as WoW. I'll probably reiterate this point a few times in this post, but EQ had a certain level of realism that made the world seem realistic and dangerous. At no point when I was playing WoW did I have the same investment in my characters or their well-being. Vanguard, on the other hand, recaptured some of that EQ feeling. The atmosphere, graphics, and animations play a huge role in this.
Those were some awful, ridiculous shoulderpads and armor on that Kerran. I loved EQs simplistic armor because when you got something truly unique, it showed. A fancy weapon or BP or helm was immediately recognizable. The shoulders and shield in the demo look like they are made of 3 layers of 6-inch thick rock. It doesn't look anything like armor - it's just a big bulky costume. I liked in EQ how a shield bash was a relatively slow animation with a dull clunk when it connected, because it really conveyed the weight and heft of a shield. From the EQN video, the armor looks light as a feather and you can whip that shield at light speed. This leads me to my next point:
Every animation looks like a superhero is performing it. Ninja spins, sparks flying with every attack and shield bash, jumping 10 feet in the air, zipping forward at super speed and demolishing a horde of enemies. Again, one of the things that made EQ magical was that every monster (assuming it wasn't 30+ levels below you) was tough enough to warrant attention. Maybe for this demo the mobs were just there to act as bowling pins, but I get the impression that you'll have warriors with cleave attacks taking out hordes of enemies as you bounce through the map with movement and jumping abilities crushing mobs along the way. Again, nothing wrong with that, but it's not in the spirit of EQ. I did like the human female mage model and equipment. I didn't like how she could somersault around through that pack of mobs. It was great how fragile casters were in EQ - if you were in the midst of multiple mobs trying to cast an AOE you had to pray that your aggro was under control or you'd be instagibbed. This is pure speculation but I wouldn't be surprised if EQN had much more durable, mobile casters.

Overall, it looks like a fun game but I didn't get much of an EQ or VG feel from it. It might be the next big thing but characters just seem too... heroic and strong. The entire EQ experience made you feel weak and dependent on others unless you were romping through a zone with a big level advantage. Even on my bard, which was a solo machine, I always had adrenaline pumping while kiting in Great Divide or the Karanas, because one false move and you'd land in melee range, get bashed, and turned into mush. Even on my tough tanky paladin, if I got a wandering add that resisted root, I was toast unless I landed a clutch blind and could strafe run to the zone line. Those type of experiences seem like they are lost these days as the focus shifts to glitzy animations and big damage numbers. It just looks like another new MMO where you accumulate uber skills and crush monsters by the dozen. Ah well, I'll give it a try and maybe the new features will bring enough to the table to capture our interest for a year or two?

Teekey_sl said:

People will always specialize in specific classes or roles. I hate playing casters in just about every game, that probably won't change in EQN. I like to play Tanks, or at the very least melee classes.

If obtaining a class and leveling it up takes as much of an investment as Tad said, then I think finding someone who can do everything will atleast be as rare as someone who has a geared alt of every role in other MMOs.


Maybe it's just me, but I really only have a connection with my 'main' character. That is my avatar in the world, and I use alts just out of necessity. I like the idea of being able to have 1 main character without needing 10 alts to be a fully effective member of my group or guild. Because I don't know about you, but most every person in my guilds has had multiple characters to fill in the gaps that were needed for specific groups or raids. I think people are sort of kidding themselves if they don't think individual people being able to fill every role hasn't always been possible, for the most part.

Let's be honest, is there really a big difference in my main character being able to switch to healer (which I had to gear and tier up) and logging on an alt that I leveled and geared up?

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I absolutely agree with you, I do see the concerns though. in EQ I could have an Alt porter unfortunately if he is on my same account, he is useless for porting my own warrior. So I cant just get out of the game and port my group to our destination because now I need to go find a port for myself or hope that one of my teammates also has an alt porter and port me there too. I do see the concerns people are saying because if it is like that, then everyone will make sure they have those key components (resser, porter, etc) or they are gimped.

I just don't see how they will be able to balance 40 classes. People will naturally flock to the more powerful classes and abilities while ignoring the underpowered ones. I'm afraid it will be just like in wow with talents. Sure there were a lot of choices, but there were only a few viable ways that the majority of people used. It won't take long for people to find them out too. It is good to have a choice, but when everyone makes the same choices it is like why even bother with all the choices.

slicedmass_sl said:

I absolutely agree with you, I do see the concerns though. in EQ I could have an Alt porter unfortunately if he is on my same account, he is useless for porting my own warrior. So I cant just get out of the game and port my group to our destination because now I need to go find a port for myself or hope that one of my teammates also has an alt porter and port me there too. I do see the concerns people are saying because if it is like that, then everyone will make sure they have those key components (resser, porter, etc) or they are gimped.

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Shrug. I had a second account with a Cleric and Druid for this exact reason. People are greatly overstating the need for class dependence, even back in the original EQ.

The only difference between EQNext and EQ1 in that respect is having to pay for a second account. We already know this game is going to be Free to Play, so that's not even a barrier at this point.

Would people really feel better if I had to 'tier up' a Wizard on a second account to be my port bitch? What purpose does that really serve?

Caliel_sl said:

I just don't see how they will be able to balance 40 classes. People will naturally flock to the more powerful classes and abilities while ignoring the underpowered ones. I'm afraid it will be just like in wow with talents. Sure there were a lot of choices, but there were only a few viable ways that the majority of people used. It won't take long for people to find them out too. It is good to have a choice, but when everyone makes the same choices it is like why even bother with all the choices.

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Get ready for..

"Tune in you my YouTube channel for the weeks' top 5 EQNext best class builds, and a chance to win a gaming mouse courtesy of Razer Gaming!"

It isn't a new concept though, how do you think the Hally Tankmage of UO fame was born?

Teekey_sl said:

Shrug. I had a second account with a Cleric and Druid for this exact reason. People are greatly overstating the need for class dependence, even back in the original EQ.

The only difference between EQNext and EQ1 in that respect is having to pay for a second account. We already know this game is going to be Free to Play, so that's not even a barrier at this point.

Would people really feel better if I had to 'tier up' a Wizard on a second account to be my port bitch? What purpose does that really serve?

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i think multi accounters were very few and far between which wont be the case in this game. I hope they balance it properly or it becomes too convenient to solo which is what I hope they stray far away from, thats the main thing I want to see personally, I want to almost have to group.

For me I don't give a rats ass about the direction of graphics, that has always been one of the lowest concerns of mine. The class setup sounds like it would be pretty fun on the PVP side of things and allow for some great fun "Oh shit, I did not know you had mastered the secret art of the troll basher to block all my melee damag, fuck me!".

However, with the little information we have so far I'd be lying if I said the idea of multi-classing to this degree (PVE related concerns) and the fact that it is F2P makes me loose almost all interest. Luckily for them I am a minority and many will appreciate the other things they are bringing to the table!

I'll just pick what I want and roll with it. Maybe if there's something that I think will add to my class, I'll try and snag that ability. Maybe people will hate me for not having fucking bard speed ready to go at the click of a mouse, but they can get bent. They'll hate me more when I roleplay the cowardly lion equipped with SOEmote and whimper in the corner with a Kerran warrior.

slicedmass_sl said:

i think multi accounters were very few and far between which wont be the case in this game. I hope they balance it properly or it becomes too convenient to solo which is what I hope they stray far away from, thats the main thing I want to see personally, I want to almost have to group.

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It's going to be even more common in a free-to-play game where you don't have to buy a box, or subscription.

I do hope that grouping is more necessary, too. But I do think there should be content for all players. Perhaps you can solo the Orc Scouts that leave Crushbone. You can duo or trio the Centurions and Taskmasters around the castle. But to break into the castle and kill legionnaires requires a full group, and perhaps Lord Darish requires a small raid.

I hope they have the balls to actually take the massive piles of feedback that I am sure is destroying their server this weekend, and do change... Even M$ had to change on the XB1... If we give them true good real feedback I think we can see a new foundation of battle, class core mechanics and add in some more 'eq'...

they should take a hard look at EQ2 and what turned it around...or helped it... They basically from faydwer have done kunark and velious.. They should realize that their core are EQ fans, keep them... Make the game good and the outside will follow.

I want a MMORPG ... No one seems to want to do that as they feel traditional RPG events are bad!

Teekey_sl said:

People will always specialize in specific classes or roles. I hate playing casters in just about every game, that probably won't change in EQN. I like to play Tanks, or at the very least melee classes.

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melee in a game with destructible environments, and buildable. hahahaha.

Don't mind me blowing up that bridge, building a giant wall of ice, blowing up a hole under you and the enemy that you are trying to melee from 50ft back on my wizard..

notice, he didnt have an answer for that in the video linked. "uh, melee can multiclass to get teleport"

Caliane_sl said:

melee in a game with destructible environments, and buildable. hahahaha.

Don't mind me blowing up that bridge, building a giant wall of ice, blowing up a hole under you and the enemy that you are trying to melee from 50ft back on my wizard..

notice, he didnt have an answer for that in the video linked. "uh, melee can multiclass to get teleport"

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Don't worry I'm sure melees will have an identical move with a different animation so we can Juggernaut through shit.

Teekey_sl said:

It's going to be even more common in a free-to-play game where you don't have to buy a box, or subscription.

I do hope that grouping is more necessary, too. But I do think there should be content for all players. Perhaps you can solo the Orc Scouts that leave Crushbone. You can duo or trio the Centurions and Taskmasters around the castle. But to break into the castle and kill legionnaires requires a full group, and perhaps Lord Darish requires a small raid.

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Def agree with that and hopefully they really reward the grouping aspect, which is an easy to do thing if this game contains personal loot as the bigger the group the more loot you get. Have they commented at all on the loot drops and how they will work?

People are already complaining about nighttime being too dark. If the developers listen to that kind of feedback then this game is doomed.

supertouch_sl said:

People are already complaining about nighttime being too dark. If the developers listen to that kind of feedback then this game is doomed.

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Agreed. Not only should night be dark, but some mobs should only be nocturnal. They could really go crazy with StoryBricks in this respect.

supertouch_sl said:

People are already complaining about nighttime being too dark. If the developers listen to that kind of feedback then this game is doomed.

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Someone asked Georgeson if players would ever be able to damage other players' property and he almost had a stroke upon hearing the question before answering "N-NO! NEVER! NO!"