EQ Never

S

supertouch_sl

shitlord
1,858
3
Do people not understand that contested content and "timesinks" are what create longevity?

I don't exactly have the free time to play MMOs for 12 hours a day, but I certainly don't want to play a game in which everything is readily accessible -- a game where I can log on for 20 minutes and have the best gear in the game. I'd like to meet these mythical gamers that actually like that shit.
 
Rod-138

Rod-138

Trakanon Raider
1,226
982
Remember fellars, if this is F2P, then there's got to be time sinks and progression, or we wouldn't play long enough to give them a chance to make money.

Their goal is to make dis cash over the long term, so read between some of your fears and remember that they're trying to hook you for a long term commitment. They're having meetings about how to hook you and how to keep you logging on.

Just as we know the Rifts and GW2s of the world's results, they do, and they have aces in their sleeves to try and catch you with. Maybe the reason for lack of info isn't that there is no info, but maybe the team is protecting their niche while keeping interest as long as possible?

Or maybe it's all a bunch of hype and bullshit and were fucked
 
Skylancer81

Skylancer81

Trakanon Raider
763
1,072
I bet they will have bound gear, but the cash shop will have the unbinders for 5-10 bucks each. Got to make that money.
 
D

Dumar_sl

shitlord
3,712
4
Rod-138_sl said:
They're having meetings about how to hook you and how to keep you logging on
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I hate this fucking industry with every ounce of my soul. Just make a FUCKING GOOD GAME, not whore yourselves out to the profit goddess with every goddamn game design decision possible.
 
Rod-138

Rod-138

Trakanon Raider
1,226
982
It's all about the benjies whaaaat

If I have one vibe from this project do far it's 'corporate.' Everything is planned. Information is strategically leaked. Answers are all scripted to ruffle the least amount of feathers. Were told to be excited. I get it, it's their jobs, but nevertheless - this game reeks of da corporate. It feels like....every blockbuster movie that's come out in the past 10 yrs.

You know it'll suck, you've seen the Michael Bayplosions, silly plot, and forced everything, but man, there's always a chance it could be cool! ...

I feel like the South Park episode where the kid has to drink Jamison to kick in any entertainment, but alas, I hope the best and I'm glad they're trying at least.

Even if the result of all these brothers of industry is a monster mutated soulless baby, you have to try and breed anyway or you have no babies
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C

Couloir_sl

shitlord
40
0
Go home post #19706. You're drunk.

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Make a good game or make a good profit? If you've been following the oblong table at all, the answer should be clear:

There should be a good mix of both game and profit.

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Mr Creed_sl said:
In the mind of Timmy he belongs on (the hard, ultra competitive difficulty server) and should excel there, and the game rules should be bent until he can compete. You cant make a pre-school server "for the masses" and expect that to solve complaints, because everyone agrees you need such a server, but only for everyone else.
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Guess I could be wrong but I can't for the life of me imagine that Timmy is the proper target audience for this IP. What logic is there for tailoring this game to little Tim-Tim? Don't they already have Free Realms for that?

There could still be a server for that player though. Like most games that have ever been made, I still don't see why you can't have different modes of difficulty. Easy, Normal, Hard. Sprinkle in some more if you'd like. Have they thrown that out the window too?

If Hard mode is too much for Timmy thenHarden The Fuck UporGet The Fuck Outand play on a lower difficulty serving. Perhaps it's wishful thinking, but I would hope that the development team would have the stones to take that stance on such an issue, as it is the correct one. Good for both game and profit. Bending the rules for Timmy is only gonna piss everybody else off and QQ the rest of your player base.

Besides the hardcore bros I suspect there are a good deal of casual players that also want this game to be difficult, or at least have that option, and have it stay that way. A lot of these types are also known as grown-ups. Business Casuals, maybe? Many of the developers themselves are these people, aren't they? They should get this.
 
Khane

Khane

Got something right about marriage
20,887
14,712
It's not a problem with the gaming industry Couloir. It's a problem with society. If a kid sucks at baseball his coach and teammates and especially parents don't say "Hey, maybe baseball isn't your sport, try this other sport called Football, maybe you'll be great at it. But seriously, you fucking suck at baseball so find something else.", they say "Great job kiddo, you're so talented! Way to go! Here's the same trophy we give everyone who plays. Good thing we don't keep score anymore! I'm sure you'll do well in your professional career now that you think you're amazing at everything!" Why would video game mentality be any different? It's not going away any time soon.

Until game developers find a way to not give a shit about the entitlement AND figure out a way to keep them entertained and spending money on their game this is gaming life.
 
2

2002User

Bronze Knight of the Realm
310
43
tad10_sl said:
So I take it you prefer the MOBA classes? As discussed Diku-style combat/classes may be "old" but then again so is chess and Go and you don't see people replacing Go with stones that have different abilities.

The advantage of DikU class/combat are that (1) People like Roles, (2) Developers can easily design encounters for the playerbase (3) Replayability - it's a different game if you play as a Druid instead of a Warrior, (4) Easy to Learn, Hard to Master, and (5) non-twitch based so anyone can play. I enjoyed LOL for the time I played it (two months) but it's not a combat style I want to play all the time.
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My comment wasn't made in sarcasm - couldn't tell if you took it that way or not. It's not so much that I care about the MOBA classes vs Diku MUD classes - I think either one can work - but the problem is SOE implementing this new system seems like they're trying to cash in off of it. I don't necessarily mind selling classes in general, but when you can multiclass, it's going to feel very Pay to Win. Additionally, it will make the game more boring since there will be FOTM multiclasses that almost everyone will be playing.

PlanetSide 2 certification system was a blatant attempt to sell power because there are so many different things you need to do in PlanetSide 2. Sure you can focus on one thing and not pay money and be good at it in a relatively decent timespan, but if you're a committed player you want to be good for every situation that arises.

That's different than the LoL model -- in LoL you can pay to quickly get a hero/get all the runes needed and pick that same hero, or at least the same role in almost every single game if you wanted to, because you can only choose one hero per game. I'm afraid that multiclassing will once again force you to pay money if you want to be a versatile/competitive player without having a ridiculous multiclass grind (which I have a sinking feeling will be of similar lengths to PlanetSide 2, which Smedley has compared to EVE), because you can mix and match classes, and MMOs are persistent games that are constantly forcing you to adapt to what situation you are in. I'd much rather it where you can play one class at once, whether it be MOBA hero or Diku MUD style class.

SOE's main problem with their F2P system is that they sacrifice good game design (i.e. PlanetSide 1 certification system of leveling giving you access to more choices - no power gains, period) to implement however they're going to make money in the game. Theoretically it's not pay to win, but when you take a system intended for MOBA games where you only play one hero for a match and put it in a persistent MMO world, it sure feels like it.
 
Mr Creed

Mr Creed

Too old for this shit
2,394
287
2002User_sl said:
PlanetSide 2 certification system was a blatant attempt to sell power because there are so many different things you need to do in PlanetSide 2. Sure you can focus on one thing and not pay money and be good at it in a relatively decent timespan, but if you're a committed player you want to be good for every situation that arises.

That's different than the LoL model -- in LoL you can pay to quickly get a hero/get all the runes needed and pick that same hero, or at least the same role in almost every single game if you wanted to, because you can only choose one hero per game. I'm afraid that multiclassing will once again force you to pay money if you want to be a versatile/competitive player without having a ridiculous multiclass grind (which I have a sinking feeling will be of similar lengths to PlanetSide 2, which Smedley has compared to EVE), because you can mix and match classes, and MMOs are persistent games that are constantly forcing you to adapt to what situation you are in. I'd much rather it where you can play one class at once, whether it be MOBA hero or Diku MUD style class.

SOE's main problem with their F2P system is that they sacrifice good game design (i.e. PlanetSide 1 certification system of leveling giving you access to more choices - no power gains, period) to implement however they're going to make money in the game. Theoretically it's not pay to win, but when you take a system intended for MOBA games where you only play one hero for a match and put it in a persistent MMO world, it sure feels like it.
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Did you re-read this before posting?

"PS2 is selling power because you want to be good for every situation that arises, but in LoL it's ok to scrub it out with just a carry and one rune set"

How is that a fair comparison?Your one chosen champion and rune setup is *not* sufficient past facerolling for lulz in LoL, starting with the obvious fact that it might be banned or picked before it's your turn, and that's assuming you pick it always with no regard to the balance or meta or previous picks of both teams. "I take alistair solo mid or I feed" statements come to mind. If that's ok then always going infiltrator with smg and skulking for afk victims is valid also. If you apply the same expectations you have for your PS2 situation to LoL then you need a full stable of champs for flexible role selection and counter-picking depending on how the champ selection goes. And then you need to buy or farm IP, same choice you have in PS2 when you want to able to have every possible loadout available: Buy or farm certs.

Ignoring the obvious differences between open world MMO gameplay and 5 vs 5 arena gameplay, I consider the advancement setups similar (and well done in both, sure beats most other F2P games). In both LoL and PS2 you can max one setup/role/champ fairly fast and expand your arsenal while mostly playing that, but you need to branch out and learn the other parts of the game to become a greater asset to your team in different situations. Also in both LoL and PS2 you have balance changes and fotm setups/team combinations that have great influence on how/what you get to do effectively (you can still do other shit you're just not really contributing then).



P.S: PS1 cert system was certainly more freeform with your armor choice dictating much of your loadout, but I'd say that is 'different' and not more or less powerful/P2W. PS2 is a different game then PS1 though, this would be like complaining that WC3 had heroes and SC2 doesnt and whats up with that, just because they are otherwise similar games that share a genre and developer. That said it would be nice if some things in PS2 were more like PS1 actually and they seem to move that way slowly, wru continent links/locks.
 
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