I agree.But as a developer myself and a former dev manager, the idea of using access to customer data that you have pursuant to your job, and then giving that data to third parties outside the company is just beyond the pale. I work in an actual regulated industry and I would face personal legal liability for doing something like that (my employer would have liability as well), obviously gaming is the Wild West but it is still massively shitty.
Yeah, I don't think anyone in this thread is really talking about SEQ use. While that is obviously a form of cheating, it's kinda w/e and almost all the serious TLPers use it. The reason we know they aren't actually targeting SEQ use in these ban waves is the numbers affected would be like 10-15x higher.I'd just feel down right sorry for whatever kind of life form is out there that would manually track fucking dragons and shit. I know its there, cause that shit happens on P99. But fuck that mess.
The easiest way to see how corrupt the inner workings of DPG (and it's predecessors) have been is the simple fact that EVERY single TLP server has had a 24/7 ice giant farmer and Sirens Grotto farmer. Every... Single... One. No human plays a game 24 hours a day 365 days a year. NO ONE. Anybody that ever says anything about them on the forums gets a "no name and shame" penalty thrown at them. Anybody that trains them gets seven days to think about what they did.Yeah, I don't think anyone in this thread is really talking about SEQ use. While that is obviously a form of cheating, it's kinda w/e and almost all the serious TLPers use it. The reason we know they aren't actually targeting SEQ use in these ban waves is the numbers affected would be like 10-15x higher.
We're talking Macroquest here, people AFK farming Siren's Grotto on 80 accounts at a time across 5 picks for months on end, people warp training contested open world content, using far taunt to pull bosses in raids in ways they couldn't otherwise be pulled etc. There's also a program Abyss has out that does some of the more egregious stuff. The Redguides "release" of MQN is neutered of a lot of that shit in its default compile, but there are still people out there with the more active hacks and they have been active on every server.
I think actively working to prevent and punish cheating is always good. I wish DPG was more consistent and forceful in how they did this.I know nothing about the internals of DPG but this rings the most true to me. These kinds of developer outfits are driven by individual developer's motivation to do something more than a cohesive strategy passed down from management. And that's typically a good thing with this anti-cheat move being a good example.
As a third party, even in this totally contrived and not realistic scenario the drama is totally worth how unprofessional it is. And this is a better scenario than the developers being disaffected and being happy to let the game go to shit because their game and tech ignorant boardmembers aren't forcing them enough to fight against cheating. So yeah, I'm all for the kind of loose dev power that's common in these old ass games with old ass devs who view their role as half-hobby, half-career.I think actively working to prevent and punish cheating is always good. I wish DPG was more consistent and forceful in how they did this.
There can be downsides however specifically when it comes to devs who play the game and are active in top live/tlp guilds.
As a thought experiment let’s imagine that Niente was actually Sirene from Twisted Legion and was also an active raider in Silent Redemption which is a top 5 retail EQ guild. Imagine that in this scenario Niente was the developer who specifically on her own agenda put in suspension wave tickets to get a mass number of MQ players suspended.
On the surface it’s not a big deal but what if she started doing this specifically before every big live content release and she forewarned her EQ guild leader that this was going to happen?
Let’s make the scenario just totally crazy and imagine that Meeko was also in that same guild and would give the guild leader of SR lists of who in the guild had used Macroquest in the last X months. Imagine if the GL then had the power to warn those members to stop or remove those members from their launch raid plans entirely before the suspension waves even hit.
That would be a huge tactical advantage over other live guilds. Again if Niente and Meeko were in Silent Redemption and forewarned their GL that suspensions would occur the day before content drops which would then disproportionately impact their competition but not their own guild.
Anyway, thats just a thought experiment and I am sure Niente, Meeko, Zoycite and co are not in this guild or TLP guilds because that would just be crazy.
Nah, leaking customer data or putting your thumb on the scales for various guilds is worse than having cheater programs lol. We the playing customer base shouldn't have to tolerate rogue devs on the hope of getting cheat software banned.As a third party, even in this totally contrived and not realistic scenario the drama is totally worth how unprofessional it is. And this is a better scenario than the developers being disaffected and being happy to let the game go to shit because their game and tech ignorant boardmembers aren't forcing them enough to fight against cheating. So yeah, I'm all for the kind of loose dev power that's common in these old ass games with old ass devs who view their role as half-hobby, half-career.
The point is we should be able to ban cheaters without all the other baggage.As a third party, even in this totally contrived and not realistic scenario the drama is totally worth how unprofessional it is. And this is a better scenario than the developers being disaffected and being happy to let the game go to shit because their game and tech ignorant boardmembers aren't forcing them enough to fight against cheating. So yeah, I'm all for the kind of loose dev power that's common in these old ass games with old ass devs who view their role as half-hobby, half-career.
DoTs apply their full credit over time instantly for the full value of the DoT. DDs apply their full credit instantly (obviously)
For example in classic:
2 Envenomed Bolts on Efreeti Lord will take credit.
You cannot undo credit once applied. First to higher than 50% (>= 50) damage total will take credit for the NPC.
There is no such thing as overkill. Credit is applied to the mob's total HP pool. So if you nuke w/ Ice Comet, and you deal 55% of the mob's health in one hit, and the mob has 43% health remaining, you won't take credit. I think there's an exception to one shotting mobs which I could be wrong about.
So the idiot with 6 necros at a spawn where you only need 3 necros is wasting those 3 krono'd accounts for that era, provided he can kill the mob quickly with the 3.
If you DoT a mob at 43%, the same applies. Your EBolt may take, say, 41% of the mob's health in a single cast for credit. But if someone's already claimed 51%, you lose credit.
When you account for HP regen, the credit is still applied to the person who gets 51% first, I believe. Correct me if I'm wrong. NPC Gate doesn't count, as it clears 'credit' tables.
I believe non-pet NPC engagement (ie; guards) functions differently and removes credit for experience/loot but only if the guard takes the killing blow OR the guard steals 51% of credit OR the guard deals more than the mob's total health in one hit.
Reapplication shouldn't redo credit, but to be honest, I've never tried. Too long of a recast normally. Generally, just have 2 necros or shaman parked somewhere, ebolt, then if it's contested congrats, you've won 50% credit. Or an SK with HT would work to instantly apply massive damage, then follow up with an ebolt cast if contesting against another person. Provided your ebolt goes off first, you win.
Nah, leaking customer data or putting your thumb on the scales for various guilds is worse than having cheater programs lol. We the playing customer base shouldn't have to tolerate rogue devs on the hope of getting cheat software banned.
Should is a really important word there. Old EQ addicts should have access to relatively bot-free servers and a semi-aggressive GM staff that professionally beats down cheaters like people around the world should have access to clean water as an essential human right. Just like everything else that is fucked up about this game we love called Everquest we have to chose to tolerate the problems and enjoy the total result or chose to spend our money else where. That being said, I totally laud any attempts to take DPG to task for guild favoritism, the entertainment from that is part of the upside of the act in the first place.The point is we should be able to ban cheaters without all the other baggage.
Zero misinformation from my part. If they use the detection I am mentioning, it has a 0% false detection/association rate.
MQNext is aware of this functionality, and bypasses it for itself, but not MySEQ.
src/main/MQ2DetourAPI.cpp · master · macroquest / next / MQnext · GitLab
We moved to github, go to https://github.com/macroquest/macroquest instead.gitlab.comsrc/main/MQ2DetourAPI.cpp · master · macroquest / next / MQnext · GitLab
We moved to github, go to https://github.com/macroquest/macroquest instead.gitlab.com
MySEQ is 100% detectable this way. The launchpad has HWID tracking capabilities. The game client and game loginserver uses the same utility (it's part of a library) and allows them to track you across games.
They even left in the slash command (albeit not hooked up) to test this stuff.
View attachment 420620
Beyond that, there's the normal 'memory check' stuff that has existed since 2003, though they don't use it anymore as I think ASLR broke it, though it's still used on spellcasts:
View attachment 420621
View attachment 420622
That same functionality is used for checking to see if you have the proper eqgame.exe, spells, basedata, skill caps, newzone_info, player profile length received from the server, etc:
View attachment 420623
The string MQ2 uses to identify itself is part of this checksum, in fact.
Beyond that, the zone server can request this data as part of a network message:
View attachment 420624
I don't believe any of that is used anymore, but it's hard to tell without emulating it to see what MQ2 changes, or making a mockup of the functions in a standalone program.
That brings me back to my point: None of what I said was based on misinformation. There's multiple layers of detection and none of them are surface visible to the average MQ user. I've named a handful of them, and not all of them are clientsided like these examples are. Analytics is a big part of our industry, EQ is no exception.
Fairly high. This is why MMO companies tell you to not share your account, and why CSRs will often deny account change requests that can't prove they are actually the owner. It's a clusterfuck for CSRs to deal with if they arbitrarily allowed that shit. It's why account to account transfers require ownership proof. It's so they can take the burden of responsibility off of them and onto you, and why they have no qualms banning people based on detections on your account.
"Your account is your responsibility."
Correct. There used to be but they stopped that a few years ago and have said there are no plans to re-enable it.Just to confirm, there's definitely no way to move a character from one account to another, is there?
I think actively working to prevent and punish cheating is always good. I wish DPG was more consistent and forceful in how they did this.
There can be downsides however specifically when it comes to devs who play the game and are active in top live/tlp guilds.
As a thought experiment let’s imagine that Niente was actually Sirene from Twisted Legion and was also an active raider in Silent Redemption which is a top 5 retail EQ guild. Imagine that in this scenario Niente was the developer who specifically on her own agenda put in suspension wave tickets to get a mass number of MQ players suspended.
On the surface it’s not a big deal but what if she started doing this specifically before every big live content release and she forewarned her EQ guild leader that this was going to happen?
Let’s make the scenario just totally crazy and imagine that Meeko was also in that same guild and would give the guild leader of SR lists of who in the guild had used Macroquest in the last X months. Imagine if the GL then had the power to warn those members to stop or remove those members from their launch raid plans entirely before the suspension waves even hit.
That would be a huge tactical advantage over other live guilds. Again if Niente and Meeko were in Silent Redemption and forewarned their GL that suspensions would occur the day before content drops which would then disproportionately impact their competition but not their own guild.
Anyway, thats just a thought experiment and I am sure Niente, Meeko, Narwhal and co are not in this guild or TLP guilds because that would just be crazy.
That first VM suspension wave on Selo about a month or so after launch was a bloodbath.
I always wondered who else had heard about this crazy scenario, i'd guess alot more people will now imagine this crazy theory.I think actively working to prevent and punish cheating is always good. I wish DPG was more consistent and forceful in how they did this.
There can be downsides however specifically when it comes to devs who play the game and are active in top live/tlp guilds.
As a thought experiment let’s imagine that Niente was actually Sirene from Twisted Legion and was also an active raider in Silent Redemption which is a top 5 retail EQ guild. Imagine that in this scenario Niente was the developer who specifically on her own agenda put in suspension wave tickets to get a mass number of MQ players suspended.
On the surface it’s not a big deal but what if she started doing this specifically before every big live content release and she forewarned her EQ guild leader that this was going to happen?
Let’s make the scenario just totally crazy and imagine that Meeko was also in that same guild and would give the guild leader of SR lists of who in the guild had used Macroquest in the last X months. Imagine if the GL then had the power to warn those members to stop or remove those members from their launch raid plans entirely before the suspension waves even hit.
That would be a huge tactical advantage over other live guilds. Again if Niente and Meeko were in Silent Redemption and forewarned their GL that suspensions would occur the day before content drops which would then disproportionately impact their competition but not their own guild.
Anyway, thats just a thought experiment and I am sure Niente, Meeko, Narwhal and co are not in this guild or TLP guilds because that would just be crazy.