EQ TLP - Vaniki (Level-Locked Progression)

Secrets said:

They can also terminate your account for any reason - and they don't have to disclose the reason you were terminated. A fair comparison would be a restaurant kicking you out, and not telling you the reason why. They have the right to refuse to service you, just like you don't have to bake a cake for a gay couple in the US as a Christian baker.

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This is incorrect.

Secrets said:

It's why I stated above that emus are the way to go for enforcing boxing rules consistently - they have no financial obligation to keep you around. They can be ruthless and invasive when it comes to determining you multiboxing, they have no investors or shareholders and operate on their pride of removing undesirable players from their game.

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I agree with most of what you said other then this part. I've played on a few WOW EMUs that are for profit and openly sell things like XP boost ect. They all have anti-cheat anti-boxing and i doubt it hurts their revenue. It's a short-term loss long term gain kinda thing.

Ambiturner said:

This is incorrect.

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Which part?

Mrniceguy said:

I agree with most of what you said other then this part. I've played on a few WOW EMUs that are for profit and openly sell things like XP boost ect. They all have anti-cheat anti-boxing and it doubt it hurts their revenue. It's a short-term loss long term gain kinda thing.


Which part?

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Comparison to being able to refuse service based on sexual orientation.

It's also not true that EULA's matter all that much, but it's a lot more gray than blatantly violating federal law

Ambiturner said:

Comparison to being able to refuse service based on sexual orientation.

It's also not true that EULA's matter all that much, but it's a lot more gray than blatantly violating federal law

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Masterpiece Cakeshop v. Colorado Civil Rights Commission - Wikipedia

You're allowed to if you say it's against your religious beliefs.
You can also just lie as to the reason you refuse them service.

Mrniceguy said:

Masterpiece Cakeshop v. Colorado Civil Rights Commission - Wikipedia

You're allowed to if you say it's against your religious beliefs.
You can also just lie as to the reason you refuse them service.

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All that opinion said is that the Colorado Commission can't be bias AGAINST religion. Not that its ok to discriminate. Please learn how to read a SCOTUS opinion.

Mrniceguy said:

Masterpiece Cakeshop v. Colorado Civil Rights Commission - Wikipedia

You're allowed to if you say it's against your religious beliefs.
You can also just lie as to the reason you refuse them service.

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Looks like EQ isn't the only thing you're always wrong about.

They offered to make other things for the couple, just not the specific custom cake that went against their religion.

Like if I went to a muslim bakery and they refused to bake a cake with Muhammad's face on it.

Only dum dums bring politics and religion into eq talk… A more important question is has anybody heard from Keon and the rapiers crew recently? I’ve not heard a thing!

NOT Bigor33 said:

Only dum dums bring politics and religion into eq talk… A more important question is has anybody heard from Keon and the rapiers crew recently? I’ve not heard a thing!

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He "said" he was banned back in like Classic. Did he come back and take over the existing Rapier's that didnt go off into other guilds?

Ambiturner said:

They offered to make other things for the couple, just not the specific custom cake that went against their religion.

Like if I went to a muslim bakery and they refused to bake a cake with Muhammad's face on it.

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"Ackchyually"

God your such an annoying insufferable cunt. You're also still wrong, you don't have to give people a reason as to why you deny them service.

Mrniceguy said:

"Ackchyually"

God your such an annoying insufferable cunt. You're also still wrong, you don't have to give people a reason as to why you deny them service.

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Where did I say they did?

You're the one that keeps posting blatantly wrong shit while pretending to be an expert

Ambiturner said:

Where did I say they did?

You're the one that keeps posting blatantly wrong shit while pretending to be an expert

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I never said i was an expert, you're just making shit up again.

Not saying you did, saying even if we accepted your premise that it was illegal, i'm saying they could just not say anything, deny the person services then just not incriminate themselves by giving a reason why. Which is actually to the point of what Secrets was arguing rather then the example that was given and is unimportant.

Nothing in the ruling says the Religious exemption is specifically limited to specific services, they can just deny them all services by claiming that it's against their religion period.

Ambiturner said:

This is incorrect.

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No, it's not. The EULA covers any sort of abuse. They can ban you for any reason they see fit, and you have no recourse, as long as the reason is not based on a protected class. And the EULA also states:

26.2. Termination. Your only remedy with respect to any dissatisfaction with any Daybreak Game(s) is to terminate your account. You may terminate any Daybreak Game subscription at any time, however, any subscription time already purchased will remain on your account until the end of your then-current billing cycle and will be nonrefundable. Daybreak reserves the right to suspend, restrict or terminate your access to or use of any Daybreak Game(s), at any time and for any reason, in its sole and absolute discretion. Upon any such termination, your right to use the Daybreak Games will immediately cease. You agree that any suspension, restriction or termination of your access to or use of any Daybreak Game(s) may be effected without prior notice and that we may immediately deactivate or delete any username and/or password used by or provided to you, and all access to your game accounts. You agree that we will not be liable to you or any third party for any suspension, restriction or termination of your access to any Daybreak Game(s) and we will not be required to make any of the Daybreak Game Assets associated with your account available to you after any such termination, suspension or restriction. All licenses that you grant under the Daybreak Terms of Services along with the terms and conditions of the following Sections shall survive the expiration or earlier termination of the Daybreak Terms of Service: Sections 9, 12, 16, 22, 23 and 26.

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Bypassing the 'restrictions' in EverQuest via MacroQuest or otherwise is technically a violation of the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act (CFAA) . It's not enforceable, of course, as they would have to prove damages. Unless you're selling cheat programs as a public business, you're not going to be hit by that, though it holds up the 'local / state / federal laws' part of the EULA:

26.7. Severability. Each provision of the Daybreak Terms of Service shall be interpreted in such manner as to be effective and valid under applicable law, but if any provision of the Daybreak Terms of Service is held to be prohibited by or invalid under applicable law, such provision shall be ineffective only to the extent of such prohibition or invalidity, without invalidating the remainder of such provision or the remaining provisions of these Terms of Service.

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26.10. Miscellaneous. If any provision of the Daybreak Terms of Service are deemed to be unlawful, void or for any reason unenforceable, then that provision will be deemed severable from the Daybreak Terms of Service and will not affect the validity and enforceability of any remaining provisions. The Daybreak Terms of Service does not, and will not be construed to, create any partnership, joint venture, employer-employee, agency or franchisor-franchisee relationship between you and us. Any heading, caption or section title contained herein is inserted only as a matter of convenience, and in no way defines or explains any section or provision hereof. The Daybreak Terms of Service, together with all agreements and statements referred to herein and incorporated herein by reference, is the entire agreement between you and us relating to the subject matter hereof and, except as otherwise provided herein, supersedes any and all prior or contemporaneous written or oral agreements or understandings between you and us relating to such subject matter. Notices to you may be made by posting a notice (or a link to a notice) through any Daybreak Game(s), by email, or by regular mail, at our sole and absolute discretion. Without limitation, you agree that a printed version of the Daybreak Terms of Service and of any notice given in electronic form will be admissible in judicial or administrative proceedings based upon or relating to the Daybreak Terms of Service to the same extent and subject to the same conditions as other business documents and records originally generated and maintained in printed form. Nothing in the Daybreak Terms of Service, express or implied, is intended to or will confer on any person (other than the parties and their respective successors or permitted assigns) any rights, remedies, obligations or liabilities.

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I can also tell you as someone who works in the industry that unless you're prohibiting access to Daybreak's service (ie; DDoS), or selling cheat programs or their 'intellectual property' on a public marketplace (ie; Redguides) or reselling the game for monetary gains on an emulator, you aren't even on their radar for legal action.

Though if you cheat on their service, you have no legal recourse if you were to file a suit against them. It would be a waste of your time and money, and theirs, too. When I worked in customer support of a non-Daybreak company, we'd have tons of people complaining to the BBB because we banned them for cheating... which does jack shit, because they still have to play the game using our service and no one actually cares about those ratings which aren't enforcing anything on us legally.

In one case, we had the FBI intervene with a person who sent bomb threats / SWAT teams to our community manager's house, repeatedly, and left threatening voicemails on their daughter's cellphone. Those are the kind of things that companies will go after.. even in emu land.

Rogean, EQEmulator & P99's main administrator was harassed by RyanTwin20 (aka RyanAndSean) at his workplace and those galaxy brains streamed the harassment on Twitch. After, Rogean's company threatened legal action against the two goons and they backed off rather quickly once they had police at their hotel room. So I mean, harassment is generally a better way for a company to take action against you compared to casual MQ2 usage.

Using cheat programs will remove all recourse you have legally, though. And Daybreak "reserves the right to suspend, restrict or terminate your access to or use of any Daybreak Game(s), at any time and for any reason, in its sole and absolute discretion."

In short, nothing I said except maybe religion or being gay is a protected class or not; I simply cited a political case as an extreme example to tell you that Daybreak and basically anyone in this industry can collect any information they need to target you and ban you for any reason they see fit.

Secrets said:

In short, nothing I said except maybe religion or being gay is a protected class or not; I simply cited a political case as an extreme example to tell you that Daybreak and basically anyone in this industry can collect any information they need to target you and ban you for any reason they see fit.

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That was the part I was referring to which is why it's the only part I quoted.

You just chose an odd example of one of the very few reasons they can't ban you.

Normally this would he a retarded derail but it's better than that faggot trying to promote Rapiers while pretending he's not

Ambiturner said:

That was the part I was referring to which is why it's the only part I quoted.

You just chose an odd example of one of the very few reasons they can't ban you.

Normally this would he a retarded derail but it's better than that faggot trying to promote Rapiers while pretending he's not

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lol Well how the fk am I suppose to know? We only ever made fun of that guild.

Mrniceguy said:

Nothing in the ruling says the Religious exemption is specifically limited to specific services, they can just deny them all services by claiming that it's against their religion period.

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Jesus, you have no idea how any of this works just stop

If eq bans you please sue them and claim that they are discriminating against you because of your sexuality. Let us know how it goes.

Vanessa said:

Someone please relate EQ to meritocracy in capitalism society now.

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Uber guilds putting relevant raid content on lockdown is the logical result of any capitalist society without Anti-Trust laws.