Everquest - Agnarr Server: Sunset Mode

GMs didn't allow it, not the playerbase lol. Not sure how you got that out of what I said. The player base had absolutely no influence over most guilds decisions. If you thought the number one guilds were full of good guys, you weren't competing with them, plain and simple.

alavaz said:

GMs didn't allow it, not the playerbase lol. Not sure how you got that out of what I said. The player base had absolutely no influence over most guilds decisions. If you thought the number one guilds were full of good guys, you weren't competing with them, plain and simple.

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I was one of the Sr. Guide's for one of those servers you mentioned (Veeshan - thus my initial connection to FoH and thus here) - for every incident that actually mandated CS being involved there were dozens that didn't.

We were constantly on "high alert" (usually a Sr. Guide like myself set up in zones that were at risk of volatile interactions invis so that there were eyes on the scene (and yes, the server GM over there contradicted the "VP rule") JIC because it was a comparatively volatile server compared to most. But literally I can count the incidents that would occur per month that involved the CS staff on a hand - until late Luclin and PoP where it became commonplace.

But the funny thing is, you really aren't saying something different depending on how you take what you're saying. We're not claiming there wasn't a THREAT of possible enforcement - that's a world different than CS being constantly involved.

To compare to the TLP servers, for the earlier ones, before CS was officially abolished there would be weeks where every single raid mob was a CS dispute. No one is saying "nothing shady ever happened" - but it was never commonplace, even on the worst servers.

The only point I was really making was that the TLP shit show is due to a change in outside circumstance and not some new breed of players with bad attitudes.

Come on guys, Vaclav is the most well connected person in the world (duh) and definitely knows better than your first hand experiences

You're / Your violation. Retard guild confirmed.

Ambiturner said:

Come on guys, Vaclav is the most well connected person in the world (duh) and definitely knows better than your first hand experiences

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There was zero connections involved, it was my own effort in this case. =P

And honestly, I'm saying the same damn thing - it's just perspective really. Policing was unarguably there, just the depth of how involved it was is exaggerated for my tastes. It sounds equivalent to cops in riot gear putting down something with how people were making it sound with complete crackdown in progress at all hours.

I didn't mind the level of chaos back in the day, it was manageable. Yes, the dude from BotS who was implying there was none was a bit hyperbolic the other direction as well - but no one with a functioning memory should ever claim EoE on Vulak compared to even the most toxic of servers back in the day. We're comparing Defcon 1 and Defcon 2 (maybe there was even a 3 that I'm unaware of - I'd only put TZ and Veeshan from my own experience as 2's even - and I am similar ignorant of the rotationish servers that were Defcon 0 - although I know some existed) territory but Vulak was Defcon 5 [or whatever the max was - not seen Wargames in a long long time] level of toxicity. (I will say though, EoE on Phinigel were decent enough people though)

Vaclav said:

There was zero connections involved, it was my own effort in this case. =P

And honestly, I'm saying the same damn thing - it's just perspective really. Policing was unarguably there, just the depth of how involved it was is exaggerated for my tastes. It sounds equivalent to cops in riot gear putting down something with how people were making it sound with complete crackdown in progress at all hours.

I didn't mind the level of chaos back in the day, it was manageable. Yes, the dude from BotS who was implying there was none was a bit hyperbolic the other direction as well - but no one with a functioning memory should ever claim EoE on Vulak compared to even the most toxic of servers back in the day. We're comparing Defcon 1 and Defcon 2 (maybe there was even a 3 that I'm unaware of - I'd only put TZ and Veeshan from my own experience as 2's even - and I am similar ignorant of the rotationish servers that were Defcon 0 - although I know some existed) territory but Vulak was Defcon 5 [or whatever the max was - not seen Wargames in a long long time] level of toxicity. (I will say though, EoE on Phinigel were decent enough people though)

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I dunno, the shit EoE did was more selfish than anything i saw on Xev, and I was in EoE.

Excidium said:

I dunno, the shit EoE did was more selfish than anything i saw on Xev, and I was in EoE.

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Phin EoE or Vulak EoE? Phin EoE I really feel like I looked down on unfairly once I finally had enough decent experiences to start looking at them with fresh eyes.

Sure, they were a bit insular - but they weren't doing the outward toxicity like Vulak. Just normal competitiveness stuff and completely fairly from what I'd seen (a total of one bad experience with farming my VP keys was with EoE, but even that was minor - no bitching about it or anything, just that I was forced to KS the AJ I'd worked hours spawning from an EoE person) - beyond that everything else with EoE was neutral or even positive. [The one half-elf warrior dude pitched in some help for epic fights - blanking on his name ATM]

I think too many of you are trying to look for an easy explanation on why TLPs are toxic when the answer is a variety of reasons all contribute.

The biggest one is competition based on numbers. Do you old fucks remember actual in era life? You didn't just know every 50/60/65 by chance... there were not that many of them in most places. More importantly though they were not the majority; most of the server was low level and sustained the elite. Further, often those max leveled did not care to raid, did it casually, or were content behind the bleeding edge.

Compare to tlp. Max level is the norm. Wanting to raid is the norm. Current content is the expectation. Then you have multiple chars per person to multiply this. You are starting with an environment that is wildly competitive far beyond anything remotely akin to original eq's casual playground.

Second is escalating standards. If first in force gets the mob what happens if my guild camps out seb when trak is due? If you are off in chardok etc you lose that race. What happens if you instead counter by just parking your guild past juggs? Either we come post up next to you or we now lose the race.

Combine pog was referenced earlier. Great example. In kunark due to over enforcement during races and arbitrary gm rulings, come velious the gloves were off. The tuna example, it was actually considered the safer move to stay out and just race you for her than to come early and co-clear trash, risking trains or bans etc. We could let you have it but we were mad zerging, and you (WI right?) had that one perma that hacked and fucked with us for 2 months and your GM was a forum warrior. Ego was at stake. Grief went wild.

Fast forward to pop. Foh disbanded and nobody has stepped up. Roi claimed 1st from them and doesn't look to be unseated. Now drama is the exception, I could lead pug raids doing jailor, and by god everyone was basically chums. What gave? Competition. The whole thing de-escalated to where people mostly did not sock, then to where races were even clean.

What happened on future tlps? Fast leveling and stupid long lockouts meant competition came early, despite vanilla and kunark never being designed to handle raid competition. That is big and needs more emphasis - pre velious eq does not have the raid content to support multiple guilds, barring instancing. Meanwhile the tactics escalated. On tlp round 2 you saw the 3rd I think it was guild stockpile sks to instagib, so the #1 did it and better. The other server apparently added warping too, shit like vs dead almost instantly on expac up. How do you race a guild with enough ht to instakill a mob all laying fd at its spawn point? You dont. You jt first or you raid something else (impossible in kunark) or you dont raid.

Funny thing about phinny is it felt WAY less toxic than past servera due to instancing. I joined AOS in kunark and we were far dirtier than that period being in ROI, but outside vp and epics? People cound enjoy 90% of it fine. Velious was better minus the sleeper thing, which in hindsight we should have woken it immediately and skipped the bs over ebayables and dudes who get raging chubbies over the concept of kerafyrm...

So what is going to happen on this server? The same shit as phinny but worse because boxing is more figured out. Fast leveling means more competition up top. Vp keys will be heinous. Motm means zerg or gtfo.

Meanwhile attitudes are the same as always. People who want to win will do what it takes to win, or fail. When more people define winning as current content raiding, competition will go up. When what it takes to win goes up, winners will roll with it. Do you need 12 mages to get a kill in? Someone else will bring 13. Mages nerfed? Here come 40 monks. This is hardly new. Its just the barrier of access due to competition has gone up, while the available tactics due to hardware, boxing, and lack of enforcement have gone up too.

If you don't like it, you can either stay in instances and avoid stuff like wiz epics and vp that are toxic. Or fail, or be more toxic, those are options too.

Tldr - there will always be traffic as long as there are too many drivers wanting to go to the same places. Avoid rush hour, stick to only back roads, or deal with it.

I remember it being all nice and friendly on Mith Marr, but that was so long ago my memory has decayed.

When we were done with an expansion, you could get in a lot of trouble going back to hit old raid mobs. We had a policy to leave those for other guilds.

Seems like we had a little bit of competition at Trakanon. I remember waiting outside at the little orb and watching naked people appear around it.

Yep, generational differences are weird. It blows my mind some of the stuff people raised with the internet (before they learned to socialize) say in the public areas of the internet.

And in the reverse of course, I make my own faux pas that make for more sense RL but online are a no bueno. [i.e. "Hey, I'm not really sure, but if you want to know I can buzz X about it..." - either you'll get a "Don't bother" or a "Yea, I'd like to know" response and you can cut out the middle man after a brief intro - comes across much differently relaying online though as has become a point of jokes here when I post at times (see a page back or so...)]

It does seem the super young generation is going back to more civilized though, probably since their parents know now to be wary of it's use, but a couple gens after mine treat the internet like the wild west in many ways. Seems mine was the last one that handled internet socialization with similar seriousness to RL socialization.

But this is getting way off the topic of EQ and into how the internet has it's own sociology.

Will Intel® HD Graphics 515 in a tablet run this game now? I was looking at a Samsung TabPro 12inch to box on.

There is a post on the EQ forums by someone who has the Surface Pro 4 with i5 and 8gb. HD graphics 520. He runs 2 instances of EQ on it. Augur, one of the devs has a surface pro and likes it.

Not sure how 515 stacks up to 520.

I 3-box TAKP emu server on a Surface Pro 4 Core M (fanless), probably with most setting all the way down. Keep in mind that since there's no touch interface you're going to have to use the flimsy tablet keyboards all the time. It works, but its not always the best experience. Using a USB or BT mouse instead of the tiny keyboard trackpad makes a big difference.