Flesh and Blood

CaughtCross said:

I cant seem to find any info about these golden packs. Is it really unknown what they contain?

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The golden packs are a box topper for 1 in 20 boxes. They contain two alternate art Spectral Shields (they look like the normal Mistveil Spectral Shield tokens, but can come in different colors like red or green) as well as a rainbow foil version of Enigma, New Moon.

However... there are exactly 100 of these packs in circulation that contain a marvel version of Enigma, New Moon instead. The marvel is always in English, regardless of which language box it comes in.

I've resolved to take Nuu to US Nationals. She's having a good weekend at Vegas right now but I think that as more people learn how to play against her, she won't do so well. Still, I'm pretty comfortable with her and I think with a little luck, I can do well.

I opened a lot of Part the Mistveil product because I needed the cards and the set is pretty hype. In four boxes, I got two gold packs. I'm up tremendously!

I got absolutely annihilated at nats. 0-4 in CC, 2-1 in draft. I was completely under prepared for CC this season compared to last season and it showed up in a big way. Gonna play side events the rest of the weekend because there's no way I'm registering for the Calling with this deck.

Lumi said:

So just saw this game the other day when I went to go play the Duskmourn MTG prerelease event. Saw some dudes playing this game and it looked pretty interesting. Read a bunch of stuff online about it and the reviews seem to be mostly positive but it seems to suffer very heavily from extremely high barrier to entry for competitive play. Also unlike other TCG's like say MTG for instance where you can compete relatively well against top tier decks with more budget decks, you apparently stand essentially zero chance whatsoever in this game with any sort of budget deck against top tier. Pretty big shame honestly as it seems like a very good concept. I've yet to play a single game yet and I personally don't care about the cost but it's hard to get into it knowing that the barrier to entry is so massive that there is almost zero chance this game does anything but slowly fade out of existence unless drastic changes are made.

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Some competitive decks are extremely expensive (Assassin in particular) but most are not and the "barrier to entry" is $40. Check out the Armory Deck product series that started this year: Kayo, Azalea, and the upcoming Dash I/O armory deck are all competitive at the weekly local level with no upgrades required. Spend a couple dollars into upgrades (for Kayo specifically, it's three cards that cost $5 each) and they're all easily competitive at the ProQuest and Road to Nationals levels. Here's a list of competitively viable decks that are relatively cheap to build:

• Brute (specifically Kayo)
• Mechanologist (specifically Dash I/O, probably the second cheapest of all of them and looking to be one of the top decks once her Armory Deck releases)
• Ranger (specifically Azalea, but Riptide is also very good and cheap to build)
• Wizard (specifically Kano, though he is the most difficult hero to pilot in the game which is probably why he's also the cheapest to build)
• Illusionist (both Prism and Enigma are relatively cheap to build. Enigma is looking to be one of the top decks of this competitive format and her most powerful card, Manifestations of Miragai, is $2 a copy)

This game has had a lot to bring its cost down over the last couple of years and there's only a few things that are actually expensive anymore: Enlightened Strike, Command and Conquer, Codex of Frailty, and Warmonger's Diplomacy are all extremely expensive main deck cards, but unless you're playing Assassin, none of these cards are necessary for a deck to be competitive (though in Azalea's case, Codex of Frailty certainly helps). For equipment, Fyendal's Spring Tunic and Crown of Providence are both $100 each, but those are generic equipment pieces that can be used by any class, so you only need one copy of each and you'll be good for any deck you build in the future that uses them. In the case of the classes I listed above, all of them have alternative equipment that are at least as powerful or better than these generic staples. For chest, Brute has Savage Sash (included in the Kayo armory deck), Mechanologist has Teklo Foundry Heart ($16), Ranger has Trench of Sunken Treasures ($12, though Azalea in particular would probably prefer Spring Tunic), Wizard has Spellfire Cloak ($0.50, obviously it only generates one resource as opposed to Spring Tunic being able to generate multiple, but Kano only needs one resource on his combo turn in order to win), and Illusionist has Vestige of Sol ($24) or the newly-released Calming Cloak ($1). For helms, Brute has Scowling Flesh Bag ($37), Mechanologist has Viziertronic Model 1 ($8), Ranger has Skullbone Crosswrap ($41) or New Horizon ($86, though this is really only used in niche non-meta builds), Wizard has Ragamuffin's Hat, Talismanic Lens, Plume of Evergrowth, and Flash of Brilliance (all of these are $0.10), Illusionist has Crown of Reflection ($0.50), or any of these decks can use the cheaper generic legendary helmet, Arcanite Skullcap ($42).

Lumi said:

Well, I specifically stated competitive play. As in, a deck capable of winning a tournament and I don't mean just beating your locals at some B&M. The barrier is sure as hell not 40$ it seems.

So basically like I said, you need to spend around 500$ minimum to compete with decks that have all of those staples(and I mean truly compete, not just replacing them with cheaper versions that lower your win chance by several percent). Every major tournament winning deck list I saw was at least around 1,000$ and some even going as high as 2,500. To me it's not that extreme since you can at least sell everything and get back close to what you put in but I can certainly see how it's intimidating to most and is quite bad for the health of the game in general seeing as how this is much higher than most other TCG's.

Honestly I heavily prefer limited formats anyway and I heard that it's quite solid in this game. Not quite as good as MTG but very up there according to most. That way the playing field is always completely even and the barrier to entry is identical for everyone. I'll have to try this out. Mostly been watching tutorials and class/hero breakdowns.

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I tried giving you a detailed answer but it seems like you've chosen to be retarded instead, acting like you know anything about this game when you don't even play it. I was not talking about replacing the staples "with cheaper versions that lower your win chance by several percent." The classes I listed straight up don't use those expensive cards because they don't function well with the class. Take the winning decklist of the New Zealand National Champion from July this year, for example. The Fabrary estimate says $570, but the deck is actually much cheaper than that. For example, Balance of Justice is no longer a meta consideration now that most of the "draw 2" cards have been banned. That shaves off $165 right there and brings the estimate to around $405. I placed top 32 in spring's Calling in Los Angeles and I didn't have Balance of Justice (and that was when it was at its highest relevancy, too).

Additionally, the price of top tier competitive decks is not "bad for the health of the game" because no new player is jumping straight into top-level competitive play. If you try, you will get dumpstered. This is not a game where you can buy the best deck and then count on your experience with MtG to carry you through to victory. You need to master the ability to make good moment-to-moment decisions, acquiring incremenetal advantages that outvalue your opponent and eventually allow you to win the game. Good players with inferior cards will flatten bad players with better cards consistently in FaB. Buy a $40 armory deck, play your weekly armories, top your regional ProQuest or Road to Nationals, and then you can start complaining about the price of top tier decks. You still have a long road to get there (if you even make it to begin with).

I don't have a defense for Assassin. The class is way too expensive and desperately in need of either reprints of the generics that it uses or classed cards that can be played instead of the generics (most of their class cards aren't very powerful which is why they are dependant on the generics in the first place).

That being said, of the 6 newest players I've had at my LGS, 2 of them have taken the $1k+ Assassin plunge. Clearly the price point isn't driving everyone away.

Anyways, if you're offended that I called you retarded because you were... well, being retarded, then please don't play FaB. We'd like to keep the median IQ at a respectable level.

Lumi said:

You said the barrier to entry was 40$ completely disregarding that I said competitive, not just to start playing the game in general so your reading comprehension is what's retarded.

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You're a moron.

Nirgon said:

Best TCG I played with fondest memories since MTG 4th ed.

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I thought you were PROMOTING this game?

The Brutes' RNG mechanic is more like a deckbuilding cost. Competitive Brute decks are so consistent now that they almost never miss off the top. But yeah, the class does have inherent RNG (especially with Scabskins), so I don't like it either. It's the same thing with non-stack Kano and, sometimes, Azalea (though she has so much top-of-deck manipulation that she can get something she wants most of the time). Levia has significantly less RNG than the other two Brutes, though she is at risk of killing herself if you're not careful about paying her unique deckbuilding "cost."

Overall, FaB tends to have lower variance due to drawing 4 cards every turn. If you stay away from Brutes, Kano, and a select few Ninja and Shadow Runeblade cards, you won't really need to worry about RNG.

Also keep in mind that, because of the pitch system, you can manipulate your deck in your favor for when you get to "second cycle." Today at locals I played a deck where I focused on stacking a massive combo into my deck during the first cycle, then drew and executed it during second cycle. If you can memorize your pitch, this can be a good strategy for certain decks.