Flu Outbreak

  • Guest, it's time once again for the massively important and exciting FoH Asshat Tournament!



    Go here and give us your nominations!
    Who's been the biggest Asshat in the last year? Give us your worst ones!

Aychamo BanBan

<Banned>
6,338
7,144
I have an off topic question - is there REALLY no such thing as a "stomach flu"? All cases of a stomach bug (diarrhea/vomiting etc) are viral in nature? A flu shot doesn't do anything for that then?

I got a flu shot this year for the first time in my entire life, because I was sick of getting a stomach bug around the holidays every. fucking. year. So far, so good (knocks on wood) - but that is probably due to my healthier eating and no more random sex/drunken weekends. Everyone that works for me has been sick this month though, and I've advised ALL of them to keep their asses at home. They can answer e-mails/update spreadsheets from their beds. People that go to work legitimately sick are fucking demented.
Young children can have some vomiting with influenza. Adults usually won't. The stomach bug you're thinking of is a viral gastroenteritis, but it's not an influenza, it's usually a norovirus or rotavirus. Vomiting & diarrhea aren't only caused by viruses, it could be bacterial or related to a number of other things. Just think about all the nasty shit that goes on when you have Christmas dinner at a relatives house. So many different meals, who knows when any of them were prepared, dozens of people have eaten out of the bowl with their unwashed fingers, while talking with sputum flying out of their mouth and landing on the food, touching god knows what else, etc. Yech!
 

Springbok

Karen
<Gold Donor>
9,481
14,046
Young children can have some vomiting with influenza. Adults usually won't. The stomach bug you're thinking of is a viral gastroenteritis, but it's not an influenza, it's usually a norovirus or rotavirus. Vomiting & diarrhea aren't only caused by viruses, it could be bacterial or related to a number of other things. Just think about all the nasty shit that goes on when you have Christmas dinner at a relatives house. So many different meals, who knows when any of them were prepared, dozens of people have eaten out of the bowl with their unwashed fingers, while talking with sputum flying out of their mouth and landing on the food, touching god knows what else, etc. Yech!
Somebody had told me that in passing last month and I thought it interesting/confusing. I ALWAYS say and hear others say they have the stomach "flu". Seems inappropriate now, haha.
 

Gravel

Mr. Poopybutthole
40,122
132,541
This.

Getting flu shots (and others like whooping cough) as an adult doesn't necessarily mean they're for you; rather, for your loved ones: children and elderly. It's called herd immunity; stop being an ass and get your damn vaccines
Uh, wouldn't it be easier to just cut out the middle man (yourself; other healthy adults) and just vaccinate those people? Oh, we do that? So why do I need it again?
 

Famm

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
11,041
794
I have a touch of a head flu right now, I took a bunch of vitamin C from the gas station but it isn't working I'm still stuffy. Should I go to the emergency room? I don't want to get a pandemic.
 

Obtenor_sl

shitlord
483
0
Cutlery;64770 said:
Right, how the fuck did any of us grow up with our parents not getting flu shots? How did our grandparents ever survive those trying birthdays and holidays with us? Boy, I had almost forgot all of those miserable times when we were young and everyone was dying of the flu.
You grew up and got flu and survived, hooray for you.

There are others who don't make it. Just because you DIDN'T die doesn't mean others won't. Some have suppressed immune systems (like infants, people who've had a recent transplant, elderly patients) I know a case in King County last year of an infant who died from whooping cough because her dad didn't get a vaccine and got infected by it.

Again, read what's herd immunity and how you are helping those who can't mount defenses to it survive.

Also, your parents didn't get shots and their parents didn't get shot, and many more people died because of it, or got polio. OMG I TURNED OUT FINE responses are stupid and you should know better.
 

niss_sl

shitlord
281
1
You should probably be careful about posting stuff from uptodate like that. I know that they allow you to e-mail an article to a 3rd party but I'm not sure what their stance is on copy pasting on an open message board.

Edit: You guys should probably just stop arguing with people about vaccines. Some just will never get the message and unfortunately their grandparents will probably die from it and then they will get a windfall and breed even more dumb shits. It's pretty dumb.

In other news, a guy refused to be put on crestor today even though his 10year risk was 30%+. He said he saw on internet and TV that lipitor and other statins actually make people die. I spent a minute explaining the benefits but he wouldn't budge. I didn't care much really. Just wrote "declined statin therapy" and moved on. You have to realize when efforts are futile.
 

Aychamo BanBan

<Banned>
6,338
7,144
You should probably be careful about posting stuff from uptodate like that. I know that they allow you to e-mail an article to a 3rd party but I'm not sure what their stance is on copy pasting on an open message board.

Edit: You guys should probably just stop arguing with people about vaccines. Some just will never get the message and unfortunately their grandparents will probably die from it and then they will get a windfall and breed even more dumb shits. It's pretty dumb.

In other news, a guy refused to be put on crestor today even though his 10year risk was 30%+. He said he saw on internet and TV that lipitor and other statins actually make people die. I spent a minute explaining the benefits but he wouldn't budge. I didn't care much really. Just wrote "declined statin therapy" and moved on. You have to realize when efforts are futile.
Yeah, the alt-med idiots are psychotic about statins. In my opinion, one of the top 5 drugs, and yet people refuse them sometimes. Besides, they are pretty much a "natural" substance (I believe they were isolated from fungus while looking for a new antibiotic). There is a fantastic 5 part article on the history of lipids and statin therapy. I'll post link when I'm back on my computer.
 

Agenor

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
2,472
6,416
Internet medicating is just out of control.

Have a buddy that just had his second child. His wife spends half the day reading every possible medical information sites out there, and treats them as gospel truth. Whole family switched to organic foods over this. She didn't want either kid circumcised after reading the handful of cases gone wrong, but he insisted and catches venom over the decision everyday.

The biggest thing though is she wont allow the kids around other people for the first year. Literally the first time I held their first child was the first weekend of his first birthday. Only saw pictures of him. Any Russian folk on here? She's claiming it's a "Russian thing", but have a feeling she just read some blurb about not exposing your kid to others that first year.

No surprise the first child freaks out over seeing anyone strange. Now I know your suppose to avoid others the first month, but after that they must be doing some damage not exposing the child around others for so long from a resistance point of view.
 

Blide_sl

shitlord
188
1
Uh, wouldn't it be easier to just cut out the middle man (yourself; other healthy adults) and just vaccinate those people? Oh, we do that? So why do I need it again?
It's for the people who can't safely receive the vaccine due to allergic reactions and whatnot.
 

riptorn

Lord Nagafen Raider
65
3
I had the flu. Put hydrogen peroxide in each ear for ten minutes lying on each side (read on the interwebs to do that). Next morning I felt pretty damn good. Not sure if this is coincidence or not.
 

niss_sl

shitlord
281
1
The internet is basically a problem for medicine. It gives people access to information, but it gives them no tools to understand and critically analyze that information. It's made primary care a huge time-consuming pain in the ass. And really a threat to public health. I've had women at 36 weeks tell me they refused to take antibiotics for chlamydia/gonorrhea because she's heard that antibiotics are bad for the baby. Every day I run into stupid shit all attributed to internet and inherent inability to comprehend basic shit.
 

Aychamo BanBan

<Banned>
6,338
7,144
The internet is basically a problem for medicine. It gives people access to information, but it gives them no tools to understand and critically analyze that information. It's made primary care a huge time-consuming pain in the ass. And really a threat to public health. I've had women at 36 weeks tell me they refused to take antibiotics for chlamydia/gonorrhea because she's heard that antibiotics are bad for the baby. Every day I run into stupid shit all attributed to internet and inherent inability to comprehend basic shit.
Yup. 100%. I had a 16 year old female argue with me about her weight gain. She was obese, her mother was obese. No exercise, poor diet, etc. She was convinced she was hypothyroid, and had read up on it on some quack website, and had her little script ready for me, and after I informed her that true hypothyroidism doesn't cause *that much* weight gain, she said "See, they said you would say that on the internet." Of course I checked her TSH, which was perfectly normal, and ended up sending her for diet and exercise counseling. But she was so adamant that she knew exactly what she was talking about because some moron on some message board told her about evil doctors and how we don't give out thyroid medicine or something.

Of course, on the opposite end of the spectrum from what niss was talking about are all the people who think they need antibiotics for everything. Sore throats are the worst, and I always go over the Centor criteria with the parents and explain why I will or will not prescribe antibiotics for each case.

Of course, Medicaid does not pay for the rapid strep test, and in an emergency room (yes, some parents bring their kid with a sore throat to the emergency room, and why wouldn't they, it's not like they have to pay for it, because you all are paying for it!), with these patients having no primary care doctor, if I'm not completely certain it's not a strep throat I usually end up giving antibiotics, because if I miss a strep throat and the kid gets rheumatic fever, etc, I'm sure I'll end up being sued. And I can't just do a throat culture, which Medicaid would pay for, because most of the time these patients give fake names and phone numbers because they have no intention of paying their bill, so if their culture popped positive I couldn't contact them.

You all would be shocked at the amount of free and wasteful care that is given in an emergency room for completely bullshit complaints because us doctors are scared to death of being sued by some retard. We (America) spends something like $10,000,000,000 (yes, billion) per year on chest pain admissions that are usually bullshit just because we are all scared about being burnt on those chest pains that are actually an acute coronary syndrome. I can be almost completely sure that their chest pain is musculoskeletal in nature, and their TIMI score is 1, but I still almost always admit them because if I send them home and they end up having a heart attack at home, I'm fucked. (Obviously people coming in with an acute heart attack are easy to identify and are immediately sent to cath.)

And lets not even mention the people who wait 8 hours in an ER because they don't want to pay for a $2 pregnancy test (if they only worked for minimum wage for those 8 hours...). And all the scum that "fell" yesterday, is in no pain, but wants xrays and needs to document a fall so they can start trying to sue a gas station or some other small business, or sue some driver which will ultimately affect all of our car insurance rates. The EMTALA act only requires that we provide emergency care, but in reality we provide so much free care because we are scared of turning away retarded complaints because they may ultimately be something legitimate.
 

BrutulTM

Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun.
<Silver Donator>
14,726
2,620
Haha! Sadly that's the majority of the population!!
Everyone in my family insists on taking "Airborne". I have told several of them about how it does nothing and even showed them stories about how the company got sued and had to take all the claims about it doing anything off of the packaging. Do they give a fuck? Not at all. They just look at me like "why are you telling me this?".

So what is "the flu"? My Mom always called the puking + diarrhea stomach bug the flu. What's the difference between the flu and a cold? I was coughing for nearly 6 weeks last fall. Was that the flu?

Does staying home from work really make that much difference? My colds/flu bugs tend to last 1-4 weeks. I'm sure as hell not staying home from work for all of that time and neither does anyone else, yet if someone hears me coughing at work I get the stink eye like I'm a terrible person for coming to work sick. Would staying home for 1-2 days really matter? I'm of the opinion that trying to avoid germs is a waste of effort and you're going to get sick anyway and giving someone shit for coming around you when they have the sniffles makes you a douche bag.

I don't get flu shots but it's not for any philosophical or pseudo-scientific reason, I'm just lazy.
 

BrutulTM

Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun.
<Silver Donator>
14,726
2,620
Haha! Sadly that's the majority of the population!!
Everyone in my family insists on taking "Airborne". I have told several of them about how it does nothing and even showed them stories about how the company got sued and had to take all the claims about it doing anything off of the packaging. Do they give a fuck? Not at all. They just look at me like "why are you telling me this?".

So what is "the flu"? My Mom always called the puking + diarrhea stomach bug the flu. What's the difference between the flu and a cold? I was coughing for nearly 6 weeks last fall. Was that the flu?

Does staying home from work really make that much difference? My colds/flu bugs tend to last 1-4 weeks. I'm sure as hell not staying home from work for all of that time and neither does anyone else, yet if someone hears me coughing at work I get the stink eye like I'm a terrible person for coming to work sick. Would staying home for 1-2 days really matter? I'm of the opinion that trying to avoid germs is a waste of effort and you're going to get sick anyway and giving someone shit for coming around you when they have the sniffles makes you a douche bag.

I don't get flu shots but it's not for any philosophical or pseudo-scientific reason, I'm just lazy.
 

niss_sl

shitlord
281
1
Yup. 100%. I had a 16 year old female argue with me about her weight gain. She was obese, her mother was obese. No exercise, poor diet, etc. She was convinced she was hypothyroid, and had read up on it on some quack website, and had her little script ready for me, and after I informed her that true hypothyroidism doesn't cause *that much* weight gain, she said "See, they said you would say that on the internet." Of course I checked her TSH, which was perfectly normal, and ended up sending her for diet and exercise counseling. But she was so adamant that she knew exactly what she was talking about because some moron on some message board told her about evil doctors and how we don't give out thyroid medicine or something.

Of course, on the opposite end of the spectrum from what niss was talking about are all the people who think they need antibiotics for everything. Sore throats are the worst, and I always go over the Centor criteria with the parents and explain why I will or will not prescribe antibiotics for each case.

Of course, Medicaid does not pay for the rapid strep test, and in an emergency room (yes, some parents bring their kid with a sore throat to the emergency room, and why wouldn't they, it's not like they have to pay for it, because you all are paying for it!), with these patients having no primary care doctor, if I'm not completely certain it's not a strep throat I usually end up giving antibiotics, because if I miss a strep throat and the kid gets rheumatic fever, etc, I'm sure I'll end up being sued. And I can't just do a throat culture, which Medicaid would pay for, because most of the time these patients give fake names and phone numbers because they have no intention of paying their bill, so if their culture popped positive I couldn't contact them.

You all would be shocked at the amount of free and wasteful care that is given in an emergency room for completely bullshit complaints because us doctors are scared to death of being sued by some retard. We (America) spends something like $10,000,000,000 (yes, billion) per year on chest pain admissions that are usually bullshit just because we are all scared about being burnt on those chest pains that are actually an acute coronary syndrome. I can be almost completely sure that their chest pain is musculoskeletal in nature, and their TIMI score is 1, but I still almost always admit them because if I send them home and they end up having a heart attack at home, I'm fucked. (Obviously people coming in with an acute heart attack are easy to identify and are immediately sent to cath.)

And lets not even mention the people who wait 8 hours in an ER because they don't want to pay for a $2 pregnancy test (if they only worked for minimum wage for those 8 hours...). And all the scum that "fell" yesterday, is in no pain, but wants xrays and needs to document a fall so they can start trying to sue a gas station or some other small business, or sue some driver which will ultimately affect all of our car insurance rates. The EMTALA act only requires that we provide emergency care, but in reality we provide so much free care because we are scared of turning away retarded complaints because they may ultimately be something legitimate.
Don't you have guidelines that save your ass? In Canada, we are only obligated to empirically treat if it without a doubt looks like GAS throat (ie. no cough, exudates, lymphadenopathy, fever) AND there may be an issue with follow-up or testing in a remote community. Even with those 4 cardinal symptoms, you still have only 44% likelyhood of actually having GAS pharyngitis. Everything else gets a swab and if it looks like viral (rhinorrhea, congestion, cough, etc) it doesn't even deserve a swab.
 

chaos

Buzzfeed Editor
17,324
4,839
There are others who don't make it. Just because you DIDN'T die doesn't mean others won't. Some have suppressed immune systems (like infants, people who've had a recent transplant, elderly patients) I know a case in King County last year of an infant who died from whooping cough because her dad didn't get a vaccine and got infected by it.
After my youngest daughter was born I was reading some article that was talking about a resurgence in certain diseases such as whooping cough specifically because people weren't getting vaccines/boosters anymore as they once were and this was leading to outbreaks, specifically in infants. Scary shit.
 

Aychamo BanBan

<Banned>
6,338
7,144
Everyone in my family insists on taking "Airborne". I have told several of them about how it does nothing and even showed them stories about how the company got sued and had to take all the claims about it doing anything off of the packaging. Do they give a fuck? Not at all. They just look at me like "why are you telling me this?".

So what is "the flu"? My Mom always called the puking + diarrhea stomach bug the flu. What's the difference between the flu and a cold? I was coughing for nearly 6 weeks last fall. Was that the flu?

Does staying home from work really make that much difference? My colds/flu bugs tend to last 1-4 weeks. I'm sure as hell not staying home from work for all of that time and neither does anyone else, yet if someone hears me coughing at work I get the stink eye like I'm a terrible person for coming to work sick. Would staying home for 1-2 days really matter? I'm of the opinion that trying to avoid germs is a waste of effort and you're going to get sick anyway and giving someone shit for coming around you when they have the sniffles makes you a douche bag.

I don't get flu shots but it's not for any philosophical or pseudo-scientific reason, I'm just lazy.
The flu is typically muscle aches, fatigue, fever, chills, sore throat, etc. You can have upper respiratory symptoms too. A cold is your common cold. I don't know why you coughed for 6 weeks last fall. If it followed a cold or a flu, it was most likely a viral bronchitis, but it could have been any number of things, such as allergic rhinitis->post nasal drip->cough, GERD, reactive airways, etc. You can actually begin spreading the influenza virus something like a day before you have symptoms and then for up to a week. Honestly yes, staying home would be great, because you can spread it through the air and on contaminated surfaces, and basically we're all dirty as shit. You may be right that trying to avoid germs is an exercise in futility. Wash your hands, don't touch your face.

One of my biggest moral conundrums was on an airplane. I had just ordered a much needed rum and diet coke, and this asshole next to me sneezed. I had to decide if his snot particles went into my drink. I made a wrong decision, and got a nasty little cold.