GoT - Is Over, Post Your Drogon Sightings

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Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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the way the books are being set up. it would take several more books to get all these people to end up in the same locations ending the same way as the TV show. they completely parted ways with book canon several seasons ago.
 
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I mean the fact that they had him fork over the ending and major plot points at the start of the project means they had a pretty good idea he wasn't gonna finish on time, possibly ever. he only has himself to blame for giving away the ending. for sure drogon melting down the iron throne, jon snow going into exile to preserve the peace, and bran ending up king were some of the ending points he gave them. the HOW of these things happened they made up themselves to a large degree, and why it came out so stupid.
 
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etchazz

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I mean the fact that they had him fork over the ending and major plot points at the start of the project means they had a pretty good idea he wasn't gonna finish on time, possibly ever. he only has himself to blame for giving away the ending. for sure drogon melting down the iron throne, jon snow going into exile to preserve the peace, and bran ending up king were some of the ending points he gave them. the HOW of these things happened they made up themselves to a large degree, and why it came out so stupid.
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I don't believe for a fucking second that any of this is how GRRM wanted the story to end. The fact is, he has no idea how he wants it to end, hence the reason he has written fuck all for almost 10 years. The shit that HBO churned out was their best guess at how maybe it should've ended, and as you can clearly tell in the latter seasons of this show, they had no talent once they got ahead of the books.
 
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jayrebb

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I don't see how you can say that when D&D demanded outlines for the ending and general plot points from GRRM, what, a few years before actually ending it.

In this case, you're saying GRRM handed them nothing or D&D went against GRRM. Neither of which I'm inclined to believe right now
 
Arbitrary

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With the books I thought Dany was a villain that was going to burn everything with a pet theory that he white walkers were less villains and more an elemental counterbalance to fire. I also thought the story would conclude with the birth of a new age of heroes as magic fully returns to the world. Watching the show I thought my Dany assessment was wrong but then nope, she goes crazy and burns everything at the end. I completely believe that was what GRRM's intended arc was for her. Unfortunately by believe that I am also stuck believing the general outline of the finale is accurate. A lot of people die and Jon goes back in to exile as the last dragon fucks off to wherever.

It makes me a whole hell of a lot less excited about the book ending unless GRRM changes it completely.
 
Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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jayrebb said:
I don't see how you can say that when D&D demanded outlines for the ending and general plot points from GRRM, what, a few years before actually ending it.

In this case, you're saying GRRM handed them nothing or D&D went against GRRM. Neither of which I'm inclined to believe right now
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GRRM handed them "something" he clearly told them about some stuff. what i dont believe for a second is that Daeny defeats King's Landing becomes Queen of Westeros and then decides she still wants to kill everyone. in the books she is going crazy already with her "gotta save all the innocent people" schtick, even going out and playing with plague ridden peasants. those are red flags. thats a Martin thing, there arent many real villains in his world. everyone has a logical motive for their actions, even the mad king wasnt as nonsensical as Dany is in the show. Martin wouldnt do that. she might end up killing everyone by an accident, say she loses a dragon and the other two or one goes on a rampage she cant stop it . Jon thinks she told them to burn KL because she is a crazy bitch and even though she denies it, he kills her anyway and fuck off back home beyond the Wall. there is no way however some of the other shit happens, like 3 eyed boy ending up king.
 
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I think it was all pre-planned. and people have seen Bran becoming king as a very strong possibility since the start. the only thing that seems really out of touch and kind a stupid is the way the Night King ended, way before Cersei and everything else. I think most believed the Night King would be the very last thing, even possibly without any resolve at the end of "a dream of spring", adding to the "bittersweet ending" GRRM hinted at all along.
 
Big Phoenix

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Seeing as how the writing of the show took a nose dive starting with S6 and then fell into a black hole with S7 Im gonna go with Martin gave them absolutely nothing to work with past the actual books. Once they got past the books the D&D could no longer paint by numbers and had to think for themselves and being woefully incapable of writing gave us S7 and 8.
 
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Sterling

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I mean he probably just gave them a pretty basic outline with very little real detail since it was pretty far in advance. And that's something that he could have certainly changed as time went on if something started working out in a way he didn't like. Dany goes wild and destroys most of King's Landing, Jon kills her, Jon goes back north and Bran becomes king. Something real basic like that. They then filled it with the dumb shit that we saw in the last 3-4 seasons.
 
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etchazz

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Big Phoenix said:
Seeing as how the writing of the show took a nose dive starting with S6 and then fell into a black hole with S7 Im gonna go with Martin gave them absolutely nothing to work with past the actual books. Once they got past the books the D&D could no longer paint by numbers and had to think for themselves and being woefully incapable of writing gave us S7 and 8.
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Exactly. People who think GRRM had any input on the final seasons of that show are full on retards, or never read any of the books. The show is one of the best shows ever on television through the first 5 seasons because they basically copied and pasted about 95% directly from the books. The reason the show nose dived is because it got ahead of the novels, and D&D had no more source material. Did GRRM scribble a few notes on some napkins and hand it to them? Probably. Did he give them an elaborate blueprint of how the story was to end? Not a fucking chance.
 
jayrebb

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I don't think he had any input into the endings, so much as he's complicit, and might be inclined to borrow ideas from D&D for his shitty books that nobody cares about.
 
Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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Sterling said:
I mean he probably just gave them a pretty basic outline with very little real detail since it was pretty far in advance. And that's something that he could have certainly changed as time went on if something started working out in a way he didn't like. Dany goes wild and destroys most of King's Landing, Jon kills her, Jon goes back north and Bran becomes king. Something real basic like that. They then filled it with the dumb shit that we saw in the last 3-4 seasons.
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i think he told them something even vaguer, R+L=J. dany and Jon hook up, dany ends up queen and jon kills her and leaves for the north. everything else is still up in the air. like, i dont believe even right now GRRM knows how his books will end, maybe at one time he did. "assholes on the internet" guessed where he was leading with his story and got butthurt when they made fun of it. so he decided to go in a different direction where he never intended and is stuck where he is now.
 
Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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jayrebb said:
the old gutpunch excuse
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if thats the case, then he really has thin skin. he wasnt writing a mystery, it was supposed to be medeival politics based off War Of The Roses with some magic and dragons thrown in because his niece said "dragons are cool". for some reason his story kept getting more and more bloated, it was only supposed to be 3 books, then it became five. now 7. even though its so big now that it really needs 8-10 to address all the shit he opened up. its a big mess.
 
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yeah these days, the combined power of the internet will very likely guess the ending of your story, especially if you attract enough of a following, very quickly. people even guessed the Hodor thing long before a dance with dragons. it's like the Lost series, people guessed the "mystery" within the first couple of episodes, and the writers said "no, that's totally not it" then put in a bunch of BS and in finally gave the ending people had guess long ago, but in a stupid convoluted way.
 
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Sterling

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Yeah, people will dissect shit to the point where anything you leave actual breadcrumbs to will be figured out. Like with Robert Jordan, people figured out who one of the major villains was disguised as and he ended up changing it later because of it.
 
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Mudcrush Durtfeet

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I'm sure GRRM has a decent idea of how things were supposed to end. It doesn't have anything to do with the Night King from the show - he was an invention for the show only (I guess to have a concrete villain).

What exactly he inteded as an ending I don't know, but it certainly isn't the garbage we saw in the show. Lol.
 
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zignor 4

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I recall an interview with GRRM that was given probably around S2 of the show or perhaps just before it. He clearly stated that he gave D&D the ending of the books, including who ends up on the Iron Throne, but there was no elaborate blueprint of how the story would get there (likely because he didn't have a fucking clue, either). Maybe they said "fuck it" and went their own way. Beyond that, Bran is going to be crowned at the end of the books, too George isn't ever going to finish the god damn things.
 
Jozu

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Game of Thrones was SO GOOD though when it was hitting. I still remember how hyped I was before the episode with Ser Arthur Dayne. It was just so well done, the sets, the acting, the plot. Truly the zenith of digital media entertainment.

And then D and D started to lose sight of what made the show successful in the first place.

The show honestly ended so badly that GRRM shouldnt even attempt to finish the books, as no one probably gives a fuck now anyway. Even if the book version ending is different, and better, it wont really matter. They just need to do a Mando type approach where they stop talking about GoT and hope the new series of prequels or whatever regains some good will and gets people interested again.
 
Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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Jozu said:
Game of Thrones was SO GOOD though when it was hitting. I still remember how hyped I was before the episode with Ser Arthur Dayne. It was just so well done, the sets, the acting, the plot. Truly the zenith of digital media entertainment.

And then D and D started to lose sight of what made the show successful in the first place.

The show honestly ended so badly that GRRM shouldnt even attempt to finish the books, as no one probably gives a fuck now anyway. Even if the book version ending is different, and better, it wont really matter. They just need to do a Mando type approach where they stop talking about GoT and hope the new series of prequels or whatever regains some good will and gets people interested again.
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it wont be the same, its like releasing EQ2 and expecting the same magic as EQ1 was for the first 2 expansions. these dunk & eggs arent even finished and you still have the same pressures for GRRM to finish it and he will tell everyone to fuck off. its a big mess.
 
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