Home buying thread

Very much agreed on real estate agents. Most are either total scum, dishonest, or just plain old incompetent. It"s a fucking racket as far as I am concerned. If you"re feeling ballsy, you can just skip the agent part if the seller"s agent is willing to let you, and then negotiate a much lower commission (in total, since the half going to the buyer"s agent obviously is no longer an issue).

I don"t know what it"s like in your area, but in Edmonton upwards of 30% of homes are now sold through commission free online services, like Comfree:Comfree Private Sales, For Sale By Owner, Private Sale, Homes for sale, Real Estate, Winnipeg, Calgary, Edmonton, Vancouver, Brandon, Medicine Hat, Lethbridge, Red Deer, Perth, Sydney, Australia - ComFree

I sold my first condo through them and had a great experience doing it. You might not get as much traffic as you would if you were listed on MLS through a licensed agent, but you can still get a good price if you know what you"re doing. It was fucking obnoxious though how many sales calls turned out to be fucking real estate agents trying to get me to list through them. One even had this big fancy presentation about why he"s better than a regular agent, but as cheap as the Comfree service, but when I read the fine print his fees were significantly higher than what a traditional agent would have charged (here I believe the standard was 7% on the first 100k, and then 3% after that, but it"s been coming down due to the competition with other services).

I can understand having a REA if you have a large house worth a lot of money. They DO know how to sell oil to an arab, there"s no question there. And on houses that large, they"re probably going to be willing to negotiate on the commission. But for buying/selling small houses or condos, I just don"t think they can justify their existence.

And the fact that their commissions are based as a percentage of the sale price is just bullshit, in my opinion. Real estate went up 50% one year in Edmonton, and had gone up 15-30% in the years before. Were Real Estate agents working 75-100% harder in the summer of 2007 than they were in the summer of 2004? Fuck no! They were working half as hard, because people were panic buying shit sight unseen, the agents were barely putting any time in to it themselves.

And especially given the internet and other methods of viewing listings, it"s no longer necessary to have an agent who has access to a secret database to scour through for your dream home using your criteria, you can do all that yourself. When I bought my first condo I had an agent, recommended to me by my parents, and they were fucking useless for finding decent places. I had given them all my criteria and they came up with two or three places I didn"t even have to go see to know I wasn"t interested. Eventually I just got on MLS.ca and found half a dozen places to look at myself. The only thing my agent did was call the listing agent and set up a time. They maybe put in a total of 8 hours in to helping me find my condo, and probably walked away with a $4,000 commission.

Ravvenn is right on. I recently bought a bank owned property, got a great deal on it but it does need some significant work, nothing like the place Tuco mentioned, mostly just a lot of little things plus updating the kitchen and bathrooms. Even with me being preapproved for well over the amount that this house was listed for, and having a VA loan, and all that business Indy Mac was still insistent that I get preapproved through them and even tried to get me to get the loan from them. Yeah that would have worked out great. Luckily my realtor was really great and helped me out a lot. I never got the stereotype of the shady lender, because mine was fine.

I have a couple of things that maybe you have already thought about and maybe not.

1) First time homebuyer programs. I bought my house 4 years ago and I live in Rochester, NY so I am sure there will be some differences. I ended up getting 1% off my mortgage because I was a first time homebuyer. Ended up with 4.75% thru HSBC. My buddy sells mortgages thru Chase and said he could not touch that rate. Also you said you work for a car manufacture. Well, large companies will often have deals with banks offering discounts. I would talk to your benefits department and see if this is the case with you. Everything helps and while some deals can?t be combined others can.

2) Home inspections. I still believe these are necessary as they are the professionals and will just see things that a layman to the building business will miss. That being said do you due diligence as well. When my home was inspected he found a few things that would need to be addressed nothing big as the house was build in 1989 there should not be any major problems. Then a day later he presented me with this real nice folder with everything documented and I remember being impressed. I figured I have nothing to worry about and bought the house. The first time I looked at the house I remember seeing an area in the living room ceiling where it looked "off", but figured if the inspector did not comment on it must not be a problem and I forgot to specifically point it out to him. Well after I bought the house the mark kept getting bigger and one freezing cold and rainy day I noticed a drip. Well I ripped the ceiling apart and there was a lot of water damage and it ended up that a small lip on the roof would funnel water behind the siding and would wash down the side of the house. My brother and me ended up taking the siding off the house and replacing the exterior plywood/insulation/various damaged structural pieces of the house and I also had to replace a window. I cant imagine how much this would have cost if I had not have done it myself. I probably still would have bought the house but maybe not it is hard to say. I at least could have used this to negotiate a lower price or have the seller fix it as part of the sale.

Also in the basement if you have blocks and most houses do. If you see and crystals on the blocks would may want to ask about any potential water problems.

And that"s how the professionals do it I believe. Most of the home inspection involves "minor" stuff.

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rofl.. Who the hell inspected the house you want to buy? that is so far from the truth it"s rediculous.. there"s a reason you have to get certified to inspect a house... it"s all about CODE.. every state has their own building code that has to be complied with then the county tacks their code on, then the city tacks theirs on, then the HOA tacks theirs on... The reason you get your home inspected before you buy it is to save you bigtime money in the event that something happens to your house.

for instance: I just got done building my fence. I built it 3 feet too close to the road (the city ordnance says I must build 15 feet from the center of the road, I went with 12 feet). Say the power goes out due to the lines snapping next to my house, if the city gets down there in the power truck and they have to drive over a section of my fence to repair the power line.. im fucked.. legally fucked. I have to repair my fence out of my own pocket and there"s nothng I can do about it. That was OK with me when I built the fence. 20 foot of fence section really only costs 2-3 hunred bucks.

Now say I want to sell my house... the guys that want to buy it, get some crackpot home inspector, or better yet waive the inspection and just up and buy the house because they"re stupid. Now three years later the power goes down and the city comes out and runs over their fence.. because they dont know about fence building and whatnot (nothing wrong with that at all) they get a fence company to come out and quote them to repair it.. Wha??? 5k?? to fix the entire south line of fence? Well fuck guess we dont have a choice.

That is TINY scale. Here"s another - your house inst wired to code, you get what you think is home insurance for fires. Oops guess what, due to some shitty assed wiring some douchebag like me did in your house, it burns to the ground and now the insurance company is telling you to get fucked.. So enjoy paying for that piece of property minus a livable house because you decided to scrimp on your inspection or even worse waive it.

Think about it..for 99% of Americans out there, the home is your #1 investment. Now wouldn"t you do the absolute MOST to protect that investment.. Think about it this way - it could be the difference between you retiring @ 60 with a home that"s payed off, or being forced to work to 70 because of a fucked mortgage payment. If I were you I would find an extremely thorough home inspector that works for a PROFESSIONAL company and FOLLOW HIM/HER around your house and ASK A SHITLOAD OF QUESTIONS.. That"s what I did, and Im handy as fuck - I built a fence, redid my roof, did some bathroom work.. I still followed that fucker around with a notepad and a pen during the inspection.

these are great posts tuco. all this research/self education will pay off in spades, i have no doubt. i definitely agree that real estate agents are superfluous if you know what you are doing.

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HOLY CHRIST..

Real Estate Agents are superfluous.. you guys are asking to get fucked in the ass and smile about it in court. How many homes have you bought and sold each? Ever wonder why there"s such a thing as a Real Estate agent??

THEY PROTECT YOUR ASS and make sure you dont fuck yourself, which if your ADHD like me you wouldn"t get past the 4th legal document they throw infront of you to sign when you go down to the title company. God Damn, I hope there arent kids reading this and taking it for truth..

Then a day later he presented me with this real nice folder with everything documented and I remember being impressed. I figured I have nothing to worry about and bought the house. The first time I looked at the house I remember seeing an area in the living room ceiling where it looked "off", but figured if the inspector did not comment on it must not be a problem and I forgot to specifically point it out to him. Well after I bought the house the mark kept getting bigger and one freezing cold and rainy day I noticed a drip. Well I ripped the ceiling apart and there was a lot of water damage and it ended up that a small lip on the roof would funnel water behind the siding and would wash down the side of the house

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I couldn"t agree more. If you"re home inspector gets out of his truck and he"s not wearing some kind of "get dirty" coveralls.. tell him to get the fuck out and find someone who"s ready to take pride in their job and do it right.


you know what"s totally fucked? the next guy that comes and looks at this dude"s house will instantly be able to tell that they replaced the siding and all that shit. That"s gonna spark immediate questions about the roof/siding and everything involved which may end up costing him 4-5k in repairs before he"s able to sell. >.<

^hey jackass, no one said you don"t still need to have a lawyer doing the legal/titles shit. I sold my first condo on my own without a real estate agent, and the buyer did not have one either. It was fucking easy. Outside of a couple hundred bucks for the legal fees and a dozen weekends spent having open houses, I saved myself 5-10k. By some estimates upwards of 30% of home sales in Edmonton are through various commission free services that don"t have real estate agents involved.

Eomer said:

^hey jackass, no one said you don"t still need to have a lawyer doing the legal/titles shit. I sold my first condo on my own without a real estate agent, and the buyer did not have one either. It was fucking easy. Outside of a couple hundred bucks for the legal fees and a dozen weekends spent having open houses, I saved myself 5-10k. By some estimates upwards of 30% of home sales in Edmonton are through various commission free services that don"t have real estate agents involved.

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Eomer... Condo"s and houses are two completely different animals... your CONDO was built by a contractor/company that had X amounts of rules they had to follow to even be able to lease/sell/rent it to a buyer.. Houses are completely different. If you think it"s cheaper to sell a house via a fucking lawyer then more power to you... good luck with that. Your standard lawyer knows as much about home law as I do about underwater basketweaving ( dick).. So when you want to join the rest of the population and get a real house.. have a fun time with that. When I get my plumbing fixed, you can bet your ass I dont call a carpenter..

Home inspectors aren"t required to know building codes nor do they typically sign off for the building being up to code.

For the house that I auctioned for, I was mostly interested in the land.

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wha?? what state do you live in?

Hey if your buying for the land and you can afford the 100k to build a dwelling on it, then more power to you.. but if your buying a house to live in and you want to eventually sell it some day.. you need to read a couple more books or actually TALK to some home inspectors that have been doing it for 20 years or so.

bouhhan said:

I have one piece of advice: pay for a professional to inspect any property you are seriously interested in.

i"ve been looking for a home in the new york city area for the last 3.5 years and haven"t pulled the trigger yet.

the closest i came was on a 750k townhouse that looked like a steal for the price. we did our first inspection (i"ve paid for seven of these now and they run @ $150 each here, and last @ 2 hrs) and the guy recommended a structural engineer to look at a tiny crack in the wall. we almost didn"t do the second inspection because it was pricey ($650 if i recall) but decided to do it because we were set on buying the house and wanted to negotiate with it based on whatever he found.

the structural engineer told us that this hairline crack was moving the wrong direction, and that basically the home would need to be torn down and rebuilt within the next 10 years due to a faulty (no pun intended) foundation.

needless to say, we didn"t buy the house.

it was a lesson in "you get what you pay for".

good luck!

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HEY LOOK.. REAL WORLD EXPERIENCE..... not some bullshit you or he or she read in a book..

gg"s

your CONDO was built by a contractor/company that had X amounts of rules they had to follow to even be able to lease/sell/rent it to a buyer..

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I build condos for a living, as a mechanical contractor. And let me tell you, there"s far more things that can turn around and bite you in the ass with a condo building than a typical house. Far more. I wouldn"t buy a unit in probably 90% of the buildings in this city.

If you think it"s cheaper to sell a house via a fucking lawyer then more power to you... good luck with that. Your standard lawyer knows as much about home law as I do about underwater basketweaving ( dick)..

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Maybe it works differently in the States, I don"t know, but my understanding is that real estate agents don"t do the legal shit anyway. They have a notary or lawyer do it for them. By going with a company like Comfree (Comfree Private Sales, For Sale By Owner, Private Sale, Homes for sale, Real Estate, Winnipeg, Calgary, Edmonton, Vancouver, Brandon, Medicine Hat, Lethbridge, Red Deer, Perth, Sydney, Australia - ComFree), you cut out the real estate agent and then have your own lawyer do the legal work, which again amounts to about $500-750. Compared to a set commission of anywhere from 3-7% of the value of your home.

So when you want to join the rest of the population and get a real house.. have a fun time with that.

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My condo is worth about 600k and fucking rules (just ask people here), so you can lick my asshole.

And by the way, you don"t need a real estate agent to have a home inspection done either. Again, what exactly does a real estate agent "protect" you from?

The guy who did my inspection was great. He spent a good 3 hours showing me everything he found and explaining to me what it meant in terms of real dollars, which I appreciated. And he was set up for me by my realtor, who couldn"t have been more helpful, as I mentioned before. The inspector did go over some code issues, for instance on my rear deck the header wasn"t notched in and that doesn"t meet current code, however it did when the house was built and it was a relatively simple fix. He did miss a slow leak in the basement toilet which caused me a little grief with a mold issue, but hell I missed it for the first 2 weeks of living here so I don"t exactly blame him for that. I consider it money well spent.

BUT, some background on me, I work in computers (networking) and am not really a "handy" person, at least not until I bought the house. So for me, I needed an inspector because I wouldn"t be able to recognize some issues that may seem trivial to some of you guys, like Eomer and his business experience or Tuco and his bumper-woodworking skills. If you aren"t a person who would need an inspector, well you probably are well aware of that.

The guy who did my inspection was great. He spent a good 3 hours showing me everything he found and explaining to me what it meant in terms of real dollars, which I appreciated. And he was set up for me by my realtor, who couldn"t have been more helpful, as I mentioned before. The inspector did go over some code issues, for instance on my rear deck the header wasn"t notched in and that doesn"t meet current code, however it did when the house was built and it was a relatively simple fix. He did miss a slow leak in the basement toilet which caused me a little grief with a mold issue, but hell I missed it for the first 2 weeks of living here so I don"t exactly blame him for that. I consider it money well spent.

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this.

Honestly, I think most people just like to have their hands held through the process. therefore we have REA"s. Also i think for some people, its easier to hire on agent vs. spend the time doing it themselves. Some people do not have the time either. I can certainly see where if you are relocating how an REA might be useful. However, with the internets most of the process can be done online now.

REA"s can be an asset, just like a good banker is. The problem is, this huge housing bubble put a lot of unqualified and/or unscrupulous people in the industry. We sold our house using an agent, and it was a very reputable local company that was basically family owned, and the main thing we paid for was good marketing skills and GREAT connections, all because we wanted to sell fast. However, just like shopping for a bank, you need to be careful on who you select to do that stuff, because I"ve seen the underbelly of both of these industries and it"s not pretty.

I would also say to avoid auctions all together, just because around here significant portion of the real estate goes up for auction. More than often than not, the auctioneer has "inside plants" there running up the bids. When Tuco was recounting the story, I would have had a slight suspicion that guy was there for a reason to make sure that house did not go for less than 90 grand. Even if there isn"t a plant, usually just like the small stuff being sold, people get stupid. It starts out low, but people get caught up in the action and just wave that flag to stay being the winner, and before you know it a 120k house just sold for 150k.