Home buying thread

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Picasso3

Silver Baronet of the Realm
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Lets run it at 5% using your tax, prop, and .52% pmi (this calc default nfi)

Starting in 2000 (for calc sake)
Balance on house as of
2005 $147,538.87 with 3.5% down putting paying all your shits at your price tag.
Total payout 87000

2005 $136k balance with 20% down
down payment of 34k and rent of 35k
69k total

You are a "homeowner" in the first case and a realHOMEOWNING MOTHERFUCKERin the second case because you owe 10k less in principal.

So a net saving of 28k.

But imagine this SHIT:
You"d been living in an equivalent house -- how much would that rent have been... seeing as how it costs 1400/mo bare minimum?

Would it have been worth it just to get your life started, assuming you could ever find someone to love you?

Would it have been worth it to not have to sleep in the same bed as your wife and 8 mulatto babbies?

Could you have spent 5 years in that house do it yourself improving it instead of going over to your dads house and working on his supra until he felt so guilty he gave it to you?

These questions highlight why you"re an asshole Cad.
Your situation is not the only situation and your goals are not the only goals.
 
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Izuldan_foh

shitlord
0
0
Picasso, don"t kid yourself.You don"t own your home until you pay it off. The less you put down on your home to begin with, the longer it"s going to take to pay off your home, and the more interest and overall cost that home is going to be at the end. That $300,000 home you bought you will have put in $500,000 at the end of your mortgage term. Cad makes some very valid points about putting 20% down.

If you can"t put 20% down, I don"t see what the problem with renting is, especially in today"s market, home"s don"t have much in the way of equity. Most of us started by renting, hell I wish I was renting now given the drop in the price of my home.

All these calculations don"t even include the additional costs of owning a home. Property tax. School tax. HOAs. Mello-Roos (for those of us lucky enough to live in California). Renovations (people spend way more on their own home than rentals).

Homeownership is a (crack) pipe dream society tries to sell people. It works great for banks, I"m thinking not so much for homeowners, especially in today"s economic climate.
 
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Picasso3

Silver Baronet of the Realm
11,333
5,322
I"m not kidding myself but owning 3% and paying 90% interest a payment still sounds a lot better that shitting off 110%.
Also, those latest figures do include all that bullshit.

It"s obviously a lot different around here (more rural) as there just arent the amount of apartments to rent. A lot of people that rent rent a house -- and no body is going to rent a house for less than it costs to own the thing, sweet jesus. Not to mention we"re all poor cousin fuckers so we the average house is probably 120k.

This whole debate got way too much into numbers and off my original point:
It"s ignorant to call someone ignorant for buying a house with 3.5% down.
 
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Izuldan_foh

shitlord
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0
And I would disagree. I wouldn"t say ignorant, it"s just financially unsound.

I mean, if 3.5% is OK, how about ZERO money down? Like all those people did who took out 2 mortgages, one principle, and a rider for the down payment? How do you think the majority of those people are doing now? What about those nice ARM loans that were so popular last decade that let people buy homes with (initial) low monthly payments?

If you can only afford to put down 3.5% on a home, to me that"s a big red flag saying you can"t afford the home. Again, I"m not sure why you even want to own a home.....is it an ego thing? Part of the "American Dream" our society keeps trying to sell you?

If you put so little down on your home, your long term equity on the home is severely affected by your interest payments. That"s IF you make it to the end of your mortgage. Chances are higher you sell your home before then, especially if you are under 40 years of age. So if you only plan on living in your home for like 5-10 years......why did you buy in the first place? Because you like making interest payments? You like paying property taxes? You like paying for home repairs? Oh yeah, thats right....."owning" a home makes you feel good, like you"ve accomplished something or you are getting ahead in life.

Nothing could be further from the truth. You don"t own shit. The bank owns you.
 
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Picasso3

Silver Baronet of the Realm
11,333
5,322
Our scenario isn"t debating whether its affordable.

Here"s the deal: Is it a genius move to rent for 4 years so you can save up enough cash to pay 20% down
OR
Should you just buy the house, eat PMI, and not pay rent

My point was there"s no INSANE difference like you"re living on plastic making the min payment every month.

The debate here wasn"t financial stability, can you afford it, etc i think anyone here talking that shit is probably smart enough to figure out what they can afford.

My point was do you put your ambitions on hold and live in shit for 5 years so you"re *probably* in a better equity position in 5 years.

I don"t need/want to get into the psychology of buying a house. I"ll only say i personally like being able to work on it and improve it to my liking.
 
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Izuldan_foh

shitlord
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No offense, but your reasoning is exactly why we had the housing meltdown. Too many people believing it"s better off getting into a home no matter what the cost versus doing the responsible thing and saving money.

And to answer your question, the better course is to rent for 4 years and save money, especially in this day and age. It will allow you to see how home prices are in your area, whether or not you are going to stick around in your area, and you will pay less interest in the long run. God forbid you lose your job, go on disability, or take a pay cut, then you have the freedom to change homes and move into something more affordable.

In your other scenario....you aren"t just eating PMI. All those other things I listed (taxes, repairs, etc) become your problem also. God forbid you lose your job, go on disability, or take a pay cut, because now you are stuck in a situation you can"t afford, and you may have to declare bankruptcy and destroy your credit. A lot of people can relate to this scenario today, and I bet a lot of them wish they never bought the home they had to walk away from.
 
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Picasso3

Silver Baronet of the Realm
11,333
5,322
God forbid you put 20% down on a home and you lose your job, go on disability, or take a pay cut, because now you are stuck in a situation you can"t afford.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:
In my scenario you have the same buying power, the same income, everything is THE SAME
EXCEPT

Instead of waiting 4 years to save the golden 20
You buy now with 3.5
 
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Ravvenn_sl

shitlord
14
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I work for a mortgage lender (not to be confused with a broker, which he does on occasion), so I have access to a lot of really useful tools and information. If any of you would like to compare numbers on renting vs owning, or knowing how much home you can really afford (with various rates, loan types, down payments, etc.) you"re welcome to ask here or send me a PM and I"ll get you quotes.

We cover 25 states, too, so I guess if you need help with an actual loan (or refinance - assuming you"re not insanely underwater with two retarded mortgages), send me a PM. I can get most quotes / pre-approvals with limited information. I"ve done several loans and refi"s for people here/in FoH, should you want a referral.

Either way, I"d be happy to help if anyone needs it.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:If you want an immediate reply, email me: Lori @ fohguild.org (remove spaces on either side of the @)
 
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Izuldan_foh

shitlord
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You conveniently ignored the scenario where you are just renting. Those were the 2 options you presented, correct? Renting for 4 years vs buying at 3.5%?

If you got injured two years from now, it would be easier to extricate yourself from the rental situation.

Now let"s say you got injured 5 years from now...it still won"t make a difference.

In the 3.5% situation, you"ve "owned" your home for 5 years, but you really dont own shit, the bank forecloses on you.

In the 20% situation, you"ve "owned" your home for 1 year, but you still don"t own shit, the bank forecloses on you.

There is no difference, except the delusion that you actually "owned" your home for a longer period of time, when in reality you were just a interest slave to your bank.
 
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Picasso3

Silver Baronet of the Realm
11,333
5,322
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/peJWxqEVXPY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
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Izuldan_foh

shitlord
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I wish I was fucking around. The truth is the housing crisis is due in large part to people who share your mentality regarding home ownership - people buying homes they can"t afford, just for the sake of "owning" a home.
 
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The Foler_sl

shitlord
120
1
Big P bro you know I support you in pretty much all your endeavors but Izuldan is right bro. My first house will be full cash and won"t be for about 5-8 years.

Side note on Izuldan"s ideology.. It always makes me lol irl when people gawk at other people owning BMW"s or other fancy toys thinking their rich. So many big hats so little cattle.
 
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Picasso3

Silver Baronet of the Realm
11,333
5,322
Izuldan said:
I wish I was fucking around. The truth is the housing crisis is due in large part to people who share your mentality regarding home ownership - people buying homes they can"t afford, just for the sake of "owning" a home.
Click to expand...
In my scenario you have the same buying power, the same income, everything is THE SAME
EXCEPT

Instead of waiting years to save the golden 20
You buy now with 3.5.

You can afford to put 20% down if you choose to wait years to accrue it.
 
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Thief_foh

shitlord
0
0
Why is renting not ok again? How is renting is "living like shit"? What about taxes, closing cost, maintenance? That adds up quick in your monthly payments.

My point was do you put your ambitions on hold and live in shit for 5 years so you"re *probably* in a better equity position in 5 years.
Click to expand...
The problem is, most people won"t be in a better position for two reasons
1) They couldn"t afford it in the first place
2) They bought a house that is more expensive just because they could.

Result: housing meltdown
 
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Aetos_foh

shitlord
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Thief said:
Why is renting not ok again? How is renting is "living like shit"? What about taxes, closing cost, maintenance? That adds up quick in your monthly payments.
Click to expand...
Not that I think there"s anything wrong with renting, but do you really think those costs aren"t included in rent?
 
Cad

Cad

scientia potentia est
<Bronze Donator>
25,847
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Aetos said:
Not that I think there"s anything wrong with renting, but do you really think those costs aren"t included in rent?
Click to expand...
Well closing costs usually aren"t an issue for commercial owners since they own properties long term, maintenance is contracted at commercial large-scale rates and apartment taxes aren"t figured the same way as house taxes. You"d be surprised how low apartment complex taxes are.

Those costs are undoubtedly higher per living unit for houses people own (and transfer every 4-6 years) than for commercial landlords.
 
Cad

Cad

scientia potentia est
<Bronze Donator>
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Picasso said:
So a net saving of 28k.
Click to expand...
28k at 24 years old when you make $60k/yr isn"t peanuts. I"d say that"s highly significant.

Picasso said:
But imagine this SHIT:
You"d been living in an equivalent house -- how much would that rent have been... seeing as how it costs 1400/mo bare minimum?

Would it have been worth it just to get your life started, assuming you could ever find someone to love you?
Click to expand...
Of course not, because I moved 4 times in that 5 years. I moved from Dallas to Austin to Arlington and had 2 different apartments in Austin. It would have raped me financially to have bought a house as you suggest.

Picasso said:
Would it have been worth it to not have to sleep in the same bed as your wife and 8 mulatto babbies?
Click to expand...
I didn"t get married until 26, so what would have been the point in buying a house to live alone in? Oh right... none.

Picasso said:
Could you have spent 5 years in that house do it yourself improving it instead of going over to your dads house and working on his supra until he felt so guilty he gave it to you?
Click to expand...
Except I was working 50 hours a week and taking 14-15 hours a semester so I spent about 6 hours a night at home, and 0 during the day; on weekends I was at the shop working on cars or at the racetrack. I don"t know why you have to inject these little personal attacks, always with the flavor of help from my parents - what, you think it"s impossible to succeed without help from parents? Your failures are not my failures.

Picasso said:
These questions highlight why you"re an asshole Cad.
Your situation is not the only situation and your goals are not the only goals.
Click to expand...
I"m 35 and I"m financially independent. I was able to create a company and sell it, work as a consultant until it bored me, go to law school, and now work for one of the best IP firms in Dallas. I own a home that isn"t 97% mortgaged in the most exclusive neighborhood in Dallas. I"m sorry that my success without the help of my parents offends you. I"ll try to avoid giving advice based on my experience in homebuying in the motherfucking home buying thread.

Get back to your trailer park and get some sleep, you"re going to need it so that you can get up early and get back to your hourly job where you make $10/hr to afford to make your monthly payments.
 
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Aetos_foh

shitlord
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Cad said:
Well closing costs usually aren"t an issue for commercial owners since they own properties long term, maintenance is contracted at commercial large-scale rates and apartment taxes aren"t figured the same way as house taxes. You"d be surprised how low apartment complex taxes are.

Those costs are undoubtedly higher per living unit for houses people own (and transfer every 4-6 years) than for commercial landlords.
Click to expand...
Assuming you live in an apartment building, which is not always the case when you rent.
 
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Radmonovich_foh

shitlord
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Cad said:
Well closing costs usually aren"t an issue for commercial owners since they own properties long term, maintenance is contracted at commercial large-scale rates and apartment taxes aren"t figured the same way as house taxes. You"d be surprised how low apartment complex taxes are.

Those costs are undoubtedly higher per living unit for houses people own (and transfer every 4-6 years) than for commercial landlords.
Click to expand...
Commercial properties have a much higher property tax rate and thus a higher rent cost in MA. Closing costs are included in the value of the property when purchased, of which 80% is depreciated and taken over 39 YEARS. Talk abuot a shitty deal for the buyer. Maintenance is also just another expense which poeple dont realize.

Apartment/condo"s might have lower taxes, but they have condo fees which are steep as shit(which only a portion is deductible IF you itemize.)
 
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