NBA 2015 Playoffs Thread

Slaythe

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The media will push whatever clickbait story is most convenient for them at any given time. When the Warriors win this finals the rhetoric around LeBron won't be "he did all he could" or "GS was just a better team" it will be "LeBron failed." There is more drama there. Everyone will talk about the finals he's made it to but lost...again...like he is solely responsible for the outcome of his team.
 

Ambiturner

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Disagree with that. The media will make it out that he made a valiant effort to drag a bunch of nobodies to a title. The only time he ever got crap for losing in the finals was when he no showed against the Mavs.

He'll get a lot of crap from people like me who can't stand him and his super fans, but very little of it will come from the media
 

Djay

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Iguodala for MVP suggestion is LOL. Take either Curry or Lebron off their team, and the other wins easily. Iggy is a nice complementary player, but he's not doing anything MVP-caliber.
Take Iggy off Golden State and LeBron is shooting 55% instead of 40%. Nobody else has been able to slow down LeBron in this series. No, GS isn't winning this series without Curry, but they're not winning it without Iggy either.

And the media does oscillate between LeBron is a choke artist and LeBron is the GOAT depending on the narrative they need to push. I've had him in the Top 4 since he developed a jumpshot a couple years ago and a small sample size won't change that.
 

popsicledeath

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Right now one of the biggest talking points is whether Lebron should win MVP even if the Cavs lose. Yeah, they talk about it because it's a divisive point people are interested in, but that also means for it to be a good talking point a portion of sports media has to agree he should. People started talking about it when he'd won a couple games, now, even after losing pretty badly a couple times it's actually gaining traction that he could/should win MVP for losing. The more he loses the more it just shows, what, his team sucks and he has to do it all, so that makes him more valuable, so he's increasingly inclined to win the MVP?!

Fuck that.

Hell, I heard Stephen A talking about how he's pretty sure Lebron would decline the MVP trophy if he won it and lost the series, because he's matured to the point he would maybe not take the trophy. And he wasn't saying it with criticism or derision, but as a point of praise. Are you fucking kidding me? They're finding a way to praise Lebron for not taking the MVP trophy if he hypothetically won it while losing the Championship.

Would we even need to talk about this with MJ or Bird? They'd never talk to that member of the media again if you even hinted there was a chance they'd consider taking a trophy in a losing effort. And instead of talking about how they aren't worried because they're the greatest players in the world, they'd be out there playing their asses off, doing whatever it took to win, including actually developing their teams over the course of the year instead of just being satisfied with hero balling with 2 other stars. But hey, worked for Lebron once, so why bother developing an actual team, especially when your other stars go down, and you're fucking LOSING the Finals, and still being praised like you're a hero for losing on a shitty team you did nothing to help make better, just expected people to show up and play good enough for you to take credit.
 

Foggy

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Disagree with that. The media will make it out that he made a valiant effort to drag a bunch of nobodies to a title. The only time he ever got crap for losing in the finals was when he no showed against the Mavs.

He'll get a lot of crap from people like me who can't stand him and his super fans, but very little of it will come from the media
Yeah, he is basically criticism proof from the media with 2 rings. The only anti-LeBron stories for the foreseeable future are "his skills are slipping" stories.
 

zzeris

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I don't know of anything Lebron could have done to make this team better. He's the reason Love chose to join and definitely is the reason they are here today. Blatt is a shitty coach and no one could have predicted Love and Irving going down late. This was a team that could have easily made this finals much better and it's not been a bad finals even with scrubs. It's not the job of a player to acquire talent. Bird didn't do it and neither did Jordan. They didn't win finals with scrubs either.

Lebron may be an arrogant prick but he's earned his accolades. I don't think he should be the MVP but no one on GS has earned it either yet. Curry with one dominant performance by game 6. Klay one dominant performance. Can we give it to Kerr at this point, maybe?

Edit- Kerr comment is obvious sarcasm but with a team that has so many great options where one can dominate one game and others dominate other games...who do you pick at this point?
 

Blitz

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Starting to get Finals fatigue extremely bad. ESPN's media machine just murders you with star fatigue, over and over again. They will do anything to position the current face of the NBA as the next Jordan/Bird/Magic. This series hasn't done it for me. On one hand you have a Golden State team which has been underwhelming, and a Irving/Love-Super 6th Man less Cavs. Really, really ready for Free Agency to get going July 1st. What are some of y'alls Free Agency/Draft wishes for your teams? Mavs fan, holding out hope that one of LMA or DJ find their ways home.

Btw, Iggy would be my MVP if GS wins. But defense isn't sexy, even if you're holding the best player in the game to -40% shooting. Steph is ultra streaky, his final numbers bloat a little when he finally gets hot late in the game.
 

Blitz

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Thought Doug Gottlieb was spot on with his criticism of LeBron in this 60 second audio clip. When you're vying to be Top 2-10 All-Time, you get held to different standards.
http://cbsloc.al/1JL5Hux

3 Criticisms
- Lack of consistent jumper
- Trouble finding extra gear late in games
- Propensity to over exaggerate "flops"
 

DickTrickle

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On a non Finals related note, Lance Stephenson was traded for Barnes/Hawes. I really have a hard time figuring out this trade for the Clippers. Lance was awful last season and even if he regained his last year in Indiana form, it feels like he would not really be adding what the Clippers need. They already have two very good playmakers in Paul and Griffin and even in his best year Lance was a mediocre shooter. Defensively he can be a good force and he's obviously much younger than Barnes, but it still doesn't seem like a great fit. Thoughts from those who follow the Clippers more closely?
 

Furry

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I dont understand people who think lbj is the best basketball player ever. What this series has taught me is that brony is simply too big a pussy to live up to the true basketball greats. He gets sick, he gets cramps, he gets dehydrated. Gotta sell them fouls, so he flops his head into shit and can't play right any more. The only way this shit could get more embarrassing is if he showed his cock on national tv.
 

Slaythe

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I dont understand people who think lbj is the best basketball player ever. What this series has taught me is that brony is simply too big a pussy to live up to the true basketball greats. He gets sick, he gets cramps, he gets dehydrated. Gotta sell them fouls, so he flops his head into shit and can't play right any more. The only way this shit could get more embarrassing is if he showed his cock on national tv.
He's not the best ever. But he is in the top 5.
 

Slaythe

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On a non Finals related note, Lance Stephenson was traded for Barnes/Hawes. I really have a hard time figuring out this trade for the Clippers. Lance was awful last season and even if he regained his last year in Indiana form, it feels like he would not really be adding what the Clippers need. They already have two very good playmakers in Paul and Griffin and even in his best year Lance was a mediocre shooter. Defensively he can be a good force and he's obviously much younger than Barnes, but it still doesn't seem like a great fit. Thoughts from those who follow the Clippers more closely?
Barnes is old and Doc won't play Hawes and you just have to hope that Lance's last year in Indiana is the real him, but Clippers win this deal on talent for sure.

Agree that it's a pretty awful fit though. It either moves Reddick to the bench or gives him less playtime, which makes little sense considering how good he has been for them. If Doc gave Hawes playtime I would say this makes their bench even worse, but for whatever reason he doesn't.
 

Gilgamel

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I like it for LAC. Hawes was dogshit, Barnes is ancient, and they weren't going to find a player of Lance's caliber, even if he is just a lottery ticket with his mental issues. Don't get it for Charlotte, they have a ton of bigs.
 

Djay

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From Charlotte's side, Lance was a cancer that needed to be excised. They can repackage Hawes or their other big men if needed in a separate trade...they really just didn't want Lance there anymore. Clippers are banking on him bouncing back when the doesn't have to be "the man" and I think he will.
 

popsicledeath

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Btw, Iggy would be my MVP if GS wins. But defense isn't sexy, even if you're holding the best player in the game to -40% shooting.
Uhh, I'm not sure how, on one hand, people are arguing Lebron's performance is so legendary he could/should win the MVP even on a losing team, and then on the other side you argue the guy largely defending and giving up that legendary performance also deserves the MVP. Lebron is amazing, but could have been more amazing, so the guy keeping him from being even more amazing deserves the MVP?

One of the two sides of that argument have to be flat out bad.
 

popsicledeath

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I don't know of anything Lebron could have done to make this team better. He's the reason Love chose to join and definitely is the reason they are here today. Blatt is a shitty coach and no one could have predicted Love and Irving going down late. This was a team that could have easily made this finals much better and it's not been a bad finals even with scrubs. It's not the job of a player to acquire talent. Bird didn't do it and neither did Jordan. They didn't win finals with scrubs either.

Lebron may be an arrogant prick but he's earned his accolades. I don't think he should be the MVP but no one on GS has earned it either yet. Curry with one dominant performance by game 6. Klay one dominant performance. Can we give it to Kerr at this point, maybe?

Edit- Kerr comment is obvious sarcasm but with a team that has so many great options where one can dominate one game and others dominate other games...who do you pick at this point?
MJ, Magic, Bird, hell even Kobe built teams, built cultures, worked to perfect chemistry and teamwork, not only demanded a lot from team mates but also helped them achieve it. The only thing Lebron has ever built is a pedestal for himself.

He built shit all in Cleavland where he pretty much did have the power of acquiring talent and was the man from day one, yet couldn't get shit done. He was basically responsible for the Miami big three situation, and even then, even winning championships, wasn't considered the heart and soul of those teams and people talked about him like he just showed up like a doctor after the rest of the team has prepped the OR (which is great for doctors, but not for team sports).

And now he had all season to help build a winning team. Sure, he posts pictures on Instagram and is amazing on the floor. Behinds the scenes, though? Hell, even on dismal losing teams there were still reports of Kobe going ape shit on those terrible Laker teams trying to help them become the best they can be. I've never, ever, come close to hearing anything about Lebron other than him showing up and because he's always been the best player on the court, simply expecting him to win.

The Cavs could have been building a team, creating chemistry, finding schemes, etc. Instead, the two of the big three go down and nobody is there ready to step up. Hell, Tristan Thompson and Delly are certainly trying, but it looks like here in the playoffs was the first time Lebron had ever even played with those dudes. Mozgof? JR Smith? There is talent and passion and willingness on that team, it's just nobody thought to actually do anything other than let the big three show up, and even that wasn't working great, and then when they started getting injured, oops, the team that's been neglected and treated like extras instead of understudies aren't ready for the big show. Who would have thought!

We say Lebron has simply been cursed with shitty teams. I say he doesn't do much to make teams great other than being great himself and being confused why other players aren't inherently prepared to help Lebron add to his legacy.
 

Blitz

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That is true about the Iggy case. Klay played great early, but the obvious will probably be Steph.

I like the Clippers picking up Stephenson, you're at a point where its now or never, and DJ may be on his way out (which may not be terrible for salary cap & depth reasons). The Hawes move was one I couldn't wrap my head around originally, that same type of move that came back and fucked the Clippers.

LBJ is a monster, and he is certainly vying for the Top 5 group, but his shot selection and motor late in games is head scratching.

Ps. The LBJ for MVP thing just screams fucking desperation. It's akin to, "Guys LeBron was great this series, and we want you guys to remember that". We all know how great LeBron has been this series, but MVP to the losing team is a disgrace due to the way its always been handled. Shit, its fucking hard enough to give the MVP in the regular season to the guy who had the best season, instead of the player who was best on the best team, lets not start now.